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Receiver VS. PreProcessor as a Prepro..Which and why? (1 Viewer)

Robert McClanahan

Stunt Coordinator
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Jul 21, 2000
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188
I have tried and tried to replace my Rotel RCD-991 cd player with a dvd player so I could use the DAC's in my Rotel 998 pre/pro.I have had no success because even though the preamp and the cd player use the same DAC's the cd player sounds alot better using the analog connection with a pair of high end interconnects.People are forgetting that the RCA interconnects make a difference too.That would be another post though.
 

Levesque

Supporting Actor
Joined
Mar 21, 2002
Messages
586
Fair enough John. I seem to go "hard" on this, but it's because I was in "your camp" before, and for me, a good receiver for pre-pro was as good as a real pre-pro.
And, like you, I'm tired of this "copy and post" phenomena, where people didn't even HEARD the unit, and they just repeat what they read somewhere else. The "surfing-parrots"... So sometimes I "jump" too fast in to rectify the situation. I respect your opinion, because I see that you did try a lot of different products and did a lot of comparison between really different products.:emoji_thumbsup:
I like when people clearly state how and with what they did a comparison.
I completely agree with you that for HT, the difference is not that big. But for DVD-A, 2 ch listening, I really think the difference is that much.:D
 

Robert_Dufresne

Stunt Coordinator
Joined
Mar 30, 2002
Messages
246
NickSP

Don't be fooled by all those who jump on the
"lets trash the receivers" bandwagon.

For the money you want to spend there are plenty
of receivers that will give you great satisfaction.
I certainly agree that separates is the way to go
but you would have to spend a lot more money in
order to do it wright.

It makes no sense to buy cheap separates just for
the sake of buying separates. And believe me there
are some cheap separates out there.

Good Luck

Robert
 

Scott Oliver

Screenwriter
Joined
Aug 30, 2000
Messages
1,159
I agree with Robert, after all I have said unless you are just looking for the absolute best, a receiver will get you far enough along in the sound spectrum to keep you happy. I am not that lucky however, so thus I have like $30,000 of equipment in my system. Don't ask me how I ever afforded all of it.:b
 

NickSP

Supporting Actor
Joined
May 8, 2001
Messages
569
Scott, How did you afford all that equipment? :D
Robert, I was being very fair in my own listening tests and was not at all convinced that given my under $1K budget (unlike Scott's), I really thought that there are receivers out there that can do the job as well as and in some cases even better that the Outlaw 950. The Outlaw is a good prepro but it does nothing for me the receivers couldn't do or at least I could not "hear" a difference but that's just my opinion and thanks for reinforcing it.
 

Matt Jesty

Second Unit
Joined
May 15, 2002
Messages
390
It makes no sense to buy cheap separates just for
the sake of buying separates. And believe me there
are some cheap separates out there.
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TRUE ENOUGH, I think that in the $1,000 dollar range the level of quality in a pre-pro vs the rcvr may not be all that much ,I would think that some would attribute this to the "economy of scale" arguement....the challenge seems to me to be in the $2,000-4,000 range where rcvrs AMPLIFICATION can sometimes get better (ie; torroids, etc) but where stand-alone pre-amps seem to take quite a quality leap .....I think if you're limited to $1,000 as a budjet than a rcvr will not only be a good choice but may be easier to sell later (larger potential market) ...then again I think that the more we all study "lateral" (ie; no real price differance) equipment moves the less differance we find between trhe over-all quality of gear within the price-point
 

NickSP

Supporting Actor
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May 8, 2001
Messages
569
Agreed Matt, at the price point that I have some receivers and prepros do a similar job. I am sure the higher the pricepoint, the differences must start showing up and if one can actually and quite easily tell those differences then it would be money well spent. :emoji_thumbsup:
 

Levesque

Supporting Actor
Joined
Mar 21, 2002
Messages
586
I've paid 3400$ CDN (around 2200$ US) for my RSP-1066 + RMB-1095 (don't ask me where, can't post it!). Can you tell me of a receiver, in the same price range, from any company, that will give me both good decoding AND amplification of that caliber (5X200w)?
I think it will be hard to find. Separates are not that tough to afford anymore...
Just find a good dealer, develop a good relationship with him (so you can stop this internet buying), and you will be able to make great deal like this.
BTW, I'm in the process of "upgrading" from the RSP-1066 to the AVM20 for 1000$ CDn... So my system will then be at 4400$ cdn (around 2900$ US)... Can you give me the name of a receiver, in this price range, that can compete to AVM20 +RMB-1095 for this price?
BTW, I'm not working in a AV store, I'm just a really good haggler...;)
 

NickSP

Supporting Actor
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May 8, 2001
Messages
569
L'evesque:
"I've paid 3400$ CDN (around 2200$ US) for my RSP-1066 + RMB-1095 (don't ask me where, can't post it!). Can you tell me of a receiver, in the same price range, from any company, that will give me both good decoding AND amplification of that caliber (5X200w)?"
We would be beating around the bush so to speak on what a receiver can and can't do. I will agree that at this pricepoint, a seperate amplifier definitely makes a difference when compared to the receiver's own amps.
I am however not convinced that in this pricepoint, a prepro does a better job than a receiver in decoding, etc.
If you are convinced then so be it, in that case your money was well spent. IN my case I was not convinced so my money was well saved ;)
 

Levesque

Supporting Actor
Joined
Mar 21, 2002
Messages
586
If you are convinced then so be it, in that case your money was well spent. IN my case I was not convinced so my money was well saved
Amen my brother! Amen!:D
This sentence should be put in a new national anthem! (you got it? anthem?...)
There is no receiver in this price point with 5X200W on the market right now, BTW...:D
 

NickSP

Supporting Actor
Joined
May 8, 2001
Messages
569
L'evesque:
"This sentence should be put in a new national anthem! (you got it? anthem?...)"
The upgrade bug has fully consumed you. I hereby declare you as a terminally upgraditis infected person. (LOL) :D
 

Levesque

Supporting Actor
Joined
Mar 21, 2002
Messages
586
The upgrade bug has fully consumed you. I hereby declare you as a terminally upgraditis infected person. (LOL)
Is there a cure? Should I go directly to Lexicon, or Krell? Is there an end to this madness?:b
Just kidding. I really enjoy this incredible hobby.
Yesterday, my gear seller came to see me, telling me he was going to install a Toshiba 65HDX82 and a complete HT (separates and 7 speakers), and that he was stoping by for some tweaks and tricks... I almost start crying...It was the best compliment I've ever receive...Sniff Sniff:D
 

John Tompkins

Supporting Actor
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Aug 30, 2000
Messages
658
One good thing about a receiver is that you can use its internal amps to drive your back four speakers and get an external two or three channel amp for your l/r/c..

I just recently sold a lex dc-2 for 1700.00 and a parasound 2205 for 1200.00 also a parasound 855 for 350.00 (total is 3250.00) I then turned around and bought a HK avr8000 locally in the Washington post for 800.00(heck of a deal) and a carver av806 6 channel amp(600.00)..total 1400.00 for both pieces and the amp bridges to 3 channels at 380 X 3 at 8 ohms..Pocketed a difference of 1850.00 for my new house.

The avr8000 will have NO problem at all driving all four rear speakers in a ht setup. I still have logic 7 which IS one great reason to by a pre-pro..Another good thing is that it takes up less rack space (one less amp) which for me is a consideration considering That I have a turntable, phono stage, tube pre-amp, cd player, dvd, amps..well you get the point
 

Guy Usher

Supporting Actor
Joined
Oct 20, 2002
Messages
780
If you want a more powerful Reciever then use the pre-outs and put a bigger amp on it.
Don't kid yourself you still have a Reciever .
I have at times used a Recievers Pre-Outs temperarily. At first you kid yourself into thinking this is great and much cheaper, listen for awhile and( if the rest of your stuff is up to it) you will hear the difference.
High DollarRecievers had better have Pre-Outs as their Amps are Crap . THERE IS ONLY SO MUCH THAT YOU CAN PUT IN 1 BOX. Something has to give, It is that simple period.
 

Matt Jesty

Second Unit
Joined
May 15, 2002
Messages
390
High DollarRecievers had better have Pre-Outs as their Amps are Crap
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Actually, what we're saying is we would hope they had better pre-outs!!!...Anbody know which mnfgr of both a rcvr and stand-alone pre-pro tauts the fact that the rcvr uses the same pre-pro section as their stand-alone?
 

NickSP

Supporting Actor
Joined
May 8, 2001
Messages
569
Matt:
"Anbody know which mnfgr of both a rcvr and stand-alone pre-pro tauts the fact that the rcvr uses the same pre-pro section as their stand-alone?"

I thought B&K says something like that about their top of the line receiver, don't they?
 

Chip E

Screenwriter
Joined
Nov 25, 2000
Messages
1,165
Scott,
your review was great.
I picked up a Ref50 along with a Ref200.5 about 10 days ago and am extremely pleased with it in all areas ;)
I had a Denon 5803 i traded in and before that a B&K 307. Going seperates is kinda staggering compared to a receiver.
 

DarrylM

Stunt Coordinator
Joined
Jan 4, 2003
Messages
167
"THERE IS ONLY SO MUCH THAT YOU CAN PUT IN 1 BOX. Something has to give, It is that simple period."

I thought that was a good point. I think that few would argue against the superior performance of a dedicated amp in the system. If you've ever looked at the "guts" of a receiver versus a separate amplifier, you will see dramatic differences in power supplies, capacitors, heat sinks, and so on. A typical 7-channel, 125-W amp might way close to 80 pounds, while a typical receiver with the same power rating -- which also includes the preamplifier section -- will weigh less than 40 pounds. And, of course, there will also be significant differences in performance between the specs of both.

As far as using an AV receiver as a preamplifier goes, I wonder if anyone has considered the implications of having an amplifier section located in the same box as the preamplifier section? For one thing, the preamplifier section of an AV receiver generally shares the same power supply as the amplifier section. And, in many receivers, the two sections are located in close proximity. I would suspect more "noise" is created as a result. Also, many receivers run quite hot, even when the volume is turned down. Since heat is so detrimental to electronics, exposing the circuit boards and other electronics of the preamplifier section to the heat produced by the amplifier section just seems like an unnecessary risk.
 

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