Samsung 27" HDTV looks horrible! Help me out?!

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by Adam Bluhm, Oct 20, 2002.

  1. Adam Bluhm

    Adam Bluhm Supporting Actor

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    Okay, folks. I finally completed my tv stand and picked up a Samsung model 2796 at Best Buy today. I got home, hooked it up and tried to calibrate it. Well, the picture looked so horrible I used calibration setting that people posted here (numbers for brightness, contrast, etc). Well, if you've ever played in paint shop pro, the picture looks like a HORRIBLE jpg file. There are little jagged edges and artifacts galore! I'm serious. This is just attrocious.

    I've hooked up a PS2 via composite cable and thought it was just the connection. I then hooked up the PS2 via component and it looked just as bad. I then robbed a Panasonic RV-30 from a Quazar 27" from the downstairs. I threw on some AR Pro Series component cables and it helped not one bit!

    Also, the right speaker on the tv appears not to be working, but I was willing to let that slide if the tv looked fine. Is this tv just a bad apple or is there something I can do before having to return it?!

    Thanks for any help. Much appreciated.
     
  2. Jack Briggs

    Jack Briggs Executive Producer

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    You were willing to let a nonworking speaker slide?

    Any defect warrants an immediate replacement.

    As for the set itself, did you not audition one? What sorts of settings are you using? What does the picture look like on various video sources (and I don't mean gaming consoles)? How does cable look? OTA? DVD?
     
  3. Adam Bluhm

    Adam Bluhm Supporting Actor

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    Okay, I'll give an update and explain more. Basically, I would've bought a set if it had no speakers at all. [​IMG] I was questioning bringing it back for that. Also, there is no cable to hook it up to. It will be for DVD playback and gaming only.
    Secondly, I'm really confused now. The default 'DVD' screen on my Panasonic player looks beyond horrible. I'm comparing this to the quality on a standard 27" Quazar television. There's no comparison. The old Quazar looks much better, even with a little old composite cable.
    Anyway, the reason I'm confused is because the 'Lilo and Stitch' preview looks horrible on the Monsters Inc DVD. However, once I get into the Monsters Inc movie, it looks MUCH better.. pretty excellent, actually. The same goes for Billy Madison (one of three DVD's I've tried now). I can notice the picture "bouncing" up and down during the credits, and it's somewhat noticeable during the movie. However, it looks fine. Then, I grabbed my Sleepy Hollow DVD and began playback. That looks terrible. We're back into the same old rough edges category. It doesn't hold a candle to the 27" Quazar (with lesser vid cables!) played through the same DVD player.
    What's OTA? [​IMG]
    Also, I've gone to audition sets at Best Buy and Sears. It's not worth viewing ANY set there on their spliced signals, and everytime I request a DVD player be hooked up, either "no one is around" to do it, the TV is "not in stock," or "there are no cables to do it." Basically, I'm left to go by reviews here and needed a 27" set, but wanted progressive playback while I'm at it.
    I'll attach a picture. Sorry for the lack of quality, but at the same time this picture REALLY does do the set justice. It really looks worse than this pic reveals.
    What sort of settings am I using? I don't know exactly what you are asking there, but if you want my contrast, color, etc settings, I can give them to you. Like I said above, this is a Panasonic DVD player in which I've had wonderful success with in the past with other TV's. It is hooked through AR Pro component cables and I've tried both component inputs on the tv.
    I hope I don't sound like I'm going overboard, but I really didn't expect the tv to look this bad. I've read about tv's looking bad and not playing crisp, but I'm severly dissapointed and frustrated.
    [​IMG]
    [picture is of the 'dvd' logo when no disc is in the player. the rough color you see inside of the word looks much worse in person. on the quazar television, there is no sign of rough textures.]
     
  4. Adam Bluhm

    Adam Bluhm Supporting Actor

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    Do interlaced pictures look bad in general on HDTV's? So far that is all I've tried.
     
  5. Adam Bluhm

    Adam Bluhm Supporting Actor

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    Well, she's all packaged up and ready to go back tomorrow.

    I just have to ask once again. If I'm playing an interlaced picture on this particular set (or ANY HD set), it shouldn't give back quality, should it? I mean, an old Quazar (panasonic) set gave a much better picture. Do some HD sets have trouble receiving an interlaced picture? If I'll be doing some interlaced gaming with my PS2, should I get a non-HD set?

    Guys, I really appreciate any answers.
     
  6. Evan Hartnett

    Evan Hartnett Stunt Coordinator

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    It sounds like you got a bad set, I'd try another one of the same model. The fact that the speakers don't work says something is really wrong with it, if there's something wrong with the speakers there could defnitely be other problems.
     
  7. Jack Briggs

    Jack Briggs Executive Producer

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    Exchange it for another of the same model. Even if you're feeding it an interlaced signal from a DVD player, the internal line doubler would render an image far smoother than your old Quasar.

    As Evan notes, if the one of the speakers is not working, something else surely has occurred. The set was probably damaged during shipping. It could have been dropped anywhere from the receiving dock to the warehouse to the dealer.

    Yes, out of the box this set should look better than your present TV.
     
  8. Adam Bluhm

    Adam Bluhm Supporting Actor

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    Okay. Thank you both for your replies. I was planning on getting the same set. Best Buy did make me aware that I bought their last set and it took the fella a while to find it because "it was not in the usual spot where they keep the set." Hmm.. could it have been a previously returned model?

    Sears has the same model and is less than a minute away. I may go as far as bringing a DVD player, or at least calling ahead and asking to view dvd playback over the set.

    Thanks again, fellas. Much appreciated.
     
  9. JasonRH

    JasonRH Second Unit

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    Adam,
    Let us know how the next set works out for you. I'm planning on picking up the same set in a week or two so I'd like to get an update from you before I buy the set. Thanks.
     
  10. chung_sotheby

    chung_sotheby Supporting Actor

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    Adam, I just picked up the same set, and while I had to spend about 4 hours setting up everything, it looks tremendous now. It took me a while to get all the picture, mode and zoom settings on the tv right, then I had to set up my dvd player (Panasonic RP91) for progressive output, which is kind of a pain in the ass in itself with the crappy panasonic menus. Make sure of a couple things:
    -DVD player is actualy in progressive mode (the images will be really choppy and blurry if the DVD player is not set up for progressive)
    -TV is not in zoom mode. If the DVD logo picture is the actual shape and size of the image on your screen, then it looks like maybe the Samsung is in zoom mode
    -If all else fails, return the Samsung and shop elsewhere. The Samsung 2796 is a reasonably easy model to buy, as a lot of stores carry it. I was going to buy one from BestBuy, but after an hour of waiting and a salesperson who couldnt answer even the most simple questions, I decided to shop elsewhere, and I ended up getting the TV for $50 less than BestBuy. How you like dem apples, BestBuy?
     
  11. RoyB

    RoyB Extra

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    Adam,

    My girlfriend just bought a 32" Samsung HDTV-ready set at Costco and she seems to be suffering the same grief you are going through. The picture looks horrible compared to my old 31" direct-view JVC set. She has yet to "tweak" it as others have suggested so she hasn't come to the point of returning it yet. I look forward to hearing how it goes with your second set...please keep track of the adjustments that you make so we can all benefit.

    Thanks, Roy
     
  12. Adam Bluhm

    Adam Bluhm Supporting Actor

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    Okay. I'm about to load up the tv in the Suburban and carry along my own dvd player. I have no progressive player (at the moment) but don't see why an interlaced picture would look so bad on this set. I'll be shopping at Sears today. I've already called them and have confirmed being able to hook up my own player. [​IMG]
    Also, I've calibrated it with my own disc and have thrown calibration numbers from other discs. As I said above, I've used the composite connection on the side as well as both component inputs at the rear. I've used two mediums of playback, neither looking good at all. I've gone through all the zoom and compression modes. Nothing has helped. I can tell you this, if I see the same picture quality on the floor model at Sears, I'll be getting another brand.. and maybe not a 27" HD set at all. As far as I know, Phillips is the only other manuf. that carries a 27" set (at a reasonable price).
    But anyway......
     
  13. Mark Fontana

    Mark Fontana Stunt Coordinator

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    Adam,

    I have had this TV for about 2 weeks (picked it up for $599 at a recent Sears promotion).

    I have not had the problems you mention. I am feeding the TV 480p component from a Skyworth DVD player and have a SIR-T165 HD tuner on order.

    I have the picture mode set to Custom with all noise reduction disabled. I can check my settings tonight and post them if you're interested (though it sounds like you're beyond that point...)

    The logo screen of a DVD player is not a very good indicator of picture quality. The logo is stored as an MPEG-2 still frame that is very highly compressed (like perhaps 3-5 KB for the entire 720x480 image). I don't see too much in the photo that doesn't look like the result of JPEG and sharpening artifacts. The "Standard" picture mode on this TV is very contrasty and would tend to enhance the problems in the logo image. An older, non-HD TV might tend to blur out some of these artifacts slightly, giving the impression of a better picture.

    I have been pretty satisfied with this TV so far. I only wish it could display 720p instead of just 1080i.

    Mark
     
  14. MikeyWeitz

    MikeyWeitz Supporting Actor

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    I have a TSL3294HF for about 8-9mos now and all I can say is I LUV it. I started with a non progressive DVD player and it still looked great. Something had to be seriously wrong with yours if it didnt look all that good. Granted, it took me a while to straighten out geometry and get my tweaks down, but now that I have, even some XBOX games in 480p blow me away. NO one who comes over my house and sees 5th Element Superbit or Blade II says anything other then, man, that looks awesome!
     
  15. Adam Bluhm

    Adam Bluhm Supporting Actor

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    Okay. This may be a long road for me. What was always a trustworthy DVD player may be the bad piece. I'm getting similar grainyness with a 27" Sony Trinitron I brought home. Although, my PS2 reviels a similar grainy texture. Man.. I'm confused. I don't know. I thought I had it all figure out. Maybe I'm just sitting too close to the tv. [​IMG]
    Okay. I'm going to sit tight with what I have now. I think I'll order the Panny RP82 soon and see what happens then (I've been planning on ordering it for quite some time now). I may see how that treats me.
    Well... I'll play with more dvd's, more settings, and give it more viewing time. I'll give this set time. At least all the speakers work in it. [​IMG]
     
  16. Michael St. Clair

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    I remember Panasonic's first flat-screen digital TV about 2 or 3 years ago (these were not sold at many dealers).

    The picture was very 'digitally processed' looking. I assumed that the set's digital comb filter and other interal processing was of a low color depth. It flattened out the picture and gave everything a very 'grainy' digital look.

    Samsung might be cutting costs with some of their digital circuitry (even analog 480p is possibly digitally processed by the set).

    One thing to beware is sharpness and SVM. Turn both down if you can, as they exaggerate DVD compression artifacts.
     
  17. Adam Bluhm

    Adam Bluhm Supporting Actor

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    Okay. I both feel like a schmuck and feel more intelligent on the viewing end of tv's and dvd's. I guess I'll get into why I feel like a schmuck first, and everything else will roll along.
    First off, the viewing area in the living room is a pretty good distance away. We're talking ~10ft for the 27" Quazar (Panasonic). But that's okay as no one ever complains about straining or what not. Also, details are obviously not picked up at this distance. This is partly where the schmuck part comes in. [​IMG]
    As I was setting up the Samsung in the bedroom, I was forced to sit just a few feet away from the television. This, coupled with the bright lights (so I can see to make connections) and the television's default brightness, I was able to pickout the "rough" edges and the "grainyness" of the default DVD logo. Now, like mentioned above, that default DVD logo is just a compressed file. It's not of very good quality at all.
    However, like I mentioned above, I was sitting MUCH closer and the flaws looked MUCH more apparent. Last night I proceeded to re-hook the DVD to the Quazar and I knelt about two feet away from the tv. Yep, the DVD logo was not as perfect as I remember it. :/ HOWEVER, it didn't look NEARLY as bad as the calibrated Samsung set did. I'm still glad I returned it, but not glad I neglected to try another of the same model. I was too disheartened and decided to select another brand. Getting off tangent, my father is not really Phillips happy, and as the only other manufacturer of a 27" HD set, I was now going to a standard flat screen analog set. But that's okay. As long as the Sony can do a 16:9 compression and control VSM, I'll be happy once it calibrated.
    Now that I brought the Sony home and noticed the same grainyness, I realize that is just how DVD's are (especially the more compressed formats.. I guess is what it comes down to). I must also point out, the Quazar tv does a MUCH better job hiding the bad edges and what not, compared to the Samsung (at the same viewing distance). After some brief viewing and an adjustment to VSM, the Sony looks promising in this aspect.
    That said, I have yet to do a proper calibration on the new Sony 27" Trinitron. I'm happy with my purchase at the moment and probabaly won't bother with another set until I have full progressive capabilities with dvd AND console.. which is not far down the road by any means!
    Well, again, thanks for the help, guys. I just have one more question.
    I was talking to an intelligent fellow at Best Buy, and.. well, do these televisions try to up-convert an interlaced picture to a progressive picture by default? That is what he said and it sort of made sense. I just want to get a second, third, and however many opinions and facts I can get. [​IMG]
    Thanks again!
     
  18. JasonRH

    JasonRH Second Unit

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    Adam,
    Yes, HDTV-ready sets like the Samsung you originally had possess a line doubler that upconverts incoming signals to a progressive signal. Keep in mind that in doing this, a sharp, clear signal will produce an even better picture than it's interlaced counterpart. On the same note, grainy, bad signals will also be magnified and look even worse on a set with a line doubler. Once you get used to the softer look of a set with a line doubler, you'll appreciate the lack of scan lines and find it much more pleasing than a regular analog set (at least I did). Hope that helps.
     
  19. Ricardo Rivera

    Ricardo Rivera Auditioning

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    Can someone post the calibration numbers becuase im getting this tv soon.
     
  20. JasonRH

    JasonRH Second Unit

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    Ricardo,
    Re-post after you get it and I'll give you some suggestions. Also, look at the set in wide mode and see if you can see tiny circles on the left and right sides of the screen. I noticed in mine that in wide mode the sides (vertically) of the picture almost appear like the line doubler is inactive in that area.This effect extends for a few inches inward on each side. Look at the set while it diplsys a light pcture and let me know if you observe this. Thanks a lot.
     

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