Relationships redux: Do men and/or women change??? (1 Viewer)

[Todd Hochard]

If a man actually says that, it's probably because he's angling for sex. Not to be crass, but it's true.
I've said too much.
Todd

 

[Zen Butler]

Zen, the reasons someone would want the other to change could be big things that they both sincerely want to change.

MickeS, I wasn't talking about large issues such as addiction, children etc.

Sounds like they made a joint decision.



Many people love to change their significant other, after he/she already knows how they are. It doesn't make sense and it's not fair to the other person, regardless of what he/she feels needs to be changed.

 

[Philip_G]

If a man actually says that, it's probably because he's angling for sex. Not to be crass, but it's true.
I've said too much.

SHH! don't give away my secrets!

 

[Jeff Ulmer]

It's not whether a man CAN change, but whether he WILL change. Anyone can change if they want to, but whether the change is permanent or not depends on a lot of things, and whether changing will have other consequences is also an issue. Some changes are easier than others, and a lot depends on how old this person is as well, and how ingrained the aspect that one desires changed is.

An equally valid question is why you would want him to change?

In order for someone to change, there has to be a motivating factor, but simply having someone else wanting you to change often isn't a very good one. It also depends on whetherits behavioural, habitual, or addictive change we're talking about.

So, yes, men can change, but it's unlikely, unless they have the conviction to carry through.

 

[Grant B]

Yes, if it's important enough.
I have a closet of suits to prove it.

We bought a fixer upper, which I basically rebuilt myself.
I didn't own a hammer when I started. Evenings were for bars and clubs.
The last 6 years were crow bars and tool clubs ever moment I wasn't putting in a 40 hour week at the 'easy' job. I was never one of those 'tool guys' who collected tools for the hell of it.

It's something we could have never afforded otherwise.
The wife does miss the 'other' Grant....so do I at times; he was a lot more fun.

 

[Scott Bourden]

Occasionally I say "yes dear, I will change"

But it's really just so she'll stop interrupting my frag session :b

 

[Steve Schaffer]

I've seen men and women change hugely in addiction recovery, but only if they want to change for themselves and not for someone else. In many cases the spouses don't like the changes and divorce ensues.

 

[RobertR]

I have to agree with the question "why do you want him to change"? If you don't like him as he is, why are you with him?

I once heard something that seems to be true, and seems to point at much of the male/female conflict:

She hopes he will change.

He hopes she won't.

 

[brentl]

I'd say men will change if;

1. they want to
2. they are prodded into it. Even though it may not make them happy.
3. they know the change will do them good(P&S to widescreen).
4. they love the person they are with, and see any future for them.

Brent

 

[Max Leung]

Men change, but often not in the ways you expect.

This goes for women and persons of indeterminate sex too.

Heck, Prozac or other anti-depressants change people too, to the point where they don't feel they need them anymore and stop taking the medication.

It's all so clear now...

 

[JasenP]

My girlfriend has been a catlyst for change, but she has only asked me to change one thing: My lack of financial responsibility. Which I have done...for myself.

Change will only last if you are doing for yourself. If you try to change yourself for someone else, you will only have contempt for them trying to change you.

Like others have mentioned, men do change but it is not immediate.

Jenna, I hope that whatever situation prompted you to post this thread turns out great in the end.

 

[Jenna]

So yes, some guys can change. Your best bet is to find one that doesn't need fixing.

Unfortunately, it's not always so cut and dry. After one-too-many painful breakups, I've given up on finding my soul mate and have resigned myself to the fact that such things just don't exist for everyone. Who's to say that my "Mr. Right" didn't get hit by a truck on his way to our "chance meeting". After a while, you stop looking and begin to settle for that "less-than-dream" guy. Someone who you feel comfortable with, but who'll never really "complete" you.

Don't mean to sound too jaded, but the reality is that not everyone's perfect (or perfect for you). Relationships require compromise, and I've always been the one to do so, in effect changing small things about myself to please my mate. I've never expected or asked for major changes as that would be looking for failure. (And I agree that if MAJOR changes were necessary, I was with the wrong guy in the first place.)

The main problem with this particular guy was that he was increasingly smothering me. Everyone needs some time and space to themselves, and he was gradually giving me less and less. He literally expected us to be joined at the hip. If I got tired and wanted to go to bed early, HE'D stop what he was doing and go to bed. If I wanted to wake up early to go work out, he'd get upset because he wanted me there with him. His insecurities began to control his behavior, and he tried to control mine to hold me closer...yet ended up driving me away. Basically, he's a good man with a good heart. He just let his fear of losing me get out of control, and like a self-fulfilling prophecy, he lost me.

I'm sure you can all relate to this scenario...

 

[JonZ]

"but the reality is that not everyone's perfect"

Thats exactly right.

My last g/f was the same way - constantly insecure and smothering.

A friend from work is having this problem now and I told her to find someone who has their own life - someone with their own hobbies and interests. If they do, it wont bother them if you want your own time, becuase theyll plenty of things to do on their own.

Im the same way - I have alot I want to do and no time. My current g/f lives about 45 mintues away so we only see each other 2 or 3 times a week (besides at work, but no one there knows we're seeing each other). She works on stained glass,is going to school, works out, is raising a kid,studying to be a personal trainer. Im getting ready to start making my own guitars with her, taking up painting again, going to the gym, want to start martial arts again and so.

We do things to together, but we give each other plenty of room to do what the other wants.

 

[Jeff Ulmer]

I'm sure you can all relate to this scenario...

Yes, straight out of Star Trek: the Klingon.

This is a hard change to make, because it can't come all from one side. How long have you been seeing this person? He is insecure in your relationship, either because you make him feel that way, or he has past experience that is forcing this behaviour. Trust is not an easy thing to be given, especially when you have been burned in the past. This needs some serious discussion to alleviate. If he is simply a smothering type person, you may be out of luck.

 

[JamieD]

I really wish this topic was called "Do People change?", because we all know this question is asked just as often about women.

 

[Jack Briggs]

Done, but I was waiting for someone to make the request.

 

[Holadem]

That was the point of my post
--
Holadem

 

[Moe Maishlish]

Buzz,

but their expectations are something like Gandhi's disposition, Oscar Wilde's wit, Donald Trump's income, and Brad Pitt's looks. I have to think that someone who advertises as looking for "true love", and is certain that "true love" is six feet tall, blonde, and has a swimmer's build, isn't serious.

Amen!
I've been dating quite a bit in the last little while, and in Toronto at least, my pool of potential women has dwindled mostly because of what you've described.
Without generalizing, I've found that many people (both men & women) expect that they are a catch (when they're not), and are holding out for the "rich, intellectual, underwear supermodel, Royal Crowned-Prince of Fantasyland" to knock on their doors. Of course, many people are incredibly flawed, and they just wind up rejecting people because they don't know themselves well enough to recognize what they really need and want.
Bill Gates doesn't go door-to-door. Like anything in life, if you want something you have to pursue it, and when you get their hands on it, you should hold on to it. All too often, people overanalyze their partners and only end up projecting traits that they dislike in themselves onto them.
In the end it boils down to knowing yourself, and knowing what you want. Everyone is screwed up... the question is finding someone who is screwed up in a way that seems normal to you.
My two cents of course.
Moe.

 

[Lew Crippen]

I know a lot of other guys who claim that they can't find the right man, but their expectations are something like Gandhi's disposition, Oscar Wilde's wit, Donald Trump's income, and Brad Pitt's looks. I have to think that someone who advertises as looking for "true love", and is certain that "true love" is six feet tall, blonde, and has a swimmer's build, isn't serious.

I’m reminded of the old joke (feel free to change the sexes and sex mixes—it’s all the same):

“It seems that a wife was engaged in a bit of a domestic with her husband, and she got to the point of saying, “Why don’t you make more money?’ ‘And since you don’t why don’t you have a more prestigious job?’ ‘And since your job is not that great, why are you not the boss?’ ‘And while we are at it, why aren’t you better looking?’ ‘And why are you not more athletic?’ ‘And finally, why can’t you make love every night for at least an hour?’

and so on…

To which came the reply, ‘If I was all of those things, do you think I would have married you?’

 

[Todd Hochard]

but their expectations are something like Gandhi's disposition, Oscar Wilde's wit, Donald Trump's income, and Brad Pitt's looks. I have to think that someone who advertises as looking for "true love", and is certain that "true love" is six feet tall, blonde, and has a swimmer's build, isn't serious.

Interesting. It has been my experience that, as my friends age (from 20-somethings to 30-somethings), they tend toward this trait. I suppose it's somewhat logical, experience and all, but it's an interesting juxtaposition of expectation and desperation, dontcha think?
I guess I'm glad I got married, when I was still too young to know what the hell I really wanted.
Todd