Panasonic AE-900 (1 Viewer)

[yairisan]

I'll try this question one more time (the first time garnered me a single completely witless response - cheers Peter!).

Could anyone shed some light on the Panny in the title? I have a DLP (2007?) Mitsubishi HC3800 which has been pretty damn good. I understand the Panny is 720, but for Netflix, I'm limited to that a lot of the time anyway, so 1080 is redundant. I was wondering if the Panny's black level/color was decent compared to a slightly newer single-chip DLP, such is the Mitsu, which I felt was lacking in a lot of scenes.

Cheers

 

[Adam Gregorich]

I don't think you had a huge response to your first post as someone would really have needed to see them side by side to answer your question as to which was better. Even asking which is better between 2005 LCD or 2007 DLP is a hard question as there are so many things (good and bad) that companies can do to tweak brightness and contrast, not to mention the light output and lens throw. At the time the 900 got favorable reviews against the previous model (the 700) and was a good alternative to the 2005 DLP projectors (not necessarily better).

I don't know how much you are paying for the 900, and I don't know what condition its in, how many hours are on it vs the HC3800 you have (time for a new bulb?), so I am going to say I don't know if there is a difference and if there was if it would be noticeable enough to justify buying a "new to you" 10+ year old projector. I guess my advice would be (assuming your HC3800 is working fine) to save your money until you can afford something much newer (2-3 years old) that would have more of a dramatic difference.

 

[yairisan]

Thanks for the detailed reply, Adam. I understand my question is very machine-specific. The 900 is going for 70 dollars in very clean condition and turns on and shows its menus, etc. It includes the learning remote also, so it seems to be a good deal.

Buying used in Japan is less hairy as sellers tend to be pretty honest, and anything just a few years old here is considered old hat and go pretty cheap—especially low-mileage cars!

 

[yairisan]

I don't think you had a huge response to your first post as someone would really have needed to see them side by side to answer your question as to which was better. Even asking which is better between 2005 LCD or 2007 DLP is a hard question as there are so many things (good and bad) that companies can do to tweak brightness and contrast, not to mention the light output and lens throw. At the time the 900 got favorable reviews against the previous model (the 700) and was a good alternative to the 2005 DLP projectors (not necessarily better).

I don't know how much you are paying for the 900, and I don't know what condition its in, how many hours are on it vs the HC3800 you have (time for a new bulb?), so I am going to say I don't know if there is a difference and if there was if it would be noticeable enough to justify buying a "new to you" 10+ year old projector. I guess my advice would be (assuming your HC3800 is working fine) to save your money until you can afford something much newer (2-3 years old) that would have more of a dramatic difference.

Incidentally, while I wasn't surprised by the lack of response, I was surprised by the dim-witted response I did get. Some mothers do 'ave em.

 

[FoxyMulder]

Incidentally, while I wasn't surprised by the lack of response, I was surprised by the dim-witted response I did get. Some mothers do 'ave em.

I personally do not think you will notice a difference and indeed the image quality could be worse as DLP usually have great screen uniformity and I would expect not much difference in black levels.

I once owned the Panasonic AE-700 and while it was good for it’s time I found the DLP I bought to be superior on every level, brightness, colour, black level and sharpness.

DLP has gone backwards in the last six or seven years with regards black level, it can be acceptable if you calibrate your display but it obviously cannot compete with modern JVC or a decent top of the range Epson projector, modern DLP is great for 3D although the recent 4K upscale DLP Projectors from Optoma (as one example) do not do 24 FPS, they do everything at 60 FPS thus pulldown.

I find that unacceptable considering the price and they have actually took a backward step when it comes to low black levels and contrast, they are always good at absolute sharpness due to being one chip and mid to high levels where black and white are onscreen at the same time are usually very good compared to the competition.

I would save your money, it is not going to be better and likely will be worse in some very important aspects.

Depending on how many hours is on your bulb you can get more performiance out of your current projector just by getting a new bulb and re-calibrating the projector.

P.S. I forgot to add, with projectors your room plays a huge part in the performance, anything light around the screen will reflect back and destroy contrast and black levels, just darkening the walls on the ceiling and also doing the same with the side walls as well as adding a black carpet can improve contrast if you calibrate the projector as well.

 

[yairisan]

I personally do not think you will notice a difference and indeed the image quality could be worse as DLP usually have great screen uniformity and I would expect not much difference in black levels.

I once owned the Panasonic AE-700 and while it was good for it’s time I found the DLP I bought to be superior on every level, brightness, colour, black level and sharpness.

DLP has gone backwards in the last six or seven years with regards black level, it can be acceptable if you calibrate your display but it obviously cannot compete with modern JVC or a decent top of the range Epson projector, modern DLP is great for 3D although the recent 4K upscale DLP Projectors from Optoma (as one example) do not do 24 FPS, they do everything at 60 FPS thus pulldown.

I find that unacceptable considering the price and they have actually took a backward step when it comes to low black levels and contrast, they are always good at absolute sharpness due to being one chip and mid to high levels where black and white are onscreen at the same time are usually very good compared to the competition.

I would save your money, it is not going to be better and likely will be worse in some very important aspects.

Depending on how many hours is on your bulb you can get more performiance out of your current projector just by getting a new bulb and re-calibrating the projector.

P.S. I forgot to add, with projectors your room plays a huge part in the performance, anything light around the screen will reflect back and destroy contrast and black levels, just darkening the walls on the ceiling and also doing the same with the side walls as well as adding a black carpet can improve contrast if you calibrate the projector as well.

Thanks for the informed answer! Sounds like it's best I stay away from the Panasonic 900 and stick with the HC3800, then. Cheers.

 

[yairisan]

Update: I got the Panasonic at a further reduced price due to a sticky iris, which I've since fixed. For the record:

It's not as bright as the Mitsubishi HC3800, but not unduly so. The bulb is near its end, so this might be mitigated with a replacement bulb, although the Mitsu is up to 1500 hrs, also.

The AE900 has about the same perceived black level as the Mitsubishi, which was a wee bit disappointing—but not totally unexpected, given foxymulder's comments, etc.

It's quieter than the Mitsubishi (by a few hairs), which is nice as it sits just above me. It also blows slightly cooler air. The Mitsu blows some seriously hot air.

It has rather nicer colors than the Mitsubishi, and motion appears more natural, and of course rainbows are non-existent.

The remote is great, and can control other components.

Placement flexibility is far better than the Mitsu.

The Mitsu has more pop/wow (brightness and sharpness), but exhibits an artificiality that the Panny doesn't. The Panny is obviously a bit softer—rather like turning sharpness on the Mitsu down three or four notches—I'm honestly quite surprised at how sharp 'lowly 720P' looks though (I was expecting that to be a deal breaker, but it's not immediately noticeable on a 100" screen).

Other than the sharpness/pop of the Mitsu, I like the image of the Panasonic a bit more: it's smoother/film-like, nicely saturated, and allows me to drop the screen image lower for a more cinema-like viewing experience. System control from a single remote will be great as I'm always pissing around with the amp and player remotes.

I think it was worth $50 anyway!

 

[FoxyMulder]

You could never lose out at fifty bucks, glad you enjoying it.

 

[yairisan]

Just to add one more observation to this pointless and self-indulgent thread that I doubt anyone will be interested in: the Mitsubishi HC3800 was quite finicky on HDMI handshake, and suffered sparklies/noise on certain dark scenes (though not all, oddly). The Pan suffers none of this and provides a consistently cleaner picture in all dark scenes.

I'm prepared to admit that my satisfaction with the Pan is in part analogous with the satisfaction of driving around in an old car that runs well after a manual tune up—the fact that it still functions more or less to spec and still entertains after 10+ years says a lot. But OUCH those lamp prices—$138