Pioneer 563A and its audio cables VS Fiber optic

Discussion in 'Playback Devices' started by Dustin Wind, Aug 19, 2003.

  1. Dustin Wind

    Dustin Wind Stunt Coordinator

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    Hi,

    I just bought a Pioneer 563A DvD player and a Yamaha HTR-5650 receiver.

    I don't have anything set up yet because i'm moving in 9 days and i'm also waiting for my 65 inch widescreen Toshiba to arrive at the new house[​IMG]

    The guys at the store sold me 3 pairs of AR master audio cables....but i think i just read somewhere that i need 4?
    Can someone confirm this? do i need 3 or 4 for my set up? I don't want to move into my place and start hooking up my system that night, and find out i need another set of audio cables and have to wait until the morning...i may go crazy!
    Not sure if it makes a difference but i will have a HD TV, HD digital box, my receiver, DvD player, x-box and gamecube.

    also what's the difference between using the audio cables and fiber optic.

    I always thought fiber optic was "the best for sound", but the guys at the store sold me on this 563A and they told me the best way is NOT to use fiber optic, but to use audio cables for sound.
    they told me its the "new" way to listen to DvD's and the best way.
    I'm only using my DvD player for DvD's....not much CD's....
    Can someone explain in layman terms the difference and if the people at the store are correct.

    Thanks a ton


    Thanks for sitting through my first post here.
     
  2. Brian L

    Brian L Cinematographer

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    Three pair will get you the 5.1 outputs, which are essential to enjoy the full benefit of DVD-A and SACD.

    This is the only way you will be able to listen to the hi-rez tracks on a DVD-A and SACD. DVD-A and SACD will NOT go out the digital cable on the 563. The guy at the store had that right.

    DVD-A's also have a Dolby or DTS track that CAN go out the digital out, but they are of lesser quality than the signals you will get out the 5.1 analogs.

    The stereo pair is not normally needed if you also connect the digital out. In cases where you have a stereo track, the L/R channels on the 5.1 outs are normally duplicated on the stereo pair.

    This all assumes that you receiver or pre/pro will handle Dolby Digital and DTS decoding via the digital in. You can also listen to CDs that way.

    BGL
     
  3. Dustin Wind

    Dustin Wind Stunt Coordinator

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    My receive is a new yahmaha with DTS EX, Digal EX and is 6.1.

    so hooking it up with audio cables is the best way for me to watch my DvD's over fiber optic is what your saying?

    And i only need 3 pairs of audio cables...not 4?


    Also call me crazy, i know what 5.1 is, but how do you get 6.1?
    On my receiver it says "6.1 compatible"....i'm still trying to learn all of this stuff!


    Thanks Brian.
     
  4. Brian L

    Brian L Cinematographer

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    One more time...with feeling!

    The three pairs you have will connect the 5.1 outs of the 563 with the 5.1 ins of the receiver. You will use that for listening to DVD-A and SACD discs.

    The optical cable will be used when watching DVD-V's. In this way, your receiver will decode Dolby Digital and DTS.

    You could also watch DVD-Vs and listen via the 5.1 outs, but it is likely that the bass management in the receiver is better than in your 563, so I would use the digital in for that.

    So to summarise:

    DVD-A, SACD - 5.1 channel analog connections
    DVD-V - Optical digital connection

    Enjoy....you are going to like this!
    BGL
     
  5. Dustin Wind

    Dustin Wind Stunt Coordinator

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    I'm a complete newbie when it comes to this stuff and appreciate your help.

    So DVD movies come in different 2 formats?
    DVD- A
    DVD - V

    and SACD is for actual music cd's i'm assuming?

    so DvD - and SACD its best to hook it up with the audio cables.

    for DVD- V movies, i'm best to use fiber optic? If i plug in a fiber optic cable i have to manually switch the audio cables to fiber optic when i watch different movies or likely there is a option on the receiver?

    How do i know what movies are DVD-A, and DVD - V......so how do i know when to switch to get the best from it?

    I had a new Monster fiber optic cable but the guys at the store told me to return it since i won't be needing it anymore because this DvD player is better with the audio cables! so i do need one after all? SO CONFUSING lol.


    sorry for all the questions, i'm so clueless but trying to get the best out of my system.
     
  6. AlbertA

    AlbertA Stunt Coordinator

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    DVD-V stands for DVD video, which is to say movies and the like.

    DVD-A stans for DVD Audio, one of the new high resolution audio formats. SACD is the other high resolution audio format.

    So no, there are no 2 formats for movies.

    To listen to DVD-Audio and SACD, you need to use the 6 analog outputs on the player, you won't be able to enjoy the full potential of these formats if you use a digital connection(fiber optic for example) because of technical reasons and copy protection (you can do a search on dvd-a or sacd for details). Notice I said full potential, because more than likely you would probably still hear something out the digital output (but not the highest resolution possible that you could get)

    When watching movies, I assume you have a receiver with a dolby digital (and possibly dts) decoder. Then I would prefer to use the digital connection and have the receiver do the decoding.

    So to enjoy DVD-A and SACD you need a receiver with 5.1 analog inputs. You can have the fiber optic connection to the receiver at the same time. Your would tell your receiver to switch to the 5.1 ext inputs or your digital connection.

    Hope this helps...
     
  7. John Royster

    John Royster Screenwriter

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    Hats off to Albert for the best explanation and post ever!!!!

    Well done mate.
     
  8. Dustin Wind

    Dustin Wind Stunt Coordinator

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    Sorry for the stupid questions, but i'm still a little confused.

    So DvD- V is the video....the actual movie.

    can DvD- A also be a video? Like does the DvD-A encode on a DvD movie and thats the sound for the move?

    Or is DvD-A music that artists are releasing on DvD's now?



    Yes my receiver has DTS ES and Digital EX, it also says 6.1 channels on it and so does my DvD player.


    I now understand because of all your help that i need audio cables to listen to DVD-A and SACD....but i still need to know if the DvD-A is actually the sound on a movie or if its "music dvd" by a recording artist.

    I don't listen to music often ( only in my car) so i wouldn't need these 3 cables basically?
    I should bring them back and just get a optic cable?

    I was sold on this Pioneer 563A because they told me the sound for movies is even better then "normal dvd players" because of the audio cables.

    But now people are saying i should use the fiber optic to play movies instead of the audio cables? lol i'm so stupid with this stuff.


    again i'm really sorry for being so naive with all this and really appreciate all the help.
     
  9. michael_mo

    michael_mo Stunt Coordinator

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    One further question:
    What is the preferred playback for regular CDs?
    I have been using the optical connection into a Yamaha 5660 then listening in stereo. The bass is booming that way. (much better than my SACDs)
     
  10. FeisalK

    FeisalK Screenwriter

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  11. Dustin Wind

    Dustin Wind Stunt Coordinator

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    Ok DvD-A is only for recording artists...thanks.

    So if i don't plan on listening to music, i guess i should return the $300 in audio cables i bought since i only want this DvD player for MOVIES?
    I thought the audio cables would make the movies i watch sound better....but if there not even used for movies....

    I guess that also means i need to go buy a good optical cable from AR or Monster.....dam, i wonder why the guys working at the store would tell me to return the optical cable because i don't need it since i can watch movies with the audio cables and it sounds better.

    Should i also return this DvD player and get something else since i thought it had better sound for movies then a say a regular progressive scan Toshiba or something? This DvD player was quite a bit more expensive then other players.


    slowly i'm starting to understand [​IMG]

    Thanks for all the feedback. I would love to hear more comments on this post also.
     
  12. FeisalK

    FeisalK Screenwriter

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    there's many connections possible, and in most cases they all work [​IMG]

    two types of connections
    - ANALOG
    - DIGITAL

    there are 2 types again of ANALOG
    - 2 channel (RCA)
    - multichannel (RCA)

    also 2 types of DIGITAL connexions
    - coaxial (RCA)
    - optical (fibreoptic)
    some people prefer coax, and some prefer optical (can of worms)


    Since you have already bought the cables maybe you can hook them all up so you can experiment and search for your preferred sound [​IMG]

    for example - if you connect the 6 channel analog outputs from your player you can watch a movie that way using the DACs on the player. (need to select external decoder on your Yamaha)

    if you connect the digital outputs from your player you can watch a movie that way too, using the DACs on you receiver instead. (select Dolby Digital or DTS if available)
     
  13. Dustin Wind

    Dustin Wind Stunt Coordinator

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    Things are getting clearer!

    I assumed "digital" meant fiber optic. I didn't know digital could be "coaxial" cables also.

    I bought Acoustic Research "Master Series" "audio cables". I have 3 boxes of them.

    Would those count as "analog cables" or "digital coaxial" cables?

    If they are "digital coaxial" then there is no need to return them and get a fiber optic cable since i get to use DTS/Digital with them.

    Like people were saying...some people prefer "fiber optic" and some people prefer "digital coaxial" when watching movies.


    Thanks for being so patient guys!
     
  14. FeisalK

    FeisalK Screenwriter

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  15. Dustin Wind

    Dustin Wind Stunt Coordinator

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    ahhhh ok.
    So i do indeed need either a "digital coaxaial or optical" to watch movies.

    I'm still wondering why then, the guys at the store told me to return the Optical i just bought, since i won't need it anymore because of these audio cables.

    So confusing!
     
  16. FeisalK

    FeisalK Screenwriter

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    but a lot of fun! [​IMG]
     
  17. Jeff O.

    Jeff O. Stunt Coordinator

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  18. Dustin Wind

    Dustin Wind Stunt Coordinator

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    Thanks a ton Jeff, that explained a TON.

    After reading lots of posts here, i thought mabye the guys at the store were nuts!

    so i can use my audio cables to hear DTS and DD!! that makes me happy....i think lol.


    But you do think using a optical cable will give me better results then the 3 pairs of audio cables i have right now.....interesting....so is the result night and day or could you only tell if your a "specialist"?

    Is it one of these situation where 1 person thinks the audio cables are better and 1 person thinks optical cables are better? Or is it clearly better to use the optical cable?

    I just want the best for my system and thanks a ton again.
     
  19. Dustin Wind

    Dustin Wind Stunt Coordinator

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    Again if this helps anyone opinions on the audio cables or optical cables...

    Pioneer 563A
    Yamaha HTR - 5650
    65inch WS HD Toshiba 57HX83
    JBL Northridge N26 speakers ( year old )

    I can't do any tests since i bought this all a few days ago and i'm not getting it delivered until the 30th when i move into my new house...i just want to be prepared.


    What does bass management do and how do you turn it on or off?

    Thanks guys, i love it here!
     
  20. Lew Crippen

    Lew Crippen Executive Producer

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    Unfortunately Dustin, opinions as to whether a single digital cable (optical or coax) or 6 audio cables is best for actually transmitting the audio signals is a bit like having an opinion on the existence of God. [​IMG] This is most especially true for serious audiophiles.

    Since both DD and DTS are compressed and the bit rates reasonably low, there is not too much controversy as to sending these soundtracks via a digital connection. However DVD-A and SACD use many more bits to convey the audio signal(s) and some feel that not enough of this information can be sent via digital connections and feel that the six analog connections provide a transmission environment that delivers all of the information, without loss.

    Many serious listeners claim to be able to detect a difference. I don’t know enough about the amount of data (in terms of Mb/sec) requirements of DVD-A and SACD to have a valid opinion, but most of those who listen seriously and have high-end equipment prefer the analog connections.

    However for movies (DD and DTS) the digital connection would be as satisfactory as analog. In this case, the component with the best decoder should be preferred.
     

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