*** Official MILLION DOLLAR BABY Discussion Thread (1 Viewer)

[Brandon Conway]

Eric, per your statement in the Oscar nom thread:



My mistake; didn't read your statement right.

You don't consider euthanasia a controversial topic?

 

[Eric Peterson]

I guess not, because I didn't even give it a moments thought after the movie ended. My assumption was that you were talking about the plot twist when she becomes paralyzed.

Without getting political, I don't see why it's anyone else's business to tell somebody else that they have to continue living. I do see a major difference between Euthanasia and suicide though. In one scenario, you wouldn't continue living without the miracles of modern medicine, in the other someone is taking their own life because they aren't strong enough to deal with life's problems.

I sure as hell hope that if I'm ever in that position, I have the right to tell somebody to pull the plug, because being in that situation is not life.

 

[Patrick Sun]

But that's not how a lot of other people view it, thus, it can be a controversial topic, given the amount of heat the film has received from certain groups that feel strongly on this topic. So, it does depend on each viewer's stance on the issue as to whether or not the decision made is an easy one, or one fraught with internal conflict and misgivings. Eastwood gives us the choice (and nothing was easy about the choice that Frankie makes, given Frankie's psychological and religious make-up), and shows us the humanity of it, and the toll it takes on having to make that choice.

 

[WyattK]

what about runaway jury? the changed that one alot to suit what hollywood wanted to see

 

[Ray Chuang]

Eric Peterson, you wrote:


Indeed, that is my BIG gripe with this movie. The way it ended turned made it a bit too "downer" for me, and I am not surprised by the controversy. And given that AMPAS voters tend to shy away from controversial subjects the majority of the time, this could end up costing Million Dollar Baby the Best Picture Oscar.

Mind you, I think the movie was excellent outside of that ending, and I do expect strong sentiment for Hillary Swank to win Best Actress Oscar and Morgan Freeman to win Best Supporting Actor Oscar.

 

[Eric Peterson]

To me it would have been much more of a downer, if she were forced to lie in a bed for the rest of her life. I actually found the ending to be perfect. If it had ended differently, I think it would've been a thoroughly mediocre movie, but that's what makes the world great, we all have different opinions.

 

[Robert Crawford]

I agree the ending is part of the film's greatness.





Crawdaddy

 

[teapot2001]

Morgan Freeman is on Charlie Rose tonight. I missed Eastwood's appearance a week ago. Did anyone see it?

~T

 

[Ernest Rister]

A certain radio talk show host spilled the beans about M$B to his entire audience of 20 million souls yesterday. I can't believe anyone could be so thoughtless and crass, especially since the movie hasn't even opened in several markets. Unbelievable.

On a completely terciary note, I'm watching the press coverage of M$B very closely. Miramax is infamous for their aggressive Oscar campaigns, which in the past have included leaking dirt and damaging info about their competition to the press (most notably, the dirt surrounding A Beautiful Mind which I'm sure you guys remember -- but Miramax has a bad rep going back even further. When Shakespeare in Love went up against Saving Private Ryan, Miramax spin doctors tried to leak reports that Janet Maslin's favorable coverage of SPR was based on a relationship she had with director Steven Spielberg).

More Dirty Miramax Pool:

"Harvey Weinstein's Miramax scored 40 Oscar nominations in 2003, thanks in part to heavy campaigning for the company's films. One ad quoted esteemed former Academy president Robert Wise (director of West Side Story and The Sound of Music) as endorsing Martin Scorsese for best director for Gangs of New York.

The endorsement came as a surprise to some Hollywood veterans - chief among them former Academy president Robert Wise, who was quick to point out that he had not in fact written the column upon which the ad was based. Who had? A publicist - working for Miramax.
--anecdotage.com

I would not be surprised to see Miramax's Oscar spin machine secretly fanning the flames of M$B's heart-wrenching issues in order to dissuade Academy members from voting for it. Keep an eye out.

****

p.s. Mud-slinging is not exclusive to Miramax - there's an excellent story on the Beautiful Mind war here at the Los Angeles Times archives:

http://www.latimes.com/la-032602gold.story

 

[PeterTHX]

Thus robbing SPR of the Best Picture Oscar I felt it deserved.

"Shakespeare in Love" was a very good film, but "Saving Private Ryan" moved me. The best films, my personal opinion, can move you. I don't think "SiL' will endure as long as "SPR", and that indeed seems to be the case not even 10 years after.

To get back on topic, I think "Million Dollar Baby" is a great film. 2004 was, again my opionion, a very weak year for film. This movie would have been good any year. I'm a big Eastwood fan, and continually amazed with what he can do. I feel the same about Steven Speilberg, however the director stumbled this year with "The Terminal". Maybe 2004 was cursed?

 

[Haggai]

Yeah, that's why, of course. What a schmuck.

 

[Ernest Rister]

Medved is a tool.

None of this is good for M$B, though. Harvey and Bob must be having a good chuckle right about now.

 

[JonZ]

Shakespeare in Love winning best picture was a travesty.

A mediocre film.

 

[Michael Reuben]

This has been extensively debated elsewhere, and this thread isn't the place to revisit the issue.

M.

 

[Tino]

Why do people keep referring to her paralysis and subsequent death by euthenasia as a "twist"?

How is that a twist?? It seemed to me to be a logical, believable occurrence in the story, unexpected perhaps, but not so extreme.

But a twist? I think not. At least not by my definition of the word (i.e Shyamalan movies).

 

[Brandon Conway]

I think it's because it follows the real twist, which is that she becomes paralyzed. You can't discuss the euthanasia aspect without revealing that she becomes paralyzed, so all of it gets lumped into the same thing and gets referred to as "the twist."

 

[Robert Crawford]

Because Hollywood has conditioned the filmgoing public that films should have endings with a feel-good sentiment along with a big bow tied around them. I've seen too many films that could have been great instead of just good because they were diluted by a weak ending due to the people behind the films not having the guts to make a more credible ending that wasn't upbeat in nature. This trend was started back in the Production Code days, but it is still prevalent today, though not as much.





Crawdaddy

 

[Tino]

Again, how is becoming paralyzed a twist?

That's a chance every boxer takes when stepping into a ring.

 

[Robert Crawford]

It's not! However, people are using the term "twist" in a very liberal manner.






Crawdaddy

 

[Eric Peterson]

I think your definition of a twist is a bit restrictive. I'm assuming that your definition means that you've watched the majority of a movie and suddenly a plot element is exposed that changes your opinion on everything you've just viewed. Would that be correct? If so, then there is no twist in M$B.

However, for many people, a sudden and substantive plot turn is called a twist. I'm not sure what a better term would be, but I don't think that you could make an argument against saying there is a huge turn in the plot of M$B.

If you watch the trailers, they're all very uplifting and going into the movie, I think most people are expecting a Rocky-esque film that ends on a high-note. (I certainly was...and I knew there was a twist coming ). When a movie suddenly becomes something different than what one thought they were going to see, it becomes a "Twist".