Physical Media might not be dead, but Physical Media in Retail Stores are accelerating the death (1 Viewer)

[SFMike]

I guess I am just old school.....I like owning the physical disc and just pick it off my shelf to play whenever I want. I really don't like streaming......or saving anything on a cloud.......I know some people like the new technology (and I'm not a 100% against it).....I just can't embrace owning something on a cloud, I feel as though these are more "services" like cable than an ACTUAL PRODUCT. And these "services" can change hands often for me to lose ownership to media I already bought and saved on a cloud.....again....sorry.....just old school. Today was just kind of an eye opener for me on how retail chains are handling the physical media situation.

I totally agree as these cloud "services" are not to be trusted regardless of whatever claims as to the safety of your purchased media is made. As we can see the US government daily is taking away all consumer protections that are in place so that all one of these companies has to do is file bankruptcy and fold and we will lose anything on their servers without recourse. Of course they could sell their business to another for millions of profit for them but then the new owner could put a new charge on the media we have already paid for. I seems the goal of American business right now is to squeeze as much money from the consumer as possible for the least amount of service so I have no hope of receiving fair treatment from a digital media "third party". I'll stick to physical media.

 

[Mike Frezon]

The 4K's all too often have misleading packaging. Claiming on the package the movie is 4 times better than Blu-Ray when in fact it is nothing but a low level upscale transfer . . . is, in part, leading to store returns. Costco decided to pull the plug. Streaming 4K is of little help for those who live outside a major city where they at lucky to get 10 to 15. The answer for some? Buy the 4K disk online and enjoy the out-of-this world on an LG 65" OLED.

Jeremy: Normally, I'd say "Welcome to the HTF" for your first post

but you've been a member here since 1999!

You've been holding your tongue for a long time!

 

[MartinP.]

I totally agree as these cloud "services" are not to be trusted regardless of whatever claims as to the safety of your purchased media is made. As we can see the US government daily is taking away all consumer protections that are in place so that all one of these companies has to do is file bankruptcy and fold and we will lose anything on their servers without recourse. Of course they could sell their business to another for millions of profit for them but then the new owner could put a new charge on the media we have already paid for. I seems the goal of American business right now is to squeeze as much money from the consumer as possible for the least amount of service so I have no hope of receiving fair treatment from a digital media "third party". I'll stick to physical media.

Not a cloud service, but remember Photobucket? The "you can download and store any amount of photos you want and free 3rd party hosting Photobucket?" And now?

 

[TJPC]

My thought about 4K is that you buy a new tv and 4K player and 5 years from now out comes 8K or whatever.

Having been burned by constant non backward comparable upgrades and just feeling completely burned and rooked by the companies that promoted 3D, I am very wary. I will not buy Beta again.

 

[rdimucci]

Not a cloud service, but remember Photobucket? The "you can download and store any amount of photos you want and free 3rd party hosting Photobucket?" And now?

Who knew that providing all those free services wasn't a viable business model?

 

[rdimucci]

I stopped by my local Barnes & Noble on Friday and it looks like they are starting to phase out their DVD/Blu-Ray Department. Of the 6 stores within a 50 mile radius only 4 have movies/music. If the one closest phases out, I may rethink my membership next year.

You need to spend $250 a year at Barnes and Noble just to break even on the cost of a membership. After that you'll start saving money. I still manage to save a little, but if B&N stops selling Criterion discs, I'll end my membership too.

 

[Bobby Henderson]

I prefer to buy music and movies on physical media since the audio-video quality is better. Unfortunately the quality margin physical media has over streaming or downloaded options has narrowed, and not always in a good way either.

The movie studios are not putting in nearly as much effort into their retail discs packages as they did 10-20 years ago with DVD and the early days of Blu-ray. Now they're clearly more interested in pushing streaming or downloaded purchase options. Hence the "HD Digital" download version of a movie becoming available weeks ahead of the retail Blu-ray or UHD version. I'm really disappointed with what the studios have done with the UHD BD format (way too many 2K>4K up-scaled titles and far too few native 4K releases). Years ago it was much easier to only watch movies on Blu-ray discs and turn my nose up at Netflix or any other streaming service, but that's when I had DSL service that did no better than 3 megabits per second. A 25 Mb/s or 50 Mb/s cable Internet connection makes a big difference. My ISP offers up to 250Mb/s service, but I don't feel like paying over $100 per month for it.

Music on physical media is a more difficult situation. A Red Book CD may boast a much better bit rate than an MP3 or AAC file bought from Google Music or iTunes. But when the music track has the dynamics of its wave form so badly compressed just to make everything loud the end result winds up not sounding much better than the lossy compressed song files people buy one at a time. All you can eat music streaming services have eaten into both physical media music sales and sales of downloadable tunes.

My town is down to one video rental store (Family Video) and I figure it's only a matter of time before it closes. I used to shop at Hastings Books, Music & Video and rent videos from them frequently. Hastings liquidated not too long ago. Sam Goody's in our local mall shut down years ago. Now we're stuck with a couple Walmart stores, a Sam's Club and one Target store for buying music CDs and movie discs. The selection is not all that great. And with music you'll often be stuck with the clean-censored versions.

In principal I don't like ordering goods online. I like to check and see if the product is available locally first and then only order online as a last resort. Amazon employs no one in my town and does not buy any goods or services from anyone in my town. Amazon and other online merchants like it provide zero local economic multiplier effect.

 

[Sega]

Today, while I was waiting for my car to be repaired (it took 5 hours!!!), I went around to the local retail stores to shop around. Now I live in the western suburbs of the metropolitan Chicago area, and I couldn't believe the reduction of space for physical media in 3 major retail chains, Best Buy, Target and Walmart. Now, I did read that Best Buy and Target were going to start eliminating CD's to be sold in the store.....but what I am talking about here, is not only CD's, but DVD's and Blu-Rays too!!! I couldn't believe it!!

Best Buy out of the 3 major chains is getting close to nothing. The store by me use to have 4 aisles of tv shows on DVD and Blu Ray.....it now has been reduced to ONE aisle. CD's didn't even have an aisle.....just one 4 shelf stand and one of those barrels with a bunch of CD's throw in big barrel like stand with 4.99 as the clearance price. Movies on DVD were still somewhat ok.....but their were only 3 aisles (they had tripled that amount at one time). And a stand in front of the store with new releases (even a couple of Lionel Richie Vinyl albums?). I was amazed how much space they reduced for physical media.

Target looks like they have already started drastically reducing CDs already. I usually go to a different Target (by my house) which has a bigger selection. But the Target I went to today (by my mechanic) had close to nothing as far as CDs....and the DVD/Blu Ray selections seem to be for movies only (very little TV shows though)

Walmart was the biggest surprise though......CDs there were about the same as Best Buy (one stand with about 4 shelves). They had more movies and TV shows then the other two retail chains, however there selections were reduced as well. But the most shocking thing (to me anyway) was they were literally selling Cardboard like cards with a picture of the movie on the front of it to buy just the digital code.....and it wasn't cheap.....some movies were 14,99....for the digital copy? They even had some movie collections (like the 3 Ghostbusters movies) to buy digital for like 29.99? I couldn't believe it!!!

I guess I am just old school.....I like owning the physical disc and just pick it off my shelf to play whenever I want. I really don't like streaming......or saving anything on a cloud.......I know some people like the new technology (and I'm not a 100% against it).....I just can't embrace owning something on a cloud, I feel as though these are more "services" like cable than an ACTUAL PRODUCT. And these "services" can change hands often for me to lose ownership to media I already bought and saved on a cloud.....again....sorry.....just old school. Today was just kind of an eye opener for me on how retail chains are handling the physical media situation.

Thankfully, there is a Disc Replay store (sells used CD's, DVDs and Blu-Rays) that was next door to Best Buy. And another Book Store down the street that also sells used books, CD's DVD's and Blu-Rays. Both of these stores had tons to choose from (and cheap!!!) And then there is always Amazon too (and hopefully they are not going to trend the same way as the 3 retail chain stores). I'm just wondering if, like vinyl records that seem to have somewhat of a "comeback", will apply for CDs, DVD's and Blu-Rays once they become extinct in the future......I guess time will tell.

Today, while I was waiting for my car to be repaired (it took 5 hours!!!), I went around to the local retail stores to shop around. Now I live in the western suburbs of the metropolitan Chicago area, and I couldn't believe the reduction of space for physical media in 3 major retail chains, Best Buy, Target and Walmart. Now, I did read that Best Buy and Target were going to start eliminating CD's to be sold in the store.....but what I am talking about here, is not only CD's, but DVD's and Blu-Rays too!!! I couldn't believe it!!

Best Buy out of the 3 major chains is getting close to nothing. The store by me use to have 4 aisles of tv shows on DVD and Blu Ray.....it now has been reduced to ONE aisle. CD's didn't even have an aisle.....just one 4 shelf stand and one of those barrels with a bunch of CD's throw in big barrel like stand with 4.99 as the clearance price. Movies on DVD were still somewhat ok.....but their were only 3 aisles (they had tripled that amount at one time). And a stand in front of the store with new releases (even a couple of Lionel Richie Vinyl albums?). I was amazed how much space they reduced for physical media.

Target looks like they have already started drastically reducing CDs already. I usually go to a different Target (by my house) which has a bigger selection. But the Target I went to today (by my mechanic) had close to nothing as far as CDs....and the DVD/Blu Ray selections seem to be for movies only (very little TV shows though)

Walmart was the biggest surprise though......CDs there were about the same as Best Buy (one stand with about 4 shelves). They had more movies and TV shows then the other two retail chains, however there selections were reduced as well. But the most shocking thing (to me anyway) was they were literally selling Cardboard like cards with a picture of the movie on the front of it to buy just the digital code.....and it wasn't cheap.....some movies were 14,99....for the digital copy? They even had some movie collections (like the 3 Ghostbusters movies) to buy digital for like 29.99? I couldn't believe it!!!

I guess I am just old school.....I like owning the physical disc and just pick it off my shelf to play whenever I want. I really don't like streaming......or saving anything on a cloud.......I know some people like the new technology (and I'm not a 100% against it).....I just can't embrace owning something on a cloud, I feel as though these are more "services" like cable than an ACTUAL PRODUCT. And these "services" can change hands often for me to lose ownership to media I already bought and saved on a cloud.....again....sorry.....just old school. Today was just kind of an eye opener for me on how retail chains are handling the physical media situation.

Thankfully, there is a Disc Replay store (sells used CD's, DVDs and Blu-Rays) that was next door to Best Buy. And another Book Store down the street that also sells used books, CD's DVD's and Blu-Rays. Both of these stores had tons to choose from (and cheap!!!) And then there is always Amazon too (and hopefully they are not going to trend the same way as the 3 retail chain stores). I'm just wondering if, like vinyl records that seem to have somewhat of a "comeback", will apply for CDs, DVD's and Blu-Rays once they become extinct in the future......I guess time will tell.

 

[David Norman]

You need to spend $250 a year at Barnes and Noble just to break even on the cost of a membership. After that you'll start saving money. I still manage to save a little, but if B&N stops selling Criterion discs, I'll end my membership too.

That's if you include ONLY the 10% Instore discount. If you tend to use the other discounts (20% vs 15% coupons, 30% vs 20% coupons, double member discount promotions, 40% vs 30% off Certain book Collections that Amazon often has at 20%, Free Shipping that allows use of single item discount codes on less than $25) that non-member don't get that number drops to closer to $150 pretty easily and for brand new 1st time members it can actually be under $75 due to the pack of special coupons they still offer.

On top of supporting a remaining B&M choice and basically any other retailer than Amazon which is slowly and steadily showing it's colors and previewing what will happen as the each competing retailer drops out.

 

[bmasters9]

And with music you'll often be stuck with the clean-censored versions.

Which are probably censored owing to community pressure-- apparently it's not good enough simply for the community to make the choice to avoid that kind of music; everyone else must bow to the community's wishes and either listen to the censored version or not at all!

 

[BobO'Link]

Which are probably censored owing to community pressure-- apparently it's not good enough simply for the community to make the choice to avoid that kind of music; everyone else must bow to the community's wishes and either listen to the censored version or not at all!

For WM it seems to be about corporate image and assumed pressure they'd receive from the Bible Belt - which is where a large number of their stores are located. All it takes is one mom-with-a-mission seeing a parental warning sticker to get an entire town to boycott a WM. They don't seem to care about other stores and other stores don't seem to care about them (don't know about Target - I rarely purchase music there and not at all from WM due to their forced censoring of music). But WM sells that family far more than a CD every so often and has more to loose.

 

[bmasters9]

For WM it seems to be about corporate image and assumed pressure they'd receive from the Bible Belt - which is where a large number of their stores are located. All it takes is one mom-with-a-mission seeing a parental warning sticker to get an entire town to boycott a WM. They don't seem to care about other stores and other stores don't seem to care about them (don't know about Target - I rarely purchase music there and not at all from WM due to their forced censoring of music). But WM sells that family far more than a CD every so often and has more to loose.

Based on what you said, I think you might find this interesting-- this was a broadcast of ABC News Nightline w/Ted Koppel from Sept. 13, 1985 about musical censorship and the PMRC. Frank Zappa is one of the guests.

 

[Jeremy Lancaster]

Amazon employs no one in my town . . .

My wife and I have deliveries to our home almost daily. Three of the drivers told me they are thankful for us buying online because it means they have a good paying job making the delivery to our doorstep. Who would have thought? Yes the first one that thanked me was our postal carrier. Then the UPS driver thanked me, and then the FedEx driver did. I guess they are able to take their earnings and feed it back into our local town.

These days I don't think as much as Amazon being a "seller". Most often they are a portal that allows other sellers to sell through them. I have neighbors who sell on Amazon and their earnings too go into the town.

But technically you are right. There is no Amazon Warehouse in our town. But their influence and connections has provided earnings to locals.

Now . . . who knows what will happen in the weeks ahead at the Supreme Court who may decide in favor of the president to start internet taxing nationwide. Ouch.

 

[BobO'Link]

Every month the local paper publishes the county sales tax receipts with a breakdown of which town gets how much. Just as frequently the mayor whines about the city not getting as much sales tax receipts as they should because of internet sales, frequently citing Amazon as a prime offender. The sad part is he's not yet realized Amazon's been paying state and local sales taxes since March of last year, and the paper hasn't called him out on it. Amazon was blamed for the less than expected tax receipts on local BF sales. They don't get that people are not purchasing as much and that they are not coming into "the city" and just shopping in their own town instead now that most of them have the same, or similar, stores. Most of the people I know who purchase online do so because it's more convenient, not to avoid sales taxes, and they're purchasing from Target, WM, Sams, BB, and others who have a local presence. It's also because they're purchasing something online that's just not available locally (imagine that!). I'm sure they're losing *some* revenue due to online, and even catalog, sellers who do not charge local sales tax, but I firmly believe it's not as much as they think.

Like Jeremy, we receive almost daily deliveries and I've been thanked by our mail carrier and UPS driver for the many packages we receive. My wife went so far as to apologize to the mail carrier for the number of packages we receive one day when he brought a huge stack to the door. He told her he was glad we did as people like us keep him employed.

 

[BobO'Link]

Based on what you said, I think you might find this interesting-- this was a broadcast of ABC News Nightline w/Ted Koppel from Sept. 13, 1985 about musical censorship and the PMRC. Frank Zappa is one of the guests.

I saw that when it aired. Zappa's outspoken stand on censorship was a breath of fresh air. He, and surprisingly, Donny Osmond stating plainly that the labels are nothing but vaguely concealed censorship that would serve to do nothing but draw more attention to the "objectionable" material and force music into the trap of movie ratings. I know for a fact that some of my nephews purchased discs with ratings stickers *because* they had the stickers. It's the same with movies. As was alluded to in that program, there have been risque lyrics in songs as long as songs have been sung. I could go on - but I've been strongly on the side of Zappa and Osmond long before that program aired. That program gave me new respect for Donny Osmond, the poster child of all American goodness and purity to conservative America. I've liked Zappa since I first heard his music and him talk in the early 70s.

 

[Dale MA]

I was once in a meeting with Best Buys second in command and a store manager, & the head honcho said that they want to remove physical media from all stores in "the next couple of years". Now this was a few years back, so they're obviously behind timescale!

There's just no margins in physical media, they would rather use all of that space for cell phones (and those lucrative contacts) or other high margin items.

 

[Rick Thompson]

I was once in a meeting with Best Buys second in command and a store manager, & the head honcho said that they want to remove physical media from all stores in "the next couple of years". Now this was a few years back, so they're obviously behind timescale!

There's just no margins in physical media, they would rather use all of that space for cell phones (and those lucrative contacts) or other high margin items.

And as a result, they lose the sales on "cell phones (and those lucrative contracts) or other high margin items" because I know they won't have the low margin item I want. Since I'm on Amazon anyway, I buy them the rest of my shopping list there, too. It's not like the chain B&Ms hire staff who know what they're talking about, so what do I lose — other than Amazon's lower price, of course!

 

[TJPC]

Physical media don’t usually lend themselves to buying an extra long term store guarantee!

 

[Hollywoodaholic]

The passing last week of Russ Solomon, founder of Tower Records, was a stark metaphor for the passing of the age of physical media. Going to record stores to leisurely browse through the racks in anticipation of some latest release or new discovery was not only a major source of pleasure, but was a meditative and calming experience for me to help soothe the anxieties of the big city experience.

I spent hours in these record stores and would build my excursions to story pitch meetings in L.A. around rewarding myself with a trip to one of these stores after the meeting, successful or otherwise. And then just last night I dreamed about being in some of these stores again. I list them here as a fond tribute and exercise in nostalgia.

Tower Records (Sunset Blvd)
Aron Records (Melrose Blvd and later Highland Ave)
Rhino Records (Westwood Blvd)
Licorice Pizza (Sunset, boy that one goes way back)
CD Banzai (Third St)
Moby Disc (various locations)
Wherehouse Records (various locations)
Music + (various locations)
Rockaway Records (Pasadena)
Record Surplus (Pico Blvd)
Penny Lane (Westwood Village, Venice)
Eli Wallach's (Sunset in Hollywood, vinyl only back then)
Vinyl Fetish (Melrose)

Moving to Florida, the main chain left was Peaches. It was no Tower. But we also had a glorious Virgin Megastore with imports for a while.

When Tower added a video store across from the Sunset store I remember helping Axl Rose choose a horror film in there one night. The record store was a place where you would be thumbing through the selections elbow to elbow with famous musicians, but both of you just there on equal footing as eager music fans on the hunt.

The Colin Hanks' documentary All Things Must Pass mostly gets things right, but it's so hard to convey the actual experience of wandering around in there all evening, and the rush it would give you. The staff were pretty snobbish about their superior knowledge of obscure stuff and would practically sneer at you if you came to the cash register with an Elton John album (but only when he wasn't around - he spent more money in there than anyone).

I actually preferred Aron Records on Melrose because it was easier to park, and the prices were cheaper (plus they gave me good trade for the bulk of my vinyl collection when I was moving to CDs).

Last summer I was in L.A. and went to Amoeba Music on Sunset in Hollywood, which is a great record store, and I scored a couple radio station live recording CDs of artists that you can't even find on Amazon. These were better quality than bootlegs (which I had many of), but in that same rarefied category. But there are just so many boxes of cheap CDs stuffed everywhere, it was hard to find anything.

I buy music mostly on Amazon like everyone else these days, but there is a communal experience of wandering through a record store filled with excitement that just will never be duplicated. We still have movie theaters, but how long will that communal experience last?

 

[PMF]

True that-- wasn't intending on changing the name of the business; all I was meaning by "selects" is the stuff that you pay good money for that is well worth that money in several things:

--being a good show
--being packaged well
--excellent A/V quality

...among other things.

Nope, I knew what you meant...I was taking my jabs at them. Seems stupid to be in a business that offers panels and players, but then offers nothing in the way of physical media selections. Man, if I ran these stores I would embrace all of physical media. Loosely borrowing from "Field of Dreams" my motto would be, "If you offer it, they will buy".