Okay, final Sub Question, then I'm buying...SVS vs M&K

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by Chris Rein, Feb 14, 2002.

  1. Chris Rein

    Chris Rein Stunt Coordinator

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    Okay,

    First off, Tom/Ron you guys rock. Customer service A+++! I promise, this SHOULD be the last question about subs. I've narrowed it down to 2.

    I'm torn between the M&K MX-350 MKII THX Ultra sub and a pair of 20-39CS+'s with Samson S1000. My room is approx 17x20. The cost between the two would be the exact same for me. I love the sound and feel of the MX-350, but not sure what the SVS sounds/feels like. M&K is accurate as hell, and I want to make sure that the SVS combo is just as accurate or more, and it has both extension and headroom for my HT. So, cost in this instance is the same, but performance...insert number here :)

    I currently have a Klipsch KSW-300 15" sub with a Klipsch KSF-10.5 system. From what I've been told from you, I'd have to get like 3 more KSW-300's to match the performance of the SVS combo! And I think my KSW-300 kicks all kinds of ass! Anyway, I plan on getting the M&K 150THX system here shortly to replace all of my Klipsch speakers. I love the sound of that M&K system.

    Also, would it be better to get 1 SVS Ultra or 2 20-39CS+'s? Damn Tom/Ron you guys sure make it difficult to choose! ;-) But that's a good thing...variety!

    RAF has a MX-350 and a 16-46 and he's in heaven. I know he got the 16-46 to dip deep into the bass realm. RAF, if you read this, how does the 16-46 compare to the M&K?

    Sorry for all the questions. I'm ready to buy, just need a little more info.

    Thanks!

    Chris
     
  2. Chris Rein

    Chris Rein Stunt Coordinator

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    Oh yeah, I almost forgot...

    What about getting (1) 16-49CS+ and (1) 20-39CS+ with a Samson S1000? Would that increase the low frequency range while maintaining high output? I only ask because I know RAF's HT with the 350 and 16-49 are a match made in heaven, or so he says. Has anyone inquired about doing combos like this?

    Thanks!

    Chris
     
  3. RichardH

    RichardH Supporting Actor

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    In general, SVS has recommended not mixing the different sub sizes. In RAF's case, I think he is actually splitting the signal differently between the two subs.

    BTW, did you read on RAF's site where he says that if he had to give up one or the other, he'd keep the SVS? What you're talking about is quite a bit more SVS than a single 16-46 though.

    Why not get the SVS and try it out at home. You know it'll satisfy you in terms of output and extension; take a month to see if it satisfies you musically. If not (unlikely), return it or sell it to someone else locally. If possible, you could get an inhome audition of the M&K sub while you have the SVS there.
     
  4. Chris Rein

    Chris Rein Stunt Coordinator

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    Richard,
    I think that is what I'm going to do. I have a local M&K dealer here so I was thinking about getting the 350 and ordering the SVS 20-39CS+ combo. I can do my own A/B testing and see what is right for me. And the winner will stay, the loser will go home [​IMG]
    That is interesting about mixing the sub sizes. I've not read anything about that. If RAF has it going to 2 different signals, why couldn't you do that with 2 different SVS's? Just a thought.
    Thanks!
     
  5. Brian Corr

    Brian Corr Supporting Actor

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    Chris,

    I have a M&K 5000 and have thought about selling it to get a pair of ultra's or 16-46 plus's.

    I have heard a single 16-46 and the bass is impressive. I'd keep my M&K over one original 16-46 but I'm not sure what I want to do now, with the ultra's and plus's out.

    It's a tough decision.
     
  6. Scott Yuri

    Scott Yuri Stunt Coordinator

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    I recently went through all the same pain you're going through. I had it narrowed to 3 choices and what put me over the top on the SVS 20-39cs+ was the 45 day trial. None of the others I was looking at provided this and all you have to lose is the shipping if you don't like it. Once you hook up your SVS I doubt you will need to anything more from what I've read here. Mine just got here yesterday, and Valentine's day didn't allow me to hook it up yet. Hope this helps.
     
  7. Greg Br

    Greg Br Second Unit

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    I am willing to bet that once you get a dual + system hooked up you will not be returning it. I tried alot of subs out there before mine arrived last week, unfortunatley not the B&K, but there was nothing that could prepare me for the performance of my SVS 20-39cs "i" combnation(and you are looking at +'s). I listened to Sunfire, DefTech, Velodyne and other top brands, they were like the minor leagues!!
     
  8. Tom Vodhanel

    Tom Vodhanel Cinematographer

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    Just a quick note...the CS probably won't be called "i"...or we would have made the running model change back in Dec.The "i" really doesn't have much to do with the new drivers.

    Comparing the performance of the dual 39CS+/S1000 to the MK350...I'm guessing it would take dual 350s to even make it a good race.(
     
  9. KevinHunt

    KevinHunt Stunt Coordinator

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    Chris - I have the 150THX speaker array and used to use dual MX125 subs(basically same as 350 w/ less power). I ordered a pair of the original 16-46CS subs w/ the Samson S700. I removed the 125s and placed the dual 46s in the same corner. The 125s are great woofs but could not come close to the extension and output of the 46s
     
  10. Chris Rein

    Chris Rein Stunt Coordinator

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    Thanks guys for the great information.
    Kevin, did you feel that the SVS combo was as "tight" and "fast" as the M&K's? I love how they are both "tight" and "fast". And they also leave a nice thump on my chest!
    Tom, my room size is 17 x 20 with 9 foot ceiling. I never listen to reference level, then again, Klipsch doesn't need a ton of power to make them come alive. Push them too much they become bright and almost untolerable! I'm looking forward to the crispness of the M&K 150 system. I just need to decide on the bottom end! (3) 350s to match the 20-39+ combo...DAMN!
    Hmmm, I don't know if the 16-46's are what I need. I think the 20-39's would be just right. I don't listen to pipe organ music, but I do like to feel the .1 in movies!
    For what it's worth, I tried going to audition the 350 today, but the store doesn't have one on the floor. Just the 150. And the demo material they had going to it had about ZERO! .1 (*61 baseball movie was their demo).
    Tom/Ron look for my money by the end of the month [​IMG] I think I'm going with the SVS's. Seems like that's the choice around here!
    Any other thoughts or suggestions?
     
  11. Rick Radford

    Rick Radford Supporting Actor

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    It would have been interesting if the M&K sub(s) had been included in this shootout which I'm sure you've already read.
    They included a couple of subs I've never even seen mentioned around here. (Canton and AT-PBM)
    Do your A/B testing and we'll await your report. [​IMG]
     
  12. Tom Vodhanel

    Tom Vodhanel Cinematographer

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    Rick, Brian TRIED to get more subs..including MK.
    Here's some text he posted on another forum right after the review was *out*.
    ""I'm glad you liked the review. I contacted every manufacturer I could think of for this review (including Krell). Most of them returned my calls, but when I sent the list of the subs that had alredy signed onto the list, some became suddenly silent.
    Sunfire, Krell, . . I tried to get them all.""
    I'm sure it was the canton subwoofer that had them worried...[​IMG]
    TV
     
  13. Tom Vodhanel

    Tom Vodhanel Cinematographer

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    Chris, is the room fairly well enclosed? Are you planning on corner placement for the sub(s)?

    About how far from the sub(s) are the key listening positions?

    Even though you won't be listening at reference volumes often...will you want to be able to demo the system for friends at reference level?

    TV
     
  14. BrianAM

    BrianAM Auditioning

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    I just recently replaced my trusty M&K MX-150THX sub with a pair of SVS 20/39 CS+'s and a Samson 1000 watt amp. I currently run an entire M&K S-150 7.1 set-up.

    Now I know I added two subs in place of one, but the dual SVS's are simply awesome - for both movies AND music. I was a little skeptical to move away from my great sounding MX-150THX for music - it's a very tight, musical sub - but I feel I miss nothing with the SVS's. In fact, I think the bass is better on music too - the movie portion was a no brainer soon after I hooked them up!

    I'm a believer in SVS! And, I will admit, I was a bit leary at first switching from M&K subs. Like TV lists in a post above, you would need at least two - if not three - MX-350's to match the dual 20/39 CS+ package. That's a savings that I just couldn't pass up without trying. And boy, am I glad I did. My SVS's are here to stay - along with my M&K speakers!

    Enjoy.

    Brian
     
  15. Chris Rein

    Chris Rein Stunt Coordinator

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    Tom,
    First things first....
    Hell yeah I want to demo material ;-)
    I'm always up for turning the volume knob up just a tad while watching a great action flick!
    And to answer the rest of your questions, I have a nice corner for the sub(s) to go in. The room has one opening at the back of the room (to the left looking forward) the subs would go in the front of the room to the right.
    The subs will be approximately 17 to 18 feet away.
    Brian, thanks for your input. I like to hear from those M&K 150 series owners. It's a killer system, and to say that you're enjoying your 20-39's better makes me put another "tick" in the SVS column.
    Damn that review for using 2 Ultras. I would love to have a pair of ultras, but my budget won't allow for it...yet! The SVS's in that review seemed to do well! I wonder how far off 2 20-39's are from 2 Ultras. Tom? [​IMG]
    Thanks!
     
  16. Tom Vodhanel

    Tom Vodhanel Cinematographer

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    >>>Tom,

    First things first....

    Hell yeah I want to demo material ;-)

    I'm always up for turning the volume knob up just a tad while watching a great action flick! >And to answer the rest of your questions, I have a nice corner for the sub(s) to go in. The room has one opening at the back of the room (to the left looking forward) the subs would go in the front of the room to the right.

    The subs will be approximately 17 to 18 feet away. >Damn that review for using 2 Ultras. I would love to have a pair of ultras, but my budget won't allow for it...yet!
     
  17. Rick Radford

    Rick Radford Supporting Actor

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    Awright Chris.. enough analysis (heh! I should talk!). Let me pull the trigger for you... hold on....

    BLAAAAAAAAM!!!!!!!!!

    OK. Dual 20-39cs+ and Samson 1000 should now be on the way. Oh man, are you gonna be happy. (and that is NOT a question!)

    From one who has tasted of dual SVS's and will have to settle for a driver upgrade, I'm envious!
     
  18. Chris Rein

    Chris Rein Stunt Coordinator

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    Rick...thanks! I needed that!
    Tom,
    Once again, excellent response time. I do have a question about the "Ouch" in your reply...

    Is that too close, too far? I can move it wherever is necessary. That's just the ideal spot. I'm guess the 20-39cs+ combo will do just fine in my room. I always thought that the front of the room in the corner was the "designated" spot. I guess I need to retake the Subwoofer 101 course!!! and hell while I'm at it the "How to set up your HT room 101!"
    FWIW, I'm working on the money as I type this. I'll be ready to nail down the 20-39 combo soon. [​IMG]
     
  19. Tom Vodhanel

    Tom Vodhanel Cinematographer

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    In free air, every time you double the distance you'll lose about 6dB of output. So going from 1m to 6m might drop SPLs about 15dBs. In room, it's harder to predict because of the modal patterns. At certain freqs...you may actually GAIN SPLs by moving away from the subs [​IMG]
    Generally though...the farther away you sit, the more headroom you'll need to reach a given performance level. As far as headroom goes though...SVS is one of the better places to spend your money.
    TV
     
  20. Shane Martin

    Shane Martin Producer

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    I thought I'd weigh in on this issue.

    I currently own the M&K MX90. It's quite a subwoofer and more than most people could want but since I'm going for more output which I feel is lacking now I"m leaning really hard towards a 25-31 CS+ combo once I get my speaker upgrade finished. Since I've heard the SVS combo I'm absolutely sure I'll upgrade, its just a matter of time.

    The M&K is a good sub and great for most people but once you've heard the SVS(and can afford it) you will upgrade.
     

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