Please explain to a newbie how the HK-525 does bass mgnt for DVD-A/SACD.

Discussion in 'AV Receivers' started by John Pine, Nov 14, 2003.

  1. John Pine

    John Pine Supporting Actor

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    I'm a new 525 owner and I am now shopping for a universal player. But before I buy, I think I should understand the bass mgnt that the 525 offers. The manual is not much help, it reads like an engineering "tech" manual.
     
  2. Marty M

    Marty M Cinematographer

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    This receiver will not give you any bass management for DVD-A or SACD. The bass management is for digital only. The DVD-A/SACD is analog and the only bass management would be through the Outlaw ICBM.
     
  3. John Pine

    John Pine Supporting Actor

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  4. Rick Ewing

    Rick Ewing Agent

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    This is not correct. The H/K 525 employs a digital crossover circuit that is optional on the analog inputs. What that means is that the input from the analog inputs from DVD-A or SACD recordings is "redigitized", and then the appropiate frequencies are sent to the proper outputs. You have the flexibility to set different crossover points for the fronts, center and rears respectively, hence Harman Kardon's designation "Triple X-over".

    The new H/K 630 receiver takes that one step further by seperating the crossover configuration for the rear and side speakers to allow maximum flexibility. This is great for someone like me that has full towers in the rear, but will have dipoles on the side walls that don't have the same sonic range as the rears.

    The digital crossover design has one draw back: it's possible that the digital conversion (and subsequent analog conversion again) can degrade the quality of the signal. But I haven't heard any serious complaints from other owners of this receiver. The digital crossover is optional, in case you have towers that can handle a full signal, or have a DVD-A/SACD player with proper bass management (rare, but more are appearing) or if you have an external bass manager like the Outlaw ICBM.
     
  5. John Pine

    John Pine Supporting Actor

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    Rick: Do I have to enable this feature or does it just use the same crossover/bass mgnt that's already setup? Is it referenced in the manual?
     
  6. Rick Ewing

    Rick Ewing Agent

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    First, you need to setup what crossover frequencies you're going to use in the on-screen setup (Speaker Setup menu). The H/K 525 allows you to set crossover frequencies for all inputs (GLOBAL) or if you want complete comtrol, you can set crossover frequencies settings to be different for every input (CD, DVD, VCR, Video1, etc). Use the INDEPENDANT setting in the Speaker setup menu for that. if you use the Indepedant setting, you will have to first select which input you want to work with, then enter the on screen display, find the Speaker Setup and work with it.

    Use the "small" speaker type on any speaker you want a crossover setting. Keep in mind that all that "large" and "small" mean is "does this set of speakers need a crossover or not to send its bass frequencies to a subwoofer?". Most likely, you'll use small for all your speakers regardless of how big in physical size they really are. Only certain speakers that truly handle frequencies down to 20 hz should be configured as large in most cases (If you had Definitive Technology towers with their built in subwoofer, this would apply). All this is discussed on page 22 and 23 in your manual.

    Finally for your analog inputs for DVD-A and SACD: The H/K 525 has two analog settings you can choose from. If you select the input "6-channel DVD Audio", then it will redigitize the input and apply your triple crossover frequencies settings to them. If you choose "8 channel Audio", then it leaves the analog inputs alone and passes a full signal to your speakers. Use 8 channel if you already have bass management working in your player, or are using an Outlaw ICBM. Your manual on page 27 discusses this also.

    Does this help?
     
  7. John Pine

    John Pine Supporting Actor

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    Rick I see it, that helps a lot thanks! All of mine are set to small as mentioned. I'll play around with it when I get home. One last question, what Uni-player are you using?
     
  8. Rick Ewing

    Rick Ewing Agent

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    I don't have a uni-player. I do have a Sony DVD/SACD changer which has six-channel analog outputs for the SACD playback. Since the Sony has no bass management on the SACD signals, I've tried both the H/K triple crossover and an Outlaw ICBM during the audition period when I had a H/K 525 in house. I'm still thinking of picking one up, since the prices are so low as H/K has recently discontinued the model.
     
  9. AndrewKC

    AndrewKC Agent

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  10. David_Fr

    David_Fr Auditioning

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    I have tried the BM on my AVR 525 with my Pioneer 563 and in my opinion it changes the signal. I do not if it worse, but it sounds more like home theater than SACD or DVD-A. The depth seems to be lacking, but that is my opinion.
     
  11. Andy_Steb

    Andy_Steb Stunt Coordinator

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    Just to clear some things up, the 525 has four settings for the analog inputs (6 CH Direct, 6 CH DVD Audio, 8 CH Direct and 8 CH DVD Audio)

    Since the 525 is a 7.1 receiver it added the 8 channels on the analogs. But the 6 CH Direct or 6 CH DVD Audio are the two settings you will use for Hi-Res music.

    The 6 channel direct mode is for using the uni-players built in bass management.
    The 6 channel DVD audio is for the HK to apply bass management. A thing to note here is that, if the HK does the Bass management the signal will be converted from analog to digital then back to analog. But you can use any number of crossover points the receiver offers, not just ones the player offers.

    BTW I Highly recommend the Denon 2900
     
  12. John Pine

    John Pine Supporting Actor

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    Thanks for the clarification guys!

    Andy: I've heard some great reviews about the 2900 but the 5" height is a real problem. I've only got about 4.25"(MAX) clearance for an uni-player. I may have to consider going with the 2200 instead. Question? Is the 5" height accurate on the 2900 and can the legs be removed? Thanks, John!
     
  13. Andy_Steb

    Andy_Steb Stunt Coordinator

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    even if you remove the leggs the 2900 will run in at 4 3/4 inches
     
  14. John Pine

    John Pine Supporting Actor

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    Damn! @#*%! Hey.......it was worth a shot, right? Thanks for checking Andy!
     

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