Q: Pioneer DV-47A Chip/Feedback

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by Patrick Zapatka, May 23, 2002.

  1. Patrick Zapatka

    Patrick Zapatka Stunt Coordinator

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    Hello!

    Anyone know what chip is in the Pioneer DV-47A?

    A salesman told me it was the Faroujda DCDi, but I cannot find any solid info that states it is DCDi, Sage, Genesis, proprietary, etc.

    Any experience on the DVD-A and SACD side? How about using it with a Toshiba 65H80? I am currently utilizing the Sony 9000ES, and am looking to upgrade to multi-channel SACD and DVD-A. Thanks,

    Patrick
     
  2. Jake RMC

    Jake RMC Auditioning

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    It is a proprietary chip, not the Faroujda
     
  3. Rob Roth

    Rob Roth Stunt Coordinator

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    Patrick,

    My situation is very similar to yours. I also have had the 9000ES for over a year and was looking for a way to test the mch waters. I borrowed a 47A from Tweeter and demoed it for several days, including direct comparisons, when possible, with the 9000ES.

    My overall take is that this is a fine machine for someone getting into HT, the capabilities are numerous and the quality is quite good. Specifically:

    1.) DVD-Audio sounds very good. I am sufficiently impressed to keep the player on this basis alone.

    2.) CDs sound better on the 9000ES- even with the 47A's upsampling engaged (Legato feature)and the 'Hi-Bit' engaged. Bass response is marginally better with 47A, but the 9000 is more musical, better detailed, much better microdynamics. Altogether, the Sony is more believable.

    3.) Stereo SACD comparison is very similar. Both these comparisons were done with levels matched to .5 dB, using identical cables (Monster 950's).

    4. Video performance is very close- no clear winner but the problem may be that I have an older, non-p set.

    5.) Mch SACD was a treat, but my experience is that SACD uses the effect channels less aggressively than DVD-Audio does. of course this may change with time.

    6.) The 47A's fit and finish are disappointing.

    BTW, both of these units were powered by the PS Audio P300 AC regenerator. I suspect that this benefitted the Pioneer to a greater degree since the light weight implies less substantial power supply circuits.

    Bottom line, I bought the unit for 3 main reasons:

    1.) DVD-Audio capability
    2.) Ability to get even a compromised version of mch SACD through one set of outputs. Like man6y, my pre/pro section only has 1 set of mch analog inputs. If mch SACD 'wins the war' I may have to revisit this decision. In that case the Pioneer is still valuable as a 2nd player or as a gift/sale.
    3.) Usefulness as a backup player. The 9000ES is pretty robust, but stuff breaks and service can take a while. I might also send the 9000 out for mods.

    I can give you more detail here or via email.

    rob
     
  4. Patrick Zapatka

    Patrick Zapatka Stunt Coordinator

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    Rob,

    Thank you for the very informative comparison.

    In addition, after posting the question and doing more research, the 47A still has the chroma bug, so I will continue to wait.

    Patrick
     
  5. Stan T

    Stan T Stunt Coordinator

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    Patrick I have the DV-47A paired up with a 65" Pioneer Elite 710 & I don't see the chroma bug. If the player does have it then it is not noticable to me and that's on a 65" screen. Instead of just taking someone's word that the player has the chroma bug go to a dealer & look at it for yourself on a large display T.V. See if you can notice it.

    The player gives a great picture & has 10bit video DACs. I'm extremely happy with my purchase of this player.
     
  6. Kevin C Brown

    Kevin C Brown Producer

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    I have the DV-05 which also has the chroma bug. I have a properly calibrated 32" Panasonic SuperFlat TV, and have never seen the effect either. But obviously, ymmv...
     
  7. Andrew_Ballew

    Andrew_Ballew Second Unit

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  8. Rob Roth

    Rob Roth Stunt Coordinator

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    For the benefit of those contemplating purchase of this machine I'd like to clarify my comments. If this machine had been available when I started in HT I'd have snapped it up. It is a fine introductory machine and a great value, not the least because it simplifies cabling issues. Someone starting to build a serious system could certainly use this piece for some time before they feel the need for separate components. As I write this I'm listening to the unit doing mch SACD- not bad at all.
     
  9. Lee Scoggins

    Lee Scoggins Producer

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    I have heard the SACD performance and it is lacking.

    Unfortunately, if you want a universal machine this is the only reasonable option. Just don't expect top quality SACD performance.
     
  10. Dzung Pham

    Dzung Pham Second Unit

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    Lee, did you have a chance to A/B the Pioneer with any other SACD player? Rob Roth above seems to think that the 47a is of similar quality to the 9000es for SACDs. The latest SGHT also finds the sound quality for the 47a and 9000es on SACDs to be comparable. If this is true, how would the 47a/9000es compare to the 775, 222es, or the 555es? I'm sure many people have heard the 9000es in relation to these other players so it might be useful to make an indirect comparison to rate the capabilities of the 47a. I certainly don't think one should expect top quality SACD playback from the Pioneer, but perhaps quality on par with the 222es.
     
  11. Lee Scoggins

    Lee Scoggins Producer

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    Dzung,

    I A/Bed it with the SCD-777ES (a bit unrealistic given the price difference but a good reference point) and the 9000ES. I read the SGHT and disagree with their assessment although it was not quite as you describe it-see the article. The 9000ES was significantly better in terms of Super Audio performance. The SCD777ES was significantly better as one would expect. The 47A probably has some jitter issues.

    As an audiophile, I am just concerned about people drawing broad conclusions of DVDA versus SACD based on this player alone, because it has neither the best implementation of either format.

    I have not heard the other players you mentioned, but my record engineer friends believe the 775 at just $180 (street) beats the 47A, which kind of surprises me. The Absolute Sound gave the 775 a great review in the June issue just out.

    This begs the question, do you buy a 47A or a mid-level ($600) DVDA and add the Sony 775 as a separate SACD player for $180?

    Just food for thought. I still think the Pioneer is a good deal for its universal nature and I certainly don't mean to disparage any one's purchases on the Forum.
     
  12. Phil A

    Phil A Producer

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    I previously owned and used the 9000ES in my bedroom system and sold it and got the DV-47A just to have the ability to play all formats. I did extensive comparisons of each (separately since I sold the 9000ES before getting the DV-47A) on reference systems against a Marantz SA-14 reference 2-channel SACD player. The systems used in many cases were over $100k in total. There is no comparison on 2-channel SACD between the 9000ES and DV-47A. I still feel that the DV-47A is a good package in my situation and I am happy with the move I made. I also had a chance to compare 2-channel SACD between the DV-47A and the Sony (model 500) DVD/multi-channel SACD and felt the DV-47A was a drop better. That Sony lists for around $300 and several places have it for a little over $200. So in terms of 2-channel SACD playback, I would term the DV-47A as entry level. In terms of built quality it is lacking vs. something like the 9000ES. I put a set of Bright Star stick on feet underneath ($12.50 for a set of 4) and that helped a lot. As far as everything else goes, the Pioneer is very good. The Marantz universal player (model 8300) should be out in July, but I hear $2k as a list. I suspect that Pioneer will make more machines, some of better quality and some perhaps a little lesser, as well as other manufacturers. I feel that Pioneer did well at this point in time to get a machine out the door at its price point.
     
  13. Rob Roth

    Rob Roth Stunt Coordinator

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    I'm continuing to do A/B tests between the 9000ES and the 47A. I have already established, as have others, that the 9000's performance on 2ch SACD is better than the 47A's. The superiority is definite and is not dependent on source material. The superior musicality is such that I often prefer the 9000's 2ch performance over the 47A's mch of the same disc.

    Last night I put a lot of Reference Recordings and some rock/pop CDs through the A/B process. On better quality recordings the 9000 does a much better job of resolving detail and providing the microdynamics. On the pop stuff the verdict is less clear- but I know that is due to the idiosyncratic ways pop music is recorded.

    Today I started comparing concert DVDs, using the digital outputs of the 2 machines. The results clearly favor the 9000, but the cables are not equivalent (the 9000 has a Green Hornet and the Pioneer a low end Monster).

    All this aside, I still say this is a good unit for someone making a first foray into the bewildering world of competing formats which is the current situation in HT. For more experienced cognoscenti the player's value lies in the opportunity to inexpensively experiment with the mch formats and, perhaps, stick with the DVDA. It can also serve as a backup player since the video seems good.

    I've picked up 10 DVDA titles or so to see how much I like the format. There is a tremendous range in how the surrounds are used!!!

    If anyone is interested I'll continue to report on my experiences.
     

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