Recievers have major impact on sound?! i need help please.

Discussion in 'AV Receivers' started by stephanX, Mar 29, 2005.

  1. stephanX

    stephanX Stunt Coordinator

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    Recently bought energy c-1s, they sound incredible for the 300 i payed for em!but...not as good as in the store? in the store they ahd them hooked up to a $350 yamaha stereo reciever, and a good cd player(i think around the same price, maybe higher). Anyway i noticed in the store they sounded so effortless for a bookshelf speaker, and they had more bass as well, and just sounded mroe accurate and less blaring.

    Now i am running an old 80s reciever (nikko 3035, 35 WPC), and granted that could be the problem, im using a computer with a pci sound card, which may or may not compare to the scource at baybloor.

    Anyway im curiuous whats making the difference in sound? the lack of bass i can understand, as the bass out of the right channel is SEVERELY limited. But im curious why the big difference in overall sound?

    Sorry for the spelling, and please help a confused kid out.
     
  2. mackie

    mackie Supporting Actor

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    A lot of different things have a significant impact on the sound coming from speakers.

    1. Amplifier - good clean power source that doesn't clip. A solid 35 watts of power is plenty for many speakers as long as the amplifier isn't being pushed too hard. If the highs sound really harsh and the bass is muddy and poorly defined, you may be having power problems. Using a sub and a 80 hz crossover relieves your receiver of a lot of strain so it will do a better job with the higher frequencies.
    2. Room treatments - the room has a major impact on the sound, and this is where the dealer has the advantage. Many of the rooms used to audition equipment are set up to minimize room interactions.
    3. The speakers themselves. A low impedance speaker can tax a receiver if it doesn't have a strong power supply. A lot of the older stereo receivers had solid power supplies.

    There are many others, but these just come to mind. Are the speakers 8ohm? What is their sensitivity rating? Are you using a sub? Is your receiver working correctly?
     
  3. jeff.m

    jeff.m Agent

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    as far as the limited bass on the right speaker.....this is kinda elementary, but i just want to make sure you've got the wires hooked up correctly. if you've got the + and - reversed on one side you'll get sound still, but horrible bass.
     
  4. Dave Lindhorst

    Dave Lindhorst Stunt Coordinator

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    Thats called phasing. To check if your phasing is correct, stand in front of the speakers and turn your balance all the way to one side. If the base gets louder when only one channel is on then you are out of phase. If the base is loudest when both speakers are playing your phasing is correct. If you are out of phase just check and make sure your wires are connected + to + and - to - on all your speakers.
     
  5. Garrett Lundy

    Garrett Lundy Producer

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    try using a CD player and a CD. maybe your problem is a really bad MP3 encoder?
     
  6. John Garcia

    John Garcia Executive Producer

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    One speaker being close to a corner or wall, while the other is not, can cause a big difference in response. If you swap the speakers, does the problem follow the speaker or remain the same. If it stays the same, it's the speaker locations, not the speakers. If it does follow the speaker, then the speaker has the problem.

    If the voltage output from your soundcard isn't high enough, you will never get good sound. What output are you using from the card? Digital (guessing not), analog or mini-jack w/adapter?
     
  7. stephanX

    stephanX Stunt Coordinator

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    FIRST of all, i have one hell of a sub, atlas 15 getting 250 watts crossed at 80ish hz. My phasing is correct, im sure of it, the driver actually moves less, ive done test tone tests.
    Im using a mini jack adapter out of my soundcard. i honestly think its the amplifier though... is there much difference between the signal coming out of this amplifier and the signal coming out of a different amplifier?

    The speakers are 8 ohm, 89db sensitivity.

    Would you reccomend bringing the speakers downstairs and hooking them up to a yamaha reviever(older stereo model) to see if i notice a difference?

    Also there werent any room treatments at the store, it was actually pretty much hooked up to a reciever in an open room, nothing too special about it.
     
  8. John Garcia

    John Garcia Executive Producer

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    Did they always sound this way since you got them home?

    Mini-jack adapter is likely a big part of the problem because of the low voltage this connection method will give you. The result is usually less than impressive bass or a distorted sound. The mini-jack is intended to drive headphones, not to send signal to a receiver.

    The amp could be a factor too - the difference is how much power a particular amp is acually delivering, though I would expect even that receiver should drive those speakers adequately. Yes, I would compare their performance with another reciever.

    if you crank up the volume, a sudden peak could easily cause a 35w amp to clip and damage the speakers.
     
  9. stephanX

    stephanX Stunt Coordinator

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    so its most likely the scource?
    I was looking through some settings and noticed that the maximum quality (sample rate?)that my soundcard supports is 44.1(or whatever cd is, i think thats it)khz at 16 bit.
    Although upgrading my sound card to my other one could make a large difference.

    I always thought that the power you got from a mini jack was compareable to the power out of an rca out.

    Also would a cheap DVD player work fine as a cd scource?

    BTW when youre listening at a meter away from the speaks, a sudden 35 watt peak would be VERY loud.
     
  10. John Garcia

    John Garcia Executive Producer

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    A DVD player would be fine as a source.
     
  11. mackie

    mackie Supporting Actor

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    You can get good sound from an inexpensive CD player, or you can upgrade your sound card. Which ever works for you. I looked at M-Audio sound cards and they looked like a good option if you're connecting your computer to a receiver.

    I you can post pictures of your set-up it could help us figure out what's going on.
     
  12. Mark Dill

    Mark Dill Stunt Coordinator

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    I tried hooking up my PC to my receiver through a mediocre sound card using a mini jack before, and it sounded awful. I think the source is your problem. Get a DVD player man.
     
  13. stephanX

    stephanX Stunt Coordinator

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    well i tried hooking up my dads yamaha ax-450, from soundcard and got a tiny bit of improvement over my previous amplifier, jsut very tiny things, but then i hooked up the dvd player to the yammy and WOW it opned up alot over the soundcard. although i think i need a new reciever anyway (becuase of the no bass from right channel issue, its almost a shame if the nikko sounds good with the dvd player.

    just hooked the dvd player up to the nikko, and couldnt notice a difference from the yamaha! and for some reason i had equal bass out of both channels(which is unusualy becuase on both soundcards the nikko didnt put out equal bass, but the yammy did, but on dvd player it put out equal bass on each channel...wow im confused).

    even IF my dad yelled at me, it was worth finding out that it WASNT me missing my money that made the speakers sound a bit sub par, it was the fact that my computer, or laptop doesnt put out as clean a signal as a dvd player.

    the voltage i can get out of my soundcard with a 60hz sine wave isss 1.2 volts! and cant seem to get ANY current, not even on the lowest setting on my DMM.
     
  14. mackie

    mackie Supporting Actor

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    Glad you figured out the problem. If you're just looking for a stereo receiver and not AV receiver, you should be able to pick something up relatively cheap. Check ebay or your local pawn shop. Might be able to get a DVD player that way too.
     
  15. stephanX

    stephanX Stunt Coordinator

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    well im going to be doing a HT so i might as well get 5.1

    IM considering those new digital amplifying stage pannys at bestbuy for $260 cad :O

    35 watts is easily enough for these speakers in my room

    ALSO i have found sucess with the mini jack when using the line out on an old cd walkman to go into my amp.
     
  16. mackie

    mackie Supporting Actor

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    The panasonics are getting good reviews. I haven't heard one, but they look like a good option. Sounds like you're set. Sit back and enjoy your new speakers.
     

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