Question about Setup

Discussion in 'Speakers & Subwoofers' started by Pat Moynahan, Jul 16, 2003.

  1. Pat Moynahan

    Pat Moynahan Auditioning

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    Hi Everyone,
    I just bought a new Cerwin Vega LW12 and I had a couple of questions about the setup.

    My System:
    Receiver: Denon AVR-1803
    Fronts: Klipsch SF-1 (30Hz-20kHz±3dB)
    Center: Klipsch SC-1 (60Hz-20kHz±3dB)
    Surround Right and Left: Klipsch SS-1 (65Hz-20kHz±3dB)
    Rear Center: Bose Single Cube (Not Sure of Frequency)
    Subwoofer: Cerwin Vega LW-12 (30Hz-150Hz) Crossover Continuously variable from 40 - 120 Hz @ 18 dB/ octave

    1) I was wondering how I should hook up the subwoofer, whether to run the front channels to the subwoofer and then hook my front speakers up to subwoofer or to use the sub-out on my receiver? Is it possible (recommended) to do both?

    2) If I hook up the subwoofer using the sub-out I would need to use a y connector, what brand of cable should I use? I was thinking about buying an RCA 15' Subwoofer Cable or an RCA 30' Subwoofer Cable (Models #'s DT15SB and DT30SB respectively). Would the difference between the 15' and 30' have any degradation in signal?

    3)I was wondering how to determine what crossover frequency to use. Above I listed all my speaker and their frequency range.

    Thanks for your help.

    - Pat
     
  2. Mike Sloan

    Mike Sloan Second Unit

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    First off....how are you using the Bose "single cube" as the rear center? I think you would also need to use the Bose bass module so as to send the proper crossover to the cube.I think the cubes crossover at 120hz or above! I also need more information. How many subs are you running? If just one..why would you need a Y connector. Assuming you have one sub...I would start out by assigning all speakers as small and subwoofer "on." Crossover should be set at 80hz. Disable/bypass the crossover on the sub (if you can't, then turn the crossover (on the sub) to its highest setting to get it out of the way) and let the Denon send 80hz and below to the sub. Hook up the sub to the subwoofer out on the Denon.

    The difference between a 15 or 30 foot cable is negligible. I have used RG6 quad shielded Sat cable (terminated with RCA connectors from Rat Shack) with great results! I ran over 100 feet!

    ps...dump the Bose and run Klipsch for the rear center. It will sound better with your other speakers and be a better impedance match to your receiver!
     
  3. Pat Moynahan

    Pat Moynahan Auditioning

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    The "single cube" Bose speaker I picked up for about $40 and I am using it for the rear center because it is small and easily mounted. The impedance on it is rated at 8ohms and max power at 100 watts, so it's not that bad of a mismatch other than the crossover frequency (which is trivial to me while watching movies and listening to music), but I do agree that having another Klipsch for the rear center would be best.

    I am running one sub. I need a Y adapter because the only inputs on the back of the sub are stereo RCA and stereo speaker terminals, no mono RCA connections. The purpose of this is to have the sub capture the low frequencies and pass the mid and highs to the speakers (if connected like this).

    Another question, what is the correct crossover frequency for the Klipsch speakers I have? Also, how much of a role does shielding play with subs? And would the cable models I listed above be a good choice? Thanks.

    - Pat
     
  4. Mike Sloan

    Mike Sloan Second Unit

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    You don't need to hook up to both sub inputs (line level). Just run a single cable from sub out on Denon to either L or R sub in on the sub. The Denon is summing all bass from 80hz and below..as well as adding in the LFE and sending it out the single sub out...don't need to use Y..unless running 2 subs.

    Even though your front are rated to 30hz...set all speakers small. If you can select crossover for the "small" speakers...set it at 80hz. I have played around with this and even though I have full range speakers in the front...I have achieved the best results with the above setup. If you could set just the front to 60hz that would be ok....everything else needs to be 80HZ and above.

    I have not been able to discern any audible difference between "properly" constructed sub cables. Just go with a goos shielded cable.

    Subs use big magnets so keep it away from direct view TV's.
     
  5. Pat Moynahan

    Pat Moynahan Auditioning

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    I need a Y-connector for the connection--> O Red O White In O Subwoofer (Mono Out)
     
  6. Lew Crippen

    Lew Crippen Executive Producer

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    I’ll state first off that I don’t know anything about the particular subsoofer.

    However, as it seems as though it is intended to take the R/L front audio feeds as inputs (before the front speakers), and pass along the non-low bass frequencies to the front speakers.

    If this is the case, the receiver settings should be as follows: center—small, surrounds—small and front speakers—large. Select No or Off for the subwoofer setting on the receiver. So far we are sending the full frequency range to the sub (and potentially along to the fronts) and everything above the low bass to the center and surrounds. By selecting no for the sub setting, we are also passing all of the Low Frequency Effects (LFE) channel (the .1 in the 5.1) to the sub (and fronts).

    Now we need to set the crossovers. Set the crossover in the sub and in the receiver to the same values. Looking at your speakers I’d recommend 80hz as a starting point, but you might like 90hz or 100hz also (or even higher). Now the rear center won’t be able to go as low as 80hz–120hz, but that is most likely not too important.

    The receiver will now pass to the ‘small’ speakers everything above your crossover setting (80hz for example). The receiver will send all the frequencies to the ‘large’ speakers (plus the LFE) and the sub will pass only those frequencies above its crossover setting (again 80hz ) to the front speakers.

    Of course with this setup, you have the option to send even the lower bass to your front speakers by changing the sub crossover. But I would recommend not doing so as a starting point. See how this setup works. And experiment with different setting. Use what sounds best to you, not what any of us recommend. After all the settings you like best are the best.

    Good luck and have fun.
     
  7. Pat Moynahan

    Pat Moynahan Auditioning

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    Lew,
    My receiver regardless of what the crossover is set to, if the sub is off the crossover frequency is off (I believe) and the only limiter of frequencies is the large or small settings (I believe). I also stick to the theory that what sounds best to you is best. I am going to go home and try both of the settings and see which one I like best. Thanks.

    - Pat
     
  8. Lew Crippen

    Lew Crippen Executive Producer

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    I think (and I stress the word ‘think’) that the crossover will still be operative even with the sub set to off. This is so you can change the lower limit of what is sent to the ‘small’ speakers.

    Setting the sub to off should just cause the LFE channel to be sent to the ‘large’ speakers. The crossover should change what is sent to the small speakers regardless of the sub setting.

    At least that is how the receivers with which I am familiar work. YMMV, of course.

    In any case have fun. Let us know what works best for you.
     
  9. Pat Moynahan

    Pat Moynahan Auditioning

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    What I have finally done, which works great!: is I bought a 30' Subwoofer cable with a Y-Connector and plugged my sub to my sub out plug. I set my two front speakers to large and the rest to small. I then set my crossover frequency(on my receiver) to 80Mhz and about 50-55Mhz on my subwoofer. With my front speakers set to Large all frequencies are passed to them. My fronts have a response down to 30Mhz but don't play them loud enough. So my sub takes over the job. Thank you everyone that gave me advice.
     

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