SACD: Is it time for the funeral? (1 Viewer)

[Phil A]

I believe Linn Records and Music Giants are doing higher resolution downloads. In my opinion the average member (not an enthusiast as in someone you'd see visit this forum) of the buying public is more than happy with CDs or MP3s. So I don't believe that hi-rez no matter what format it is released on will be more than a niche market, unless everything is released on hi-rez at the same prices as std. media and std. media discontinued and it may sway some of those average members of the buying public that it is worth it. I don't see the record labels doing that. I agree that this topic has been beaten to death.

 

[Marc Colella]

35%? I don't see that at all... I'm not even sure 3.5% is attainable.

Basically all you need to do is look around and see how people are listening to music. How many people do you know who just sits (at home) and listens to music without doing anything else? There aren't that many people who listen to music that way, and of those who do (small portion) I'm sure CD and MP3 are perfectly fine with them.

I don't know about anyone else, but I never hear (outside of these forums) anyone stating that they want to upgrade their equipment so they can get improved sound for listening to music. Home theatre is what people enjoy most, music can be listened to on the boom-box, iPod, radio etc. The demand for improved audio for music is extremely limited.

 

[Phil A]

Could not be said better. I just looked at the 'Save SACD Petition' which I signed years ago. As of this writing a whole 2,985 people have signed it. If I'm an executive at a record co., regardless of my personal preferences, how do I justify the extra production costs unless I offer it as a deduction from my salary. I see records cos. (and Sony has done this already) as licensing certain titles to audiophile labels like Mobile Fidelity. Even counting those audiophile labels, there's hardly anything in the pop/rock category that has been released in the US in the past yr.

 

[Paul.S]

Btw, speaking of that petition, another reason I think such entreaties to the labels and elegies such as this thread miss the mark is because if this tech/format is to continue for rock releases, it will be artist-driven. John Hiatt has praised the Sonoma Workstation and DSD technology he used for Master Of Disaster. Peter Gabriel has said he never wants to record in stereo again. I'd like to think both of these guys will release more rock SACDs in the future.

Find out who manages your favorite rockers and write them a letter encouraging SACD/multichannel release of both their catalog and any new work. Heck if my fave band Rush can FINALLY release a studio album in (dammit lossy!) surround, so can younger whippersnappers.

Enjoyable hobbyist discussion aside, I think that's time better spent than yet another thread debating the death of the format.

 

[Rachael B]

I bought into SACD knowing full well it would fail to get as popular as sliced bread. I was always sure. The only question in my mind was how fast. I expected Sony to release more than they ever bothered with, in the end. Their token software suppourt the last few years is beyond token....what's the word for that....if any...token-aciously deprived.

From Sony's end, given Sony Music's actions, failure seems nearly preplanned....? A way to pump up player prices for awhile. Same for disc prices.

It's a miracle there's anybody releasing Sack-Dee's at this point. I'll keep buyin' a few....as long as they stumble out. I hope musicans keep it alive. Sony never cared, much.

 

[Garrett Lundy]

Sony, and the other big labels, may have cared. But then all of their prayers were answered by sudden renewed intrest in vinyl. Who cares about hi-rez when you have slightly more difficult to pirate analog vinyl that even wears-out and needs replacement? This was their best news since pay-to-listen satellite radio.

 

[FeisalK]

When it all started I thought the record companies should have surreptitiously made all releases on hybrids, minimize the SACD logo to reduce confusion. People with SACD players would pick up the SACD layer automatically anyway and joe public would be none the wiser / not worried about compatibility.

Then all stereo CD players could be SACD compatible going forwards so whenever someone buys a new CD player it would automatically pick up SACD

Something like HDCDs - most people have a lot more HDCDs than they know, and you didn't really pay attention until you got a new CD player and the little blue light comes on

oh, wait... another dead format

 

[Paul.S]

MS bought HDCD patent holder Pacific Microsonics. Whoooole 'nother kettle of fish.

 

[LanceJ]

As a dvd-audio fanboy I have to throw this in: it was Sony (and Philips to a lesser extent) who started the hi-res format confusion.

Everyone else was all onboard with dvd-audio back in @1997 when Sony/Philips went their own way & threw a major wrench into the hi-res works.

I do like sacd's concentration on music, though if desired a dvd-audio disc CAN easily be made with no video and be controlled like a CD (the Elv1s dvd-audio from BMG came closest to this format).

And I bought that Rolling Stone magazine with the free sacd, which sounded very good & also included surround tracks (IMO the one feature of both hi-res formats that had a decent chance of helping the format sell to non-audio hobbyists).But to me its problem was choice of music: it was either classic rock, jazz-ish stuff or what's played on lite FM stations. In other words, "old-man" music, material sure to turn off most music fans under age 25. And from what I've read its people that age and younger that buy most of the music and very probably the gear its played on.

The PS3: by making the multichannel signal available only via HDMI, Sony severely restricted who can listen to the surround tracks - wtf? I mean, how many people much less non-audio hobbyists own receivers with an HDMI connection *and* which includes the ability to decode such a signal? And the sacd logo itself is buried along with a bunch of other ones on the casing & IIRC not highlighted in any way, I'm sure further adding to its who-cares image among the public. Sony the corporation is such a mess right now - it is sad to see them this way compared to what they used to be when I was growing up.

 

[Paul.S]

Heya Lance.

But of course you know that this has been the general direction of the anti-piracy impetus since the beginning. As long as SPDIFs and coax digital were not encrypted (and basically that's been the entire life of the formats), we haven't been able to pass high rez aud via a digital connection. Now that HDMI has been foisted upon us by the labels and movie studios, of course they're quick to make that encrypted connection the only means via which to get high rez aud. You know the PS3 does not have analog 5.1 outs, yes? They are slowly but surely disappearing from high def DVD players, too (only the top-of-the-line of the third gen Toshs has them, for instance).

 

[Blair G]

They were releasing some interesting SACDs but their last few releases have been 24K Gold like the old days, not SACD.
Kind of has me worried about their future plans with this format.

 

[Phil A]

I'd imagine they'll still do some. It's probably a matter of getting the licensing rights to do the SACD. The Yes CD (vs. hybrid) Mofi did was probably a result of Yes being a Warner artist (I have the DVD-A they did of the album). Same is true of Natalie Merchant and Marc Cohn - both Warner artists.

 

[Paul.S]

Yeah I, too, am concerned about the lack of SACD output by the new MoFi. I scooped up That's the Way Of the World (and gave the Sony remastered CD to my parents), but where's the rest of the SACD goodness?

 

[Aaron Silverman]

Does the PS3 convert SACD to multichannel PCM via HDMI, or does SACD playback require a receiver that actually decodes the SACD signal?

 

[Chris Gerhard]

I don't own it but I have read so many posts indicating it converts to PCM and is being used with HDMI 1.1 receivers with success that I am certain it does handle SACD in that manner. It sure seems like a great piece of hardware at the going price today, especially if you like SACD, Blu-ray discs and Blu-ray games.

Chris

 

[Paul.S]

Aaron, it's not my understanding either that any kind of "DSD decoding" receiver is needed. The PS3 just must be connected to a receiver featuring HDMI version 1.1 or later.

 

[Brian-W]

Let me re-phrase my original post then: When it comes to rock/pop (my choice of music), SACD is pretty much a dead format (sadly). As pointed out in this thread, there is still plenty of classical and other instrumental music coming out (albeit at a much slower pace than a few years ago). But for rock/pop, and I can see I'm not alone in that genre, there's been little to nothing released.

And, as has been pointed out as well, Sony seems to have abandoned the format from a software side. The irony is in Japan Sony is still releasing SACD hardware, albeit more specialized (the little all in one system; car head unit which is out here). But software is nil from Sony, quite pathetic. The whole point of Sony buying movie and music studios was the 'synergy' to support their formats. They're doing it with Blu-Ray, but not with music.

Argh.

 

[Aaron Silverman]

Thanks for the info, guys. Good to know. I'll still have to keep my old player though, since it does DVD-A (and it'll probably be a while before I even get a receiver with HDMI).

 

[Paul.S]

Understood, Brian. Let me re-phrase my responsive comments: shouldn't you/we be crankin' Let's Dance and Up and otherwise enjoying what we've got instead of typing about what we've not?

Aaron don't forget about that Panasonic if you're wanting to get into high def and leave only one high rez "man" behind: it's got analog 7.1 outs and, again, plays DVD-A.

 

[Chris Gerhard]

I don't have an HDMI receiver yet either but I do have the Oppo DV-980H that has the SACD option of pure DSD or conversion to PCM for use over HDMI. Will either method be any better than using the analog connections? I doubt if I could tell the difference, but for some reason I want to know that from first hand experience. What a goofy hobby this is.

Chris