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plasma image retention (1 Viewer)

keenwatcher

Stunt Coordinator
Joined
Nov 2, 2006
Messages
51
Real Name
sean
Hi out there,

I've posted before on a few different topics (favorite film genres and others), and I think I will be posting a bit more in the near future, I like to discuss movies on dvd.

My question here is:

Can anyone give me feedback about plasma image retention?

I have been watching old sixties t.v. shows on dvd (via hdmi cable and an upconverter 1080p dvd player), and the screen has two vertical bars on each side (cut down to 4:3 ratio), i have been wanting to watch it in 4:3 original aspect ratio (and not stretching it to fill the widescreen image). However, I tried two different approaches- the first was simply letting the dvd play in 4:3 format and the second was to use the aspect ratio button on my t.v. remote to goto 4:3 (and then it displays two grey bars on each side). I notice that there is a very visible vertical line on each side of the previous t.v. image (which I discovered is called image retention), the image retention is not as bad with using the grey 4:3 aspect ratio (the vertical lines are less apparent). So far, when watching another dvd filling the entire screen, the imperfections or ghost images (after images) of vertical lines go away.

In my owners manual it says:

Do not display a picture in 4:3 for an extended period as this can cause "image retention" to remain on either or both sides of the display field. To reduce the risk of such "image retention", change the brightness of the side bars.

I came across another person's post here at HTF about this "image retention" and someone replied "don't worry about it, as long as you watch a full screen refreshing show, it should go away, disappear. Its not the same thing as burn in".

My problem is, I will be watching an entire series of 4:3 tv shows on dvd and am wondering, should i stretch it (and thereby distort the original aspect ratio) and put up with the stretched image? In fear of image retention or burn in?

This also brings up a similar problem with letterboxed movies on dvd and the horizontal lines they create to display the original theatrical aspect ratio.

I notice there too, are image retention horizontal lines after turning off the dvd player. However, so far they seem to fade and disappear after viewing something that fills the entire screen for about an hour or two.

Can someone explain the difference between "image retention" and "burn in"?

I also notice that the input source selected (hdmi, or component/cable) show different backgrounds when the source (dvd player hdmi cable, or digital cable box) is turned off.

There are problems too with the logo's (usually in the lower right hand corner of the tv) of various cable news tv channels leaving "image retention" effects on the plasma tv screen, that can be seen seconds and minutes after turning off the cable box. They too seem to go away after watching something on tv without definite bright logo's that appear in the lower right hand corner.

Is this something I should worry about? or put up with? Will the "image retention" lead into a more serious problem like burn in?

There's no way to get around the logo problem, especially if one likes to watch alot of news channels... like some news-hounds out there (I have been one in the past, but less so lately)

Any input on this matter would be appreciated....
 

troy evans

Screenwriter
Joined
Jul 2, 2005
Messages
1,294
Image retention and "burn in" are very different. Image retention happens when a still image or station logo stays on your screen for a few minutes and after a few minutes of veiwing without it there it goes away. This is common and not unusual in plasmas." Burn in" is really the wrong term, What's really happening is the phosphers are being aged at an excellerated rate due to the fact that settings like "contrast" and "bright" are set way to high on tvs. You should set contrast and brightness below the halfway point on your picture settings in the tvs menu. If you have energy saving features turn it to its max saving setting. You want to do this for the first 100 hours of veiwing on your plasma. For the next 900 hours try and limit your widesreen veiwing to 20% total time. Yes, displaying a widescreen image wether on each side or top or bottom will cause aging of phosphers, but, if you follow these break in steps you won't have any problems. Also, Yes you should make sure you fill the screen with the image at all times during the break in period for the first 100 hours.
 

Allan Jayne

Senior HTF Member
Joined
Nov 1, 1998
Messages
2,405
Plasmas are still susceptible to permanent image retention and the only way that some models combat that is by not being able to go very high on contrast.

Permanent visible phosphor fading due to "age" is caused by heat, where the brighter that spot on the screen is, the hotter that spot behind the screen is.

The same advice that applies to CRT TV's applies: Keep the contrast down hereon and forevermore. For direct view screens it should be about halfway or less. For news and sports with logos, stock tickers, score/stats banners, etc. or for playing games, lower the contrast even more. (The control is sometimes labeled "picture" or "white level".)

If "image retention" and "burn in" are not the right terms, then I do not know the proper term for permanent visible shadows where logos, etc. were shown.

Video hints: http://members.aol.com/ajaynejr/video.htm
 

keenwatcher

Stunt Coordinator
Joined
Nov 2, 2006
Messages
51
Real Name
sean
Thanks Troy, Allan, and Michael

I feel like an idiot, not knowing how to break in a new plasma tv.

I have had it since early July, and did not know to keep the brightness down. I had it on the plus side because the picture looked better.

I went into the menu and adjusted the levels just now, and yes, for tv stations (news channels) with logo's, the lesser brightness will limit the image retention. I am lucky that I did not yet burn in anything.

I just checked my input sources (with the dvd player off, and the digital cable box off) and the screen looks clear with no visible logo's or other artifacts that I can see.

I will be watching the old black and white 1960's british Dangerman series over the next couple of weeks and will keep it on full screen (and get used to a little stretched effect).

Last week I watched some James Bond movies (the first three filled up the screen totally, they must have been originally made in 16:9 format- Dr No, From Russia With Love, and Goldfinger, while Thunderball, You Only Live Twice, and On Her Majesty's Secret Service were all letterboxed).

Last week I also watched Patrick McGoohan's The Prisoner (mostly in 4:3 mode with grey bars on the sides to limit the vertical line after effects). I will now watch all my future tv series in stretched 16:9 ratio.

I have to say, I did not properly break in my plasma for the first 100 hrs. I must have done something right though, I have not noticed any permanent problems so far, just some image retentions (with the logo's and horizontal and vertical lines).

Again, thanks for the help.
 

Michael TLV

THX Video Instructor/Calibrator
Senior HTF Member
Joined
Mar 16, 2000
Messages
2,909
Location
Calgary, Alberta
Real Name
Michael Chen
Greetings

Industry notes about plasma sets given to installers.

TVs should be preburned for 200 hours prior to installing in homes. TVs are most prone to permanent burn in effects / uneven wear during this period. They become much more robust and resistant to this effect after 500 hours or so.

This does not mean you should abuse it ... but proper rotation of different programs with different shapes should prevent anything nasty happening.

Regards
 

Mort Corey

Supporting Actor
Joined
Nov 21, 2003
Messages
981
One of the aspect choices on my PDP blows the entire picture of a 4:3 source to completely fill the screen. I then use the screen position function to move the entire picture down a little. For regular TV stuff it fills the screen with none of the ugly stretch look but I lose a little information from the bottom of the picture......which usually is the broadcast logo so it works out pretty well. DVD movies I just leave alone. No image retention in 4 1/2 years.

Mort
 

Mark Paquette

Supporting Actor
Joined
Aug 8, 1999
Messages
519
My recently purchased plasma came with a 1 page tidbit of info regarding image retention. It included some recommendations/settings to use during the first 150 hours.
 

ChrisWiggles

Senior HTF Member
Joined
Aug 19, 2002
Messages
4,791

Well, sort of. A plasma cell does not immediately revert to a neutral state, so this causes temporary image retention. You can see this easily if you put up an image for a few moments, and then go to a black screen, a dim ghost of the previous image will remain visible for a little while, but will dissipate.

However, plasmas do use phosphors, and like any phosphor-based displays, they do wear over time, and this if severe enough can indeed "burn in" an image permanently or wear unevenly.
 

Coressel

Supporting Actor
Joined
May 26, 1999
Messages
699
As I pointed out in the "Master Burn-In Thread," which is stickied at the top of this forum, I have the Panny 37"9UK plasma, and have had very little or no IR problems, because I use the monitor's built-in screen savor EVERY TIME I am finished watching anything. I run it for about 10 or 20 minutes, and so far it's been great.

If your tv doesn't have a screen saver, then another thing I do is I put on some full screen or stretched programming for awhile and let it run.

What minor retention or lines or whatever I may notice at first completely go away in no time.

I used CNet's suggested picture settings for this model and then made a few adjustments based on what my own eyeballs like to see. I've just about hit the 100 hour mark, and couldn't be happier with it.
 

Xbm360

Auditioning
Joined
Aug 28, 2007
Messages
4
Real Name
Rick
I have a Panasonic plasma & never experienced burn-in, with watching black bars for over 2 hours.
 

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