ok , Subs now, Paradigm PDR-12 , PS1000 or another brand ??

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by Eric_M, Jan 2, 2002.

  1. Eric_M

    Eric_M Stunt Coordinator

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    OK now is the Sub question.

    My setup thus far,

    Onkyo 595

    Monitor 7 mains

    CC370 center

    Titans /Mini Monitors/Monitor3's for rears..still deciding....Minis are winning so far..

    I am trying to decide what would be better in this setup as far as a sub. I tried the PDR8 and 10 and they don't seem to be that great. The PS1200 seems a bit much for my setup.

    The PDR12 or the PS1000 look to be better choices. What are some advantages or disadvantages to each?

    Furthermore perhaps there is another sub I should consider in the $300-400 or so price range?

    Thanks again
     
  2. Jason Wolters

    Jason Wolters Stunt Coordinator

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    I just bought the PDR 10 over the 12. I thought the PDR 12 was just a little too much. It almost seemed a little boomy to me.
     
  3. Philip J

    Philip J Auditioning

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    I opted for the PDR-10 over 12 as well. I too felt that the "10" sounded much more authoritive in it's bass delivery. It just had more punch for the buck.
     
  4. Dustin B

    Dustin B Producer

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    My preference with that setup would be as follows.

    #1- DIY Tempest or Shiva (
     
  5. Eric_M

    Eric_M Stunt Coordinator

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    Hmm I'd really have to save up some for those listed there like the SVS.

    I will be mainly using my setup for I'd say 60 music 40 movies.

    The PS1000 seems like it could handle things ok too. So can the PDR12. I know I can save I suppose too and get a better sub.

    I don't like to drown my music or movies in bass but I would like to be able to listen to it with a nice bass and not have to max out my sub all the time.
     
  6. ScottieW

    ScottieW Auditioning

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    I used to have a PDR-10 but recently sold it and bought a PW-2200. It sounds great. I have Monitor 11s though. PDR-10 is good but I personally wanted something more that would fill up the room.
    The PW-2200 hits hard. Excellent sub. My friend said it's boomy but I like it. Remember you can always turn it down [​IMG]
     
  7. Dustin B

    Dustin B Producer

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    The PDR series are ported subs. The PW2200 is a ported sub. The Servo15 is a sealed servo controlled sub. Ported subs when done right can sound very good. Both the PDR series and the PW2200 are very close to right.

    The PS series is a bandpass sub. Bandpass designs are very efficient and can play very loud (compared to a sealed or ported sub with the same driver and amp). But to get that efficiency and volume they sacrifice sound quality. The PS series makes a decent HT sub, but I wouldn't touch them for music.
     
  8. Eric_M

    Eric_M Stunt Coordinator

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    Hmm well my setup will be a little more music than HT. I heard the PS1200 at the store and it was pretty nice with music. However it was a bit much though I know you can turn down the bass of course. I was considering the PS1000 instead or perhaps the PDR12. Now you have me thinking if you say the PS series may not be my best choice for music

    So the PW2200 is Paradigm? WHat do these range about?

    I noticed Scottiew says he has this sub but with Monitor 11s so not sure if that means it may be too much for my Monitor 7s
     
  9. jeff lam

    jeff lam Screenwriter

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    I agree 100% w/Dustin. Do not cut corners on the sub, since you have excellent mains, go with something you will be happy with for a long time and can keep up with the system you have. A DIY would be the best performance for cost ratio. I don't know how the PS and PW's perform in comparison to anything else, but is you are looking for a very musical sub, I suppose the Adire Audio Rava is one of the best under $500. So is the HSU VTF2(but not as musical as hte rava I hear). I don't know how they will compare to the Paradigm subs but I'm pretty sure they will wipe the floor with the PDR line. If you plan on spending more than $500, you may as well get an SVS and something to power it with.

    BTW, I would go with the mini's for the surrounds too.
     
  10. Rick Radford

    Rick Radford Supporting Actor

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    It's been said before.. HT has a lot of music as well as LFE.. and a sub that does HT well should also do music well. But a music sub may not do HT as well.
    If you haven't read it, check out this thread.
    This is one of those gems that helped me realize I should not skimp on the sub.
     
  11. Dustin B

    Dustin B Producer

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    The PW2200 is from Paradigm. It is their second from the top sub. It would compare to a SVS 25-31, maybe a 20-39. It lists for just over $800 USD, I think. If I was in Canada I would take the PW2200 over an SVS (with the exchange rate, and the deals to be had on Paradigm in Canada the cost difference wouldn't be worth it). Being in the States the price on the PW2200 isn't anywhere near as good and I would easily take a SVS 20-39 over the PW2200.

    If the SVS is too much money. Then I would be looking at the Rava or VTF2. If I had to stick with Paradigm I would go PDR10 or 12. I wouldn't buy a PS series.

    PS = BandPass = Muddy Boomy Sound
     
  12. Eric_M

    Eric_M Stunt Coordinator

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    I would like a sub that is nicely balanced for music and HT though it will be music slightly more.

    Perhaps the PS series may not be the best idea for music going by what Dustin says.

    is the Rava recommended for HT as well though?

    How about the Velodyne series? How are they in terms of music and HT?
     
  13. John Tillman

    John Tillman Supporting Actor

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    I've used the PS-1000 in my setup for about 2 years (14x18 room). I wouldn't call it boomy.

    To me, it does a nice job for movies providing a full sound. Explosions are good. Not earth shaking, but good. I've been listening to more music lately and I'm more than happy with it.

    Even my bass starved 17 year old son (yea, he wants more)wouldn't call it boomy. You could do worse for the money.
     
  14. Marc H

    Marc H Second Unit

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    Eric,

    Best thing is to go out and listen to a few to hear the differences.

    When I'm doing a demo here in the shop for a client, I play the subs with the speakers shut off so just the sub is playing alone. Then I play some music with good bass content and bass that goes up and down the scale.

    That really shows off the difference in sound between subs and helps one decide what type of bass they prefer.

    I have found some clients like sub distortion and associate that as 'good' bass. Others find that fatiguing and prefer a lower distortion, flatter response sub.

    There's no right or wrong, it's just defining what you prefer.
     
  15. Todd Terwilliger

    Todd Terwilliger Screenwriter

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    I can only comment on the SVS (20-39cs) and it is awesome for both music and HT.
     
  16. Dustin B

    Dustin B Producer

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    I have no credentials to speak of when it comes to building speakers, except that I have built my own sub. The enclosure that is, not the driver and amp, bought those from Adire Audio. However, I did design and build the enclosure myself.
    Yes there are trade offs in designing speaker enclosures. Although I'm a little confused about this statment you made.
     
  17. Dustin B

    Dustin B Producer

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    I also agree with Marc. Some people don't like tight defined clean bass (I think they feel it is missing some impact). Some like the effect that a little distortion or muddiness in bass has. To each his own. So if you listen to the PS series and like it better than the PDR series all the power to you. I personally don't like the sound of the PS series at all. I like the PDR series a lot better and I love my Tempest. Building the Tempest was the best decision in regards to my stereo I have made to date. Brings a smile to my face every time I listen to it.
     
  18. JohnDG

    JohnDG Stunt Coordinator

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    It really depends on how loud you want it.

    A PDR-10 can be pretty flat down to less than 25Hz at 90db's. A PW2200 or a SVS will be much louder and go much lower.

    IMHO, don't be worried about "too much sub." You can always turn it down. :)

    jdg
     
  19. jeff lam

    jeff lam Screenwriter

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    Dustin knows his stuff, that's why he hangs around in the Advanced/DIY area, most everyone that frequently hangs around in the Advanced area will know a lot about Speakers, subs, and electronics, if not, you will learn fast. You can't just build a quality sub without knowing anything about designs and dynamics of drivers and enclosures. BTW, every speaker designer/moderately knowledgable speaker guy knows that band-pass designs are no where near as precise and accurate as ported and sealed designs.

    But hey, if it sounds good to you, that's all that really matters anyway, so go for it!
     
  20. Ariel

    Ariel Stunt Coordinator

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    erik_m, i owned the pdr12 before and although it is quite good for music, it will still lack the impact for movies. when i upgraded my sub, for paradigm lines, i chose between pw2200 and servo15 (costlier) and ended up with the servo15. at first, i'm quite happy with pdr12 for music but when i got the servo15, there is a big difference in sound and performance. if you can strectch your budget a bit, i can recomend the pw2200 or better the servo15. imo the subwoofer is as important as the mains.
     

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