Pre-Amps

Discussion in 'AV Receivers' started by Josh:Lyn, Sep 27, 2005.

  1. Josh:Lyn

    Josh:Lyn Auditioning

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    Hey again. I have a question. In my previous post I talked about upgrading my receiver, now its about pre-amps. I am going to get a higher end receiver and one that will have pre-amp inputs. My question is what do you guys think of getting a pre-amp? what do I look for? and how much should I be looking to spend?
     
  2. Wayne Ernst

    Wayne Ernst Cinematographer

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    1) Most of the pre-amps that compare in price with the higher-end receivers will not offer you the capability to have an automatic setup and room EQ like the receiver will. However, Outlaw Audio and Sherwood have the feature in their pre/pro for a price range of $1,000 - $1,300. Others will follow, but it will be a bit more time.

    2) Why not consider a higher-end receiver that is a few years old? It should have pre-outs. It may not have the room EQ, but the price should be right - and the performance quite good.
     
  3. Josh:Lyn

    Josh:Lyn Auditioning

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    Thanks for your response Wayne. I was not aware of that about the whole room EQ, thats something new to me.

    I am looking to get a high end Denon or Pioneer Elite becuase of the discount I can get on the the two, but if Outlaw would be a better way to go, I will definatly look into it.

    I asked some of the guys I worked with and they said that I don't need a pre-amp, that a higher end Denon or Pioneer Elite can do just fine, but on the other hand I read about them and hear people say how much a difference they make when listening to music. I know that listening to music on either of those high end recievers is awesome, but I just wanted to see what people on here thought about the pre-amp idea. So keep em coming if you can, thanks so much, maybe you can also convince me I don't need it ha. Thanks again.

    Josh
     
  4. ChrisWiggles

    ChrisWiggles Producer

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    really depends on your budget, separates is a goal to shoot for if you have the means, but I would probably put more money and care into things like speakeer choice and acoustics rather than trying to jump prematurely into separates if you're on that budget edge. There are a number of very nice mid-fi and high-end receivers out there from marantz, rotel, denon etc etc etc. That being said, if you're building a more serious dedicated system and have the budget, some anthem separates would be where I'd be steering towards.
     
  5. Andrew Pratt

    Andrew Pratt Producer

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    Pre amps should have a lower noise floor then their receiver counter parts but the real gains come from the separate power supplies in the amplifiers.

    Personally depending on which "high end" receiver you're looking at I'd rather see you go for the Sherwood or Outlaw combo's.
     
  6. Josh:Lyn

    Josh:Lyn Auditioning

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    Thanks again for your responses. Given what both of you have said, I am more then likely going a higher end Denon route. I am not aware if Denon makes a pre-amp, but I am going to go the Denon way I think, so given that what do you all think I should look into for as something to put with that as a pre later on? I am just going the Denon route cuz I can get a really good deal on a new one. Thanks again.
     
  7. ChrisWiggles

    ChrisWiggles Producer

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    Most high end receivers (including most denon's I've seen) have full complements of Pre-ins and outs, so you can later on use just the amps sections and add your own pre/pro, or use the processing of the denon and add better separate amps, for instance. This is a fairly handy upgrading path for a lot of people, as you aren't fully replacing a components with new ones, but adding on to your system to improve performance in steps.
     
  8. Josh:Lyn

    Josh:Lyn Auditioning

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    Thanks for your response Chris. What pre-amp do you recommend? I am just looking in some sort of direction to head in. Thanks again!
     
  9. ChrisWiggles

    ChrisWiggles Producer

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    any number of brands make pre/pros, though I am partial to Anthem myself.
     
  10. Josh:Lyn

    Josh:Lyn Auditioning

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    Ok very cool. So when I go to get lets say an Anthem Pre/Pro this unit would be the first to receive any signal, then I would plug it into my new Denon, correct?
     
  11. ChrisWiggles

    ChrisWiggles Producer

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    Well, you could get a separate processor and then you'd just us the amp potion of the Denon, you'd use the denon's pre-ins. You could also do it the other way around, and use the denon as basically just a processor, and hook up seaprate amplifiers.
     
  12. Josh:Lyn

    Josh:Lyn Auditioning

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    Ok so now I have confused myself. So if I get the new Denon receiver(which would be surround) I would run the pre-amp into the Denon. Or is that wrong? I am just wanting better sound for my music, tell me if I am thinking of this wrong, or if I have the basic idea down. Thanks again for all your help.
     
  13. Arthur S

    Arthur S Cinematographer

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    Since you can get a really good discount on Denon, why not get the 4806 and see if it meets your needs? Very highly regarded, and if you find it lacking in any way, you could sell it for about what you paid and start over.

    Unless you have unusually demanding speakers and listen at very, very high levels, the Denon probably will get the job done for you all by itself.
     
  14. FeisalK

    FeisalK Screenwriter

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    Josh

    Your Denon is already a pre-amp. I think you might have to revisit some terminology

    in the stereo world you have a basic stereo integrated amplifier which has a
    1) pre-amplifier
    2) power amplifier
    built into one chassis. (you can also have a stereo receiver which has 1+2 with a tuner section added)

    to get better sound and more power, people would separate the two into two boxes and you get a pre-amplifier and a stereo power amplifier. You can split the power amp into single channel monoblocks which is even more powerful and better sounding.

    Now, the Denon is a AV receiver, which means that it has a
    1) pre-amp section
    2) processor section
    3) a amplifier section and
    4) a tuner
    built into one chassis

    To get better sound and accommodate more powerful amplifiers the AV receiver can be broken down into two boxes, i.e pre-amplifier+processor (or pre/pro, like the Anthem mentioned above) and multichannel power amplifiers.

    of course, you can substitute the multichannel power amplifer with a combination of stereo amplifiers or a monoblock for each channel. (can you see it becoming more and more expensive?)

    What normally happens is.. you get a receiver first, and enjoy it immensely... for a while. Then you start feeling dissatisfied with the power output of the receiver - then buy a stereo power amp just for the front two channels, or a multichannel power amp to totally replace the amplifier section of your receiver.

    Then you think, well I might as well replace the receiver with a pre/pro as I'm not using the amp section of the receiver.
     
  15. Eric_Bender

    Eric_Bender Agent

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    Josh,

    Adding to what FeisalK said. If you purchase the Denon Receiver, you can use that as a Pre-Amp and add an Amplifier to your system to better drive your speakers. This is the most common method.

    The preamp section on most receivers are usually pretty decent, receivers usually have to compromize on their amplifier sections for space savings, so they do not get as good components as a pure class A/B amplifier. This is why they have a PreAmp out section, to allow the enthusiast to connect a better amplifier to drive their speakers.

    Hope this helps to clarify.
     
  16. FeisalK

    FeisalK Screenwriter

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    Eric, thanks.. i meant to say that too but got carried away.. :b
     
  17. JackS

    JackS Supporting Actor

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    Josh- You are a little confused. Listen to these guys. If your going to get a pre amp(processor) in the near future, forget about buying a receiver. With your new pre-amp purchase you must buy an amp for power.
    This is the best but rather costly solution.
    On the other hand you could buy a Denon receiver and add an amp (not pre-amp). Not quite as good as the first option but much cheaper.
    Many of us here are using the second option quite satisfactorly. Your choice.
     
  18. lee ison

    lee ison Stunt Coordinator

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    buy yourself a nice high-end rec(brand of your choice) and a decent poweramp and be done with it. at this point any other path would be a waste of money, if you really want a better system ,invest in some high-end speakers of your liking,provided your combo can drive them.
     
  19. Josh:Lyn

    Josh:Lyn Auditioning

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    I
     
  20. Josh:Lyn

    Josh:Lyn Auditioning

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    I really do appreciate everyones input on this subject. I have learned quite a bit. Thanks so much again. Ill let you all know what happens in the future.
     

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