Pioneer announces HT products with FireWire!!!

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by Espen Braathen, Jun 21, 2002.

  1. Espen Braathen

    Espen Braathen Stunt Coordinator

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    Pioneer has announced a new range of HT products - integrated receivers/amplifiers and DVD-A/V players with firewire connectors. Unfortunately the press release I received does not mention model numbers or other details on these new products.

    I guess the recent rumor about a new VSX-49TX aka VSA-AX10 model with firewire ports is true.
     
  2. Pablo Abularach

    Pablo Abularach Supporting Actor

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    I'm sorry to ask this, but i'm just a newbie,

    What is fire Wire?
     
  3. GordonL

    GordonL Supporting Actor

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  4. Larry Vale

    Larry Vale Auditioning

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    Damn I was sure Sony would announce that first....cause I bet they will!
     
  5. Espen Braathen

    Espen Braathen Stunt Coordinator

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    Pioneer Elite Receivers Get Technological Update. VSX-49TXi Features World's
    First Multi-Channel Digital Interface for DVD-Audio and SACD
    Long Beach, CA June 19, 2002
    Pioneer Electronics (USA) Inc. today introduced four new Elite receivers that offer audio enthusiasts the latest in digital processing, room tuning and high-resolution multi-channel audio reproduction. The VSX-49TXi is the world's first receiver with a multi-channel digital interface (i.LINK) for DVD-Audio and SACD.
    "We developed these new receivers with the understanding that multi-channel sound is critical to enhance audio of both movies and music," said Craig McManis, vice president of marketing for home entertainment at Pioneer Electronics (USA) Inc. "By incorporating an i.Link connection on the
    flagship receiver, we're giving consumers added convenience coupled with the most technologically advanced method of processing audio through one cable instead of multiple analog cables."
    Room Tuning
    The VSX-49TXi and VSX-45TX receivers provide a refined Multi-Channel
    Acoustic Calibration Circuit (MCACC) for optimum acoustic accuracy in
    multi-channel sound reproduction. The calibration system works by measuring
    the acoustic characteristics of the listening area and neutralizing the
    ambient characteristics that can "color" the original source material. First
    the MCCAC uses the microphone provided to check and test ambient noise
    levels, the microphone, and speaker level. Once the initial set-up
    calibration is complete the system automatically confirms size of the
    speakers that are hooked up to the receiver and distance to the listener,
    then performs a surround analysis. Finally, MCACC checks the channel delay
    and channel level, before performing the acoustic calibration. During the
    acoustic calibration process, the speakers will emit a series of pink noise
    and timing pulses that are received by the microphone and sent to a
    nine-band digital equalizer for final calibration of up to seven channels.
    The VSX-49TXi provides an advanced MCACC offering all-channel 96/24 analog
    to digital conversion and allows for manual settings if preferred.
    The VSX-43TX offers manual MCACC, allowing consumers to fine-tune the room
    to their own personal tastes. The manual MCACC system utilizes the left
    front speaker as a reference point to calibrate the speaker level, time
    delay, and five-band equalization for up to seven channels. The receiver
    coaches the user through several steps until the sound being reproduced by
    each speaker is aligned to the front left reference channel.
    Sound Quality
    Pioneer's Elite receivers offer equal amplifier power to all channels,
    eliminating the possibility of one channel dominating a particular sound
    field. All amplifiers are of discrete configuration for low distortion and
    are capable of handling any surround format.
    Construction
    The VSX-49TXi has a four-chamber copper shielded chassis construction and
    huge storage capacitors. Both the VSX-45TX and VSX-43TX have extra large
    extruded aluminum heat sinks, a frame reinforced isolated chamber, single
    and double layered transformer stabilizer, gold insulator and aluminum front
    panel, all indicators of the exceptional quality construction for which the
    Elite brand is known.
    The VSX-49TXi receiver will be available in October 2002 at a suggested
    retail price of $4,500. The VSX-45TX and VSX-43TX will be available in
    August 2002 at a suggested retail price of $1,400 and $1,200 respectively.
    The VSX-41TX will be available in July 2002 at a suggested retail price of
    $800.
    Pioneer's Home Entertainment Division is the leading manufacturer of plasma
    and projection televisions, DVD players and DVD recorders, A/V receivers, CD
    players and CD recorders, speakers and other audio and video accessories.
    Its focus is on the development of new digital technologies including
    Digital Network Entertainment. The company markets its products under the
    Pioneer and Pioneer Elite brand names. When purchased from an authorized
    dealer, consumers receive a limited warranty for one year with Pioneer
    products and two years with Pioneer Elite products.
    Pioneer Corporation is a leader in optical disc technology and a preeminent
    manufacturer of high-performance audio, video, computer and cable television
    equipment for the home, car and industrial markets. The company focuses on
    four core business domains including DVD, display technologies, Digital
    Network EntertainmentT and components. Founded in 1938 in Tokyo, Pioneer
    Corporation employs more than 31,000 people worldwide. Its shares are traded
    on the New York Stock Exchange (NYSE[​IMG]IO). Pioneer Electronics' headquarters
    is located in Long Beach, California.
     
  6. matthew_rm

    matthew_rm Second Unit

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    The "VSX-41TX" for $800? Looks like it might be a good deal
     
  7. Tony Meconiates

    Tony Meconiates Stunt Coordinator

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    49Txi here I come!
     
  8. Mike Veroukis

    Mike Veroukis Second Unit

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    Pablo,

    Just to make sure you understand what Firewire (aka IEEE1394) is, it is in fact a digital communications protocol. If you're familiar with computers it's similar to something like SCSI. Firewire can be used for any high-bandwidth data transfers. iMacs come with built in FireWire support (or at least they used to) and you can purchase FireWire PCI cards for your PC. These are generally used for downloading video from digital cameras but you can get FireWire hard drives as well. Is it sorta like USB? Yes, sorta, but FireWire should be a lot faster (in fact it's faster then SCSI III).

    So how does this work with receivers? Well, most modern receivers are digital and FireWire is the perfect choice to transfer digital data like PCM, DVD-A, DD, DTS or HDTV signals in the digital domain.

    FireWire is a nice feature, but unfortunately the main drive behind it is that the main movie houses wish to introduce encryption schemes in the digital streams to prevent piracy. That however probably belongs in it's own thread.

    Does that make sense?

    - Mike
     
  9. Aslam Imran

    Aslam Imran Second Unit

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    Hahahahahaha
    Elite 49TXi already!!! Just the other day someone was telling me that the 49TX owners wouldn't be worried about a newer model for atleast another year. Time to grab that seltzer bottle and drop the sam adams[​IMG]
     
  10. RajeeK

    RajeeK Second Unit

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  11. LorenzoD

    LorenzoD Agent

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    Is this Firewire a good or bad thing for audio? Don't most audiophiles prefer analog over digital?

    I can see where it would be nice for video, though...
     
  12. Mike Veroukis

    Mike Veroukis Second Unit

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  13. Dave E H

    Dave E H Supporting Actor

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  14. Rob_Z

    Rob_Z Extra

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    I would guess that the Pioneer Elite HDTV's will have some sort of digital input. I've been waiting for this. I can't imagine they would upgrade the receiver and DVD player and not give the HDTV a digital link.

    any thoughts?
     
  15. Mike Veroukis

    Mike Veroukis Second Unit

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    Rob,
    Back when I used to spend time on the HDTV forums people were speculating that the manufacturers would introduce either FireWire or DVI on most or all new HDTV models later this year. So the 2003 models should have it.
    Now, aside from HDTVs, for this thing to really work we'll need new DVD players and sat systems with FireWire/DVI as well. Once that happens then we can all go and "upgrade" all of our HT equiupment and then HDTV can really take off. What a great marketing scheme!
    - Mike
     
  16. Pablo Abularach

    Pablo Abularach Supporting Actor

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    Mike,

    Thanks for the information, you seem to know a lot of this stuff.

    I have DVI outputs in my videocard, and also heard that with this conection you get a better picture than component. I will try it as soon as I can save some money to spend on a new flat monitor.

    But firewire, i have never heard, thank for explaining it, it is something that I would consider a + in the future.

    Thanks
    Pablo Abularach
     
  17. Ashford Little

    Ashford Little Stunt Coordinator

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    I've been waiting to upgrade my system for a while now hoping that IEEE1394/Firewire would soon appear on the market. I'd also heard about DVI, but didn't really understand the difference in the two.
    From what I understand there are a couple of possibilities as to what might happen in relation to both audio and video. First though we need to get the studio and content providers to agree to a standard that will make them happy. When this happens it is quite possible this is what we will see:
    1) Firewire inputs and outputs on preamps/receivers and DVD players to handle the audio portion of DVD's as well as DVD-Audio and SACD. The HD-Video be it HDTV or HD-DVD cannot pass through IEEE1394 and will be passed through another connection called DVI.
    OR
    2) There is apparently another version of DVI on the horizon that I've forgotten the name of that can handle both the audio and video.
    These types of connections will necessitate a new preamp or receiver and it may not happen for another couple of years. There are manufacturers who are starting to market their own proprietary version of a digital link (Denon & Pioneer) but the products are very costly.
    For an excellent write-up on this material go to:
    Link to Firewire & DVI article
     
  18. DanielSmi

    DanielSmi Second Unit

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    mike,

    Digital jitter only happens on the digital optical cable and not on the coaxial cable, it has something to do with the fluxuation in the light signal but I can't exactly remember. Another benefit of firewire is bandwidth and can transfer data at 400mbytes/s compared to the orginal USB speed of 12mbytes/s. At this speed you can pass higher quality uncompressed audio. DTS has a max transfer rate of 1.5mbits/s (1509kbits/s) and dolby has a rate of 448kbits/s. Now notice that for dts and dd the speeds are rated in bits not bytes big difference, for you noncomputer savvy people I will explain. A bit consists of either a 1 or a 0, a byte is a group of 8 bits (1byte=8 bits ex: "01001011"= 1 byte). So DTS' max speed rated as bytes is 188kb/s and DD's is 56kb/s as compared to firewire 400mb/s. Another example with firewire you have the capability to transfer all the info on a music cd (650mbytes) in about 1.5 secs and at these speeds there will be no need for DD or DTS compression anymore, but this won't be realized until a much larger form of media exists like hd-dvd or something the size of todays average hard drives 20-30gb comes around to handle the massive size of uncompressed audio. To give you some sort of idea of the size necassary for this type quality it takes 1gb of space for 5mins of uncompressed standard quality video so you can only fit about 47 min. of video on a dual-layered dvd not including audio. I should know my dad has about 30 mins of video on the computer I'm typing this on right know and the hard drive is almost all used up. Sorry I think I got a little off track but I hope everyone learned something today.

    Daniel Smith
     
  19. Jah-Wren Ryel

    Jah-Wren Ryel Stunt Coordinator

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    Jitter occurs on both optical and coax. It is an artifact of the lack of a discrete clock signal which makes it more dificult for the receiving end to figure out when individual bit transmissions start or stop. In theory, optical is more prone to the problem because the transcoding from eletrical to optical and then back again could further mess up the timing. But, by no means is coax any more immune to jitter than optical.

    The reason something like firewire shouldn't have issues with jitter is that the audio data is packetized - sp-dif just sends raw bits with very little (maybe none at all?) framing information. Firewire protocols all require that the data be encapsulated in firewire packets that are discrete bundles of bits that will have checksums and other mechanisms to assure that the bits received are exactly the bits transmitted.
     
  20. Aslam Imran

    Aslam Imran Second Unit

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