Question on Home Theater Config of speakers for a new home (1 Viewer)

[chitra0828]

I know it's the usual question, but I am an audio novice who wants to create the right surround sound experience for my family to enjoy movies/sports etc and also music in our new home that we are constructing. It's very exciting, but i don't have the budget to hire an AV firm, and was anyway advised that it is best for me to figure it out for myself, also more enjoyable LOL. Room dimensions: The Family room is 16 x 26' so lovely space. The TV would sit on the 16' wall. But the complication is that there are 2 door ways on either side of the central wall space. So effectively we really only have an 8' wall space on which the TV, Center channel and (if we had) wall Front R/L speakers will be placed. We currently have a 50" TV. We might upgrade to a 60" TV. I checked with the architect and we only have about 10-11" above the door top to the ceiling if we want to place the front R/L speakers above the doors. Now we will be sitting 14' away from the TV. Why? because there is a fireplace in the way on the long wall. So we sit 14' away, and the TV wall is 8' wide. Now since we had planned to use the surround sound system for both movies/sports AND for music listening (concerts etc) we were a bit worried because the sound stage created with speakers 7' apart didn't feel right if we were sitting 14' away. Now in visiting a local audio-hifi place, the dealer gave some really valuable advice and i am hoping someone can advise whether they agree or not with it. The dealer suggested that given the room constraints we separate music listening from sports/movie watching. He suggested we use a center channel in wall (below TV) + R/L CEILING front speakers and then rear speakers so that we can place the front speakers at the optimal 14' apart locations. BUT they would be in the ceiling so one is losing the ear-level component. However, in video watching, his view was that the sound separation is more important than having at ear level, esp because the center channel is at the right height. Then he suggested getting a pair of nice floor speakers with integrated amplifier for the Den/Library where we can set the speakers at the right distance apart to have quiet music listening time for the concerts etc. We were really attracted to this idea. BUt wanted a second opinion. Anyone have any thoughts? ideas? if you agree that ceiling speakers (he advised make sure they are either enclosed or blocked off with some backing), any suggestions on what would be the best choice? Thx so much!! Chitra

 

[schan1269]

Your room is the perfect situation(in my opinion) for this... http://www.amazon.com/Pinnacle-Speakers-QP-15-15-Driver/dp/B002OB49KK/ref=sr_1_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1362885371&sr=1-1&keywords=pinnacle+qp15 That is your right, left and center all in one(yes, you connect all three channels of your AVR to it). It can be mounted on the wall...or to the TV. Whatever mount you buy for your TV, they will have one of these... http://www.amazon.com/Chief-FCC100-Channel-Speaker-Bracket/dp/B002KE87J0/ref=sr_1_15?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1362885470&sr=1-15&keywords=center+speaker+mounting+bracket Your room is a great candidate for Dolby ProLogic IIz and Audyssey DSX(mentioned forth as DPLiiz and Aud DSX). The space above your doors is where the height channels will go. How much cash are you throwing towards this? I ask because the Pinnacle QP15 is $1200 by itself(other companies have the same concept, such as the Def Tech Mythos XTR SSA3).

 

[Al.Anderson]

That is a tough room layout, but unless you're doing it for looks, I would never, ever, recommend in-ceiling speakers. The higher frequencies are directional, so you're putting your system behind the eight-ball. If you and your wife can stomach the look I'd use satellites mounted at ceiling height. I also wouldn't get an in-wall center, because once it's in, you're committed to both the speaker (for size) and the location. I'd go with either and on-wall, or just mounting the speaker below the TV. I have to ask, why not just move the whole system to the den?

 

[chitra0828]

Schan1269: Well, since we are not audio philes but just want to enjoy good music, I'm budgeting about $10K for all the sonos stuff + whatever we do in the library AND family room. This would include all speakers, receivers etc. So i have to educate myself about the links you uploaded. Thx so much for it. Al.Anderson: The thing is the library is for us 2 to work, read, contemplate, discuss. The TV watching is in the family room so we all (as a family) can watch sports, family videos, movies etc. So that;s why the idea of putting 2 floor speakers (and we can set up a sofa with optimal distance to speakers) in the library for us to listen to was so appealing. and for the audio/visual stuff as a family, well, that's where we're kinda stuck. I do appreciate your points on the ceiling speakers. Can you take me thru how the satellite speakers work, and what the config would be? Are you saying I would do a center channel, no front R/L speakers on wall or ceiling, just the 2 satellite speakers above the doorways and then rear speakers? Also, sorry basic question, is your point on "stomaching it" that the quality of sound is compromised or it looks weird? from a re-sale perspective i definitely dont want to do anything that would hurt the aesthetics of the room. I hear ya on committing if i go in-wall. It is why i seriously considered doing shelf speakers R/L and a center channel sitting on the entertainment center. but the Polk 255 CRT center channel and 265RT R and L I discussed with Crutchfield were pretty big and again i just wasnt sure how it would look aesthetically. I guess aesthetics does play a bit of a role in the family room - we dont want bulky speakers around, and from a re-sale i dont want to hard wire stuff in that will raise eyebrows. But assuming we live here a long time, i sure want to enjoy my favorite soccer teams and tennis stars flattening their opponents in matches and hear all the on court screaming like I'm there!! Or as best i can within the constraints above. Any thoughts? and thanks so much for taking the time to respond!

 

[chitra0828]

Al: The Library is for us 2 to sit and chat, contemplate, listen to music. the TV is in the family room for us all to watch sports, movies etc. That is why I had thought that perhaps I could split the music listening from the movie watching. But i understand what you are saying as well. You seem to be saying that satellite speakers are better than in ceiling speakers. Can you explain why that is? Thx so much, Chitra

 

[Al.Anderson]

Chitra, I wasn't trying to talk you out of separate setups for the difference purposes. In fact, I wasn't thinking about it at the time for my quick post, but we have the same situation. I have a 14x26 room with a door and closet on each side of my viewing area (the 16' side), where I have my theater system. I use satellites with that system and am very happy with it. For music, I have a set-up in a study, where my wife and I also read and talk; that system uses mid-tier bookshelf speakers (although I still have is set up in a 5.1 layout, because i still watch some DVDs there, and more importantly, I really like all-channel stereo music). What I was trying to push you away from is the ceiling speakers. They are a severe compromise because of what I mentioned, the directional aspect of mid- and high-frequency sound. The reason most people go with ceiling is because someone (okay, usually the wife - it's often referred to as WAF: Wife Approval Factor) doesn't want speakers in their living room and they want to hide them. If that was the case for you, then instead of "wasting" the theater system, I'd rather see you have a nice dual-use set-up in one location. But my first choice for you is satellites. Something like this: http://www.amazon.com/Polk-Audio-5-Channel-Theater-System/dp/B000ZKNW82/ref=sr_1_39?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1362970601&sr=1-39&keywords=satellite+speakers+for+home+theater
(I have Harman/Kardons, but you can only get H/Ks with a sub now, and I'd rather get the sub separately these days.) You can mount everything but the center near the ceiling and angle them at the listening position. You would still need a sub, a good one to counter the reduced frequency response of the satellites. Now, after typing all that I realized I never knew your budget. If you are going high end for the in-ceilings I understand that they are actually situated at an angle. If that's the case, then satellites and in-ceilings are probably a push.

 

[chitra0828]

Al This is really awesome advice! I am very sorry that i was offline yesterday and couldn't respond. You also make some great points that i should ponder. So here are some thoughts, and I'd really appreciate your advice on them: 1. In terms of budget I could spend $1-2K for center channel, side speakers, and rear speakers all together. I would prefer to not spend more than $1,400 because of the spend on setting things up in the Den as well. So for example, using Polk as a baseline I was thinking as one config to do the 255CRT for center channel, 90-RT ceiling speakers (1 pair) for the front R/L, and the 80 F/X RT (1 pair) for the rear back ceiling speakers. Would you consider that high-end enough that the 90-RT ceiling speakers would be equal to the Polk satellites you link in your response? 2. Given my budget, would you suggest i could do better on my ceiling speaker selection, and by so doing get both the aesthetics and a pretty good surround sound config for the family room? 3. Lastly, if i did do the satellite speaker config instead, shouldnt the center channel be just above the TV as well? I am going by this article i found on the Polk website? Or is it that the center channel still stays just below the TV, and the satellites are up above? http://www.polkaudio.com/polk-university/articles/home-audio-speaker-placement I should note, that the way i'm thinking is that if i did do the satellite speakers, then it makes sense to mount them just above the doorways that are on either side of the TV wall, right? so that way i'd get them at say 8'6" off the ground, and they could be 12-14' apart very nicely. If i did the ceiling speakers then again they'd be 12-14' apart and in the ceiling. Any thoughts? and thanks for taking the time to reply! I will check out the satellites you recommend. I am not fixed on Polk. that's just the brand that i've done some work on... 90RT: http://www.crutchfield.com/p_10790RT/Polk-Audio-90-RT.html?showAll=N&search=90RT&skipvs=T 80F/X RT: http://www.crutchfield.com/p_10780FXRT/Polk-Audio-80F-X-RT.html?showAll=N&search=80FX&skipvs=T Best Chitra