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Power cuts out on Pioneer receiver...

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by Kevin_R_H, Oct 22, 2002.

  1. Kevin_R_H

    Kevin_R_H Stunt Coordinator

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    Hello all. I own a Pioneer VSXD-908S receiver, which I have been using for about 4 months. Just recently, I hooked rear speakers up to this receiver. Until then, I had only mains, center and sub.

    Since the rear speakers have been added, the power of the receiver clicks off after about 40 minutes of CD and/or DVD pleasure. I turn the power back on, and it will stay on for maybe 1 minute. After that it won't stay on at all. It almost acts as if it is overheating.

    Two points:
    1) If I then turn off the source (CD / DVD), the receiver stays on - no problem.
    2) Or if I disconnect the wires to the rear speakers, the receiver stays on - no problem.

    What could be happening that would cause the presence of Speaker wires to power off this amp (only if there is a signal coming through)??

    Thanks for any help and/or insight.
     
  2. Brae

    Brae Supporting Actor

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    Kevin,

    Am I seeing double, or was this posted elsewhere? AVS?
     
  3. Kevin_R_H

    Kevin_R_H Stunt Coordinator

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    Brae,

    Are you sure?? With the same amp??

    It wasn't me. I did call their Warranty Dept yesterday. If these guys are looking for help fixing my receiver on one of these boards, I've got a real problem.

    I hope your reply doesn't keep someone with insight from assisting me.

    Kevin
     
  4. Brae

    Brae Supporting Actor

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    Sorry, my bad. It was someone on HTF and the 608 model. Read that thread here, by Gary Coker.
    Maybe you two can get together and but heads? I've been similar things on AVS, and HTF, regarding the VSX-45TX and shutdown condition testing.
    Cheers!
     
  5. John Royster

    John Royster Screenwriter

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    At what volume level are you listening? If its low level then something is awry.

    It you're listening at a good level (loud or ludicrously loud) it is probably just too much for the receiver to handle and it is overheating.

    What is the impedance of all speakers? If you let the receiver rest for 10 - 15 minutes does it function for longer than a few minutes?

    Also - check and double check all speaker connections, even a single strand touching the chassis can cause problems.
     
  6. John Garcia

    John Garcia Executive Producer

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    WHAT SPEAKERS?! How are they connected (shorted wire somewhere, wire ga. vs length)? What are your speaker settings?

    Sounds like an impedance problem, since you say it didn't happen until you hooked up more speakers. You are dropping the impedance to a level this receiver cannot handle. Try hooking one speaker up at a time. If it shuts off when you add the third or fourth speaker, this could be the issue.

    Have you tried out each speaker on one main channel to see that they all function properly? You could have a damaged or shorted speaker, which might potentially cause this as well.
     
  7. Kevin_R_H

    Kevin_R_H Stunt Coordinator

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    Thanks for all your help. I will go and read some of the info on the AVS board - perhaps there is something to be learned there.

    As to my setup at home. My main speakers are Thiel CS-3.5, which are 4 ohm speakers. All other speakers are by Acoustic Reasearch circa 1997 (Let me see... The Edge for surrounds, 25HO for Center, and some 12" subwoofer). I'm not sure of their impedence.

    The volume has never been turned up loud for any of these "cut-offs". For example, this past Saturday night, it happened when my wife and I were watching "What About Bob" - not exactly a high energy movie. And my wife doesn't really care for real loud effects anyway.

    The speaker wire to the Thiels and the center are pretty high quality stuff. However, the speaker wire to the surrounds was put in by my home builder (behind the drywall), and it's not real impressive (probably 1/15th the thickness of the other cable). And these runs to the surrounds are VERY long - one is probably 60', and the other is probably 80'. Based upon what a couple of you are saying, this looks to be the likely culprit.

    The receiver is not warm to the touch at all.

    I set the Thiels to "large", subwoofer to "plus", center channel to "large", and I've tried the rears as "large" and "small". On the receiver, I also set the impedence for the fronts to the "6 ohm or lower" setting.

    I will double-check all speaker connections to ensure there are no wires out of place.

    Again, thanks for all your help.

    Kevin
     
  8. Kevin_R_H

    Kevin_R_H Stunt Coordinator

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    Well, after reading the other threads, it seems my best recourse is to get the Thiels off the receiver. I still have a 1980 Yamaha M-4 power amp that I guess I can use to power the mains, so the Pioneer is just driving the center and surrounds.

    Of course, the length of speaker cable runs to the surrounds may still cause problems.

    Thanks again,
    Kevin
     
  9. Brae

    Brae Supporting Actor

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    Kevin, there is always something to be learned elsewhere no matter where you are. [​IMG] If I have it right, the receiver is a [email protected], but the cheesy Pioneer website offers little else informational-wise for non-registered users.
    I'd first make sure the receiver is capable of driving 4-ohm impedance speakers as your main loudspeakers are 4-ohms rated. I know on my Elite I have an option of 6-8 ohms and 8 or more ohms for speaker selection, which can cause headaches for those using 4-ohm loudspeakers.
    Next, I'd consider the difference between Large and Small for speaker classification. I may be wrong, but I believe it is the difference, in Pioneer philosophy, to mean whether or not you want a given channel (hence speaker) to handle bass reproduction or not.
    This means that if your main lodspeakers are full-range and you have a weak bass then select Large, but if they are not full-range and or you have sufficient bass reproduction capabilities in your subwoofer(s) then slect Small. I think this simply adjusts the default crossover for each channel for the lower frequencies.
    I could not find the CS3.5 on the Theil website, but found the 3.6. Assuming (maybe incorrectly) these are an upgrade of the 3.5. If so, the frequency response of the 3.6 is all the way down to 29Hz, and the drivers include a 10" bass driver. Indeed, they are full-range speakers.
    Since the recommended power is from 100-500Watts, god, get them the hell off that receiver and use an external amplifier. I'd love to borrow these and give them a whirl, but I'm already dealing with very similar problems on my Paradigm Studio 100's with their 15-350W needs as a full-range speaker (my receiver cuts off, too).
     
  10. Brae

    Brae Supporting Actor

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    Does the VSX-D908S have preouts? This will be a requirement for external amplification. Also, get someone from the audio/HT world into your home to pull better wire for your surrounds.

    From your description(s), 60 and 80 foot runs for the speakers mentioned will definitely drive the receiver hard on those channels, and probably the receiver's power supply overall. Although the are 8-ohm surrounds requiring little power, the guage wire being used can be considered a significant resistive load.

     
  11. Brae

    Brae Supporting Actor

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  12. Kevin_R_H

    Kevin_R_H Stunt Coordinator

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    Brae,
    I really appreciate all your help. My knowledge leans much more towards 2-channel music vs HT setups, so I feel pretty frustrated with this receiver situation. This weekend, I will have plenty of time to try out all theories.
    As to your new questions:
    Although it seems reasonable to assume the CS-3.6 replaced the CS-3.5, its price is considerably more. Based upon price, it seems the CS-2.3 is more of a match for my speakers (which were purchased in 1989). However, the bass response of mine are rated down to 22Hz (when using their external equalizer box). I don't remember the "recommended power minimum", but I would assume 100W is close. My old Yamaha power amp is rated at 120W into 8 Ohm, and 170W into 4 ohm. There's never been a problem with compatability.
    I only have one subwoofer - I meant to say I have 'some 12" subwoofer' from AR. I just don't remember its name. In fact, in my main system upstairs I have no subwoofer at all. Of course, VMPS RM40s are in no need of assistance with bass [​IMG] .
    The room with the Pioneer is huge - it is our Family Room. It is probably 30' wide x 15' deep x 22' high. I'm afraid that if the Pioneer doesn't have preouts to my old Yamaha, the "cheapest" solution will be to take the rear speakers out of the system. This will be a shame, as the builder didn't run that cabling for free, and I will have no use for these AR Edge speakers. But this Pioneer receiver is only 6 months old - I'm not getting rid of it anytime soon (particularly since it's not a part of my main system anyway).
    Again, Brae, thanks for your assistance. I now have a pretty good idea what I need to try. And sending this receiver back to some Warranty Dept isn't going to solve a thing. In their veiw, it's going to be working properly.
    Kevin
     
  13. Brae

    Brae Supporting Actor

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    Kevin, thanks for the enlightenement. [​IMG]
     

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