Ockeghem's All Things DARK SHADOWS (w/Spoilers) (1 Viewer)

[Ockeghem]

George,
 
LOL. I cannot even fathom Barnabas in leather and chains, riding an Indian or Harley. But then again, neither can I imagine Carolyn dressed as Millicent riding with Buzz dressed as Buzz on his bike.
 
Addendum:
 
We completed Collection 2 this weekend, watching episode nos. 284-290 over the weekend. I actually watched these twice. Good viewing, and some wonderful discoveries being made, what with Victoria willingly wanting to be Josette, thunderstorms galore, Willie more anxious than ever, Burke getting on Victoria's nerves, and 'missing' mirrors in The Old House. The second visit by Dr. (or should I say, "Miss" in this context) Hoffman were quite telling and very informative.

 

[GeorgeJA]

Scott,
 
I'm zipping through Disc 4 and I am at episode 287, hoping to finish Collection 2 before going on vacation.
 
I thought it was interesting that DS dispensed with the "My Name Is Victoria Winters" intro at a time when she's once again a big part of the storyline. That night that she spends at the Old House was DS at its eerie best - especially with Barnabas developing a conscience at a crucial time. Of course, Barnabas would never have become as popular as he did if he was just a stock villain. Willie thought he generally liked her and that held him back and perhaps that was true, but I wonder how much that the lurking Sarah is spooking him as well (despite his denials of her being around).
 
Julia Hoffman is also becoming more and more part of the storyline. As you know, I've been pretty much sticking up for writers, but I think they kind of goofed on one instance. There's one episode where Dave Woodard and Julia are arguing about Maggie in that Dave wants to rush her treatment in order to find the madman by asking Maggie questions about her friend Sarah. In a few episodes later, Dave and Julia are taking the exact opposite position - Dave wants her to slow down and Julia wants to speed the recovery by taking her to the cemetery. Perhaps a new idea on how to develop Julia's character created this sea change?
 
On the other hand, the writing was well done for the cemetery scene where Vickie and Burke had a near miss with Maggie and Julia. It was a nice touch that Vickie thought she saw Maggie, after thinking she saw a little girl - which was correct in both cases - but it convinced Burke that she's becoming obsessed with the dead, creating the tension between them and pulling her toward Barnabas.
 
I haven't seen Julia and Barnabas Round 2 yet, but after their first meeting, if I didn't know better, I would have predicted that Julia would be a sure goner from this series. And especially later on when she experiments with Barnabas, I would have expected her character to suffer the same fate as her character did in HOUSE OF DARK SHADOWS.

 

[Ockeghem]

George,
 
I and a few of my children noticed that right away regarding the opening voiceovers. And a few episodes before this, we had Carolyn doing one, then Maggie, and eventually Dr. Hoffman at the beginning of a pertinent segment.
 
We watched #291 last night. Great tension and some excellent writing. I too would have thought that Julia would have been a goner had it not been for her insurance (Maggie being alive, and eventually the journal). The moment when she tells Barnabas that Maggie is still alive is riveting, and his strangle hold on her seems quite real. {As you probably are aware, Dr. Hoffman's scheming will not come without a heavy price, as she will lose one of her best friends.} Still, I'm pleased that the writers had Julia on the side of Barnabas rather than opposing him. She's quite intelligent, and knows just how to keep suspicious people off guard when they get too close to the secret that could lead to his undoing. And she makes it quite clear that Maggie will eventually regain her memory, unless she (Dr. Hoffman) continues to intervene.
 
I really enjoy how they move from The Great House to The Old House during certain episodes. The fading out from one and fading in to the other is so well done much of the time, what with the haunting music, the dark lighting, and the dialogue that often accompanies certain transitional scenes. It really would have been a very enjoyable experience, as well as quite educational, to work on this show in some capacity.
 
Enjoy your vacation.

 

[Mark Collins]

Seaview becomes the focus of the plot. The storyline that involves Seaview has always troubled me as Dark Shadows unfinished buisness. I know Barnabas finds something for Vicki with the name F. McA. C. in the home of Caleb Sayers Collins. I pulled out my old volume of "DS The Introduction of Barnabas" to make sure I spelled everything correct. I know on the family tree there was speculation that Caleb was a decendent of Tad Collins. I want to know what the writters were trying to do here. Barnabas knows the house from past that is obvious. The Return to Collinwood Liz will's the house to Vicki.
 
I would just love to know what the writers had in mind when they brought this house into the picture. Vicki tells Stokes in 1968 the house by the sea is now Blair House. The Collins family could own two house's by the sea??? Why not of course but the way Vicki states it to Stokes makes it seem that it is Caleb's house. The quote was "you know the house by the sea" she states. She implys that it is that house. I just cannot believe this build up about Seaview was just a plot point to wrap up where Burke and Vicki decided to live after they were married and a change at Liz's suggestion. I will not spoil by adding more. The house had such a build up. We learn from Liz Caleb was sort of strange he collected things and never married. I wanted to hear more. I am sorry I just had to talk about this. You guys are great!!! Have a good Vacation Scott I am sure it is well deserved. I also forgot to mention the picture of Seaview shows up in the 1897 episode where Tim Shaw finds the coffin with what I always called Adam's music playing in the background.
 
I guess if Dallas can have two different Southfork's DS can have two different looking Seaviews.

 

[Ockeghem]

Mark,
 
Those are all excellent points. As Dan Curtis often said, some of the things they tried worked, while others didn't. But you know what kind of bothers me the most about another story line which occurs at nearly the same time as the Seaview story line? I've wondered for quite some time how Sarah Collins helped Maggie walk approximately 100 miles from the hospital! I just chalk that up to the supernatural somehow.
 
Tonight, we watched episode nos. 294-295. And what a shock at the conclusion of 294, when Maggie walks into the Blue Whale! {BTW, several months ago, I wrote about the red dress of Maggie that we finally see when they go to color. Although #295 brings us to the color episodes, it was actually Victoria's dress -- and not Maggie's -- that was red. I believe I'm thinking of an episode that will be occurring soon after this, when Maggie and Sam are in the Blue Whale.} Anyway, I remember many years ago at my surprise when they went to color, and I didn't expect it. It was quite a contrast, to be sure.

 

[Mark Collins]

Scott I was always afraid the show would be canceled until ABC ran a promo stateing Barnabas Collins host's a party stay tuned on Friday. I even counted the days each Villian had on DS. Gee I thought Barnabas has gone beyond all of them. I remember 1897 when Diana Millay meets Barnabas and states "so your Barnabas Collins" which to me had double meaning. So that is why this show is still on the air thought she was saying. You are the super star. I like how he received Star credit next in 1969. Julia was always right after him in the credits too. I myself watch every year at this time 1968 and 1897 at the same time of year they aired.. I love the 1968 storyline the best until it ends after Thanksgiving. I also watch 1897 the episode's from summer 1897 until the time switch. You see my Aunt whom I was very close to watched the Labor Day episode of Trask waiting for Quentin to change in the Collinwood cell. She watched it just to see why I LOVED this show The cool part was she watched it at my Grandparents house while I watched it at home. The family then picked me up from home for our annual Labor Day Ride. I relished as my Aunt went through the entire episode wanting explantions. I play the 1968 Labor Day when Barnabas has to deal with Tom Jennings on Labor day and the 1967 episode with Barnabas and Vicki too while everyone is looking for David. Thankyou for bringing back some wonderful memories for me.

 

[Ockeghem]

[COLOR= #303030]Mark,[/COLOR]
 
[COLOR= #303030]Those sound like some wonderful memories there. Thanks for sharing them. [/COLOR][COLOR= #303030]J[/COLOR][COLOR= #303030] You certainly do seem to know the show very well, and are very detailed in your posts.[/COLOR]
[COLOR= #303030]Tonight, we re-watched nos. 294 and 295 (for our younger girls). When we moved on to episode #296, I was surprised to see that it was a kinescope – and immediately after the switch to color![/COLOR]
[COLOR= #303030]Backing up to episode #295, I noticed how the music in the Blue Whale was quite serious when Maggie walked in, and how it was stopped too abruptly (#294) and then corrected during the subsequent take during the opening of the following episode (#295). And speaking of alternate takes, another thing I like -- and this has been done numerous times on Dark Shadows when a similar scene is repeated -- is how they did different takes from the closing of one episode to the opening of the next. The variant angles are quite a treat, as are the subtle nuances with regard to the delivery of the script by the actors.[/COLOR]
 
[COLOR= #303030]We're up through episode #297 at this point. Maggie's memory has sufficiently been surpressed.[/COLOR]

 

[Ockeghem]

We've completed the first 298 episodes thus far. Last night, #298 took place entirely in the Evans cottage. It's not all that often that entire episodes remain within one set. (Maggie's bedroom was also used, so I suppose that this constitutes a second set although it was still in the cottage.)
 
The scene between Maggie and Sarah was quite good. I suspected that even Maggie's memories of having met Sarah were going to be supressed, and Sarah was none too happy about it. She chalked it up to another person forgetting about her. Later in the episode, there is a knock at the Evans door, and it turns out to be Barnabas. I didn't expect that, even though I'd seen the episode before. His questioning Maggie about her memory relative to her kidnapper was filled with suspense, and the way they focused on Barnabas' facial reactions to her responses was noteworthy. Maggie eventually discusses her relationship with Sarah. When Barnabas asks Maggie the name of the little girl that is her best friend, and she responds with 'Sarah,' you can see quite a shock on the face of Barnabas as he puts the pieces together. He finally deduces in his own mind that he must do away with Maggie. When he visits her room as she sleeps, he takes a pillow to suffocate her, at which point we hear "London Bridge is falling down...".

 

[Brent S]

 

Originally Posted by Ockeghem
Regarding Mitchell Ryan and his drinking, I've known about his issue with this for years. But it was only a few years ago that I discovered that he was also good friends with another alcoholic, Ralph Waite (John Walton), and that the two of them used to drink together often. I would have loved to have seen Ryan continue in this role, though. It would have been quite interesting to see the chemistry between he and a few other characters that are to come on the scene in the next two or three story arcs. Just think of he and Lara Parker in a scene together. Oh well....

Since you're a STAR TREK fan too, it would have been interesting to see Mitch Ryan as 'Capt. Picard' in TNG. Mitch Ryan was on the short list of actors who tested for the role.
 
http://www.google.com/url?sa=D&q=http://cache.gawkerassets.com/assets/images/4/2010/08/500x_startrekcasting.jpg&usg=AFQjCNEOh3DCuoxP5MhxNNwZbU_K3-e9kQ
 
(Of course, he did guest later on, as Ryker's father.)
 

 

[Ockeghem]

Brent,
 
I knew of his role in The Icarus Factor, but didn't know that he was on the short list for the role of Capt. Picard. Interesting.
 
Tonight, we watched a few more episodes, and are now up to episode #300. We're almost a quarter of the way through the series. Just another 6 1/4 episodes to go before we're actually there. My daughter and I decided several months ago to begin at the beginning, and we've gotten this far and have loved every minute of it.
 
I'll write more later, once George has returned from his vacation and has had a chance to watch a few more episodes.

 

[GeorgeJA]

Hey guys,
 
I was lucky to have the new disc waiting for me in my mailbox when I returned, so I proceeded to watch some episodes:
 
In one scene, a fly lands on Barnabas' face and stays there - I know it was totally unintentional but it was a nice touch nevertheless.
 
What's cool about the Sarah character is that, with the exception of Barnabas, no one knows that she's a ghost - not even her. We've gotten a lot of reactions from Barnabas during the course of the series whenever Sarah is mentioned (Scott, you bring up one yourself in his chat with Maggie). Now that Julia has become a big part of the show, she gets to compete with Barnabas in reaction shots and she's had a few good ones already upon hearing info about Sarah, Maggie or Barnabas. Who will win the Reaction Award? Stay tuned.
 
Maggie's return to Blue Whale was well-staged, but I'm sorry, I couldn't help thinking how did she get to the Blue Whale from Windcliff Sanitarium in one day - wow, talk about speedwalking!
 
The first color episode - previously I only knew this show in color, but after watching almost 300 episodes in B/W, it actually feels weird now to see it in color. Go figure. Some of us expressed a preference for B/W for this show, including myself, but I have to admit it was nice to see Maggie's lovely red hair again.
 
Mark mentioned in passing about Barnabas moving up in the credits - I often wondered if there was a distinct pecking order for the credits. I knew Joan Bennett came first when she appeared, and Alexandra Moltke came last when she appeared, but I didn't know that there was a distinct order for the rest.

 

[Mark Collins]

Welcome back George!!! Yes Jonathan Frid got top billing in fall of 1969. Starring Jonathan Frid as Barnabas Collins when Joan was on it would say also starring Jonathan Frid. Grayson had moved up and always followed him. Barnabas Collins had been the first name I would say back in the 1795 flash back. I think Dr Julia Hoffman had followed Barnabas for some time. I also thought the writers were very wise to understand Julia was going to stay Julia from when she joined Barnabas in Parallel Time. I also thought PT 1841 lost some punch when Grayson and Jonathan had very limted screen time due to the story line. I watched the Dick Cavett Show when Jonathan was a guest twice daytime and once night time. He took questions and one man commented on the great chemistry between Jonathan and Grayson. He also went on the "tonight show" show Dec 1970 to tell viewers DS was changing the storyine and Barnabas would be Barnabas again. Julia and Barnabas at that time were again at odds in storyine. He did so the night before the Dream Vampire show aired. I cheered when I heard this. I look forward eagerly to the Scott and George Review of Dark Shadows.

 

[Ockeghem]

Mark,
 
Nice thoughts, as usual. The storylines you mention are very interesting. It will be fun to see them again one day.
 
We finished episodes 301-303 tonight. We’ll be watching #302-#303 again for our other children over the weekend. There is some wonderful tension between Barnabas and Burke at this point. Sarah again is playing quite a role, even when she doesn’t have any screen time. Tonight, Barnabas confirmed to Julia that she has returned from the dead (although not said in exactly those words). And Burke’s suspicions are become greater – and the music box given to Victoria by Barnabas isn’t hurting his cause any. I’ll write more as I digest a few more episodes.

 

[GeorgeJA]

Thanks Mark! I also agree with you about 1841 PT. It wasn't a bad story per se, but it was hard to get into it because there was no link to any of the characters we knew and loved. But I had heard that Jonathan Frid had wanted to play another character, so this was the result. If only they could have squeezed one more story before they were cancelled. The final episode should have been in present day with the core characters.
 
As for our review, I finished #300. Julia introduces the infamous hypnotic medallion to make Maggie forget all about her abduction - and just in the nick in time as she regained her entire memory. It was a nice way to keep the story going, and I assume at this point, the DS team decided there's no way they could do away with Barnabas - he was just too popular. I seem to remember in one of interviews with the writers - I'm not sure if it was with Malcolm or Ron Sproat - that were originally going to end the storyline, and it would have been interesting to see how their original storyline would've played out. In any event, Maggie has forgotten that incident, and really, it's nice to see her in a cheerful mood again.
 
It looks like Vickie and Burke are getting hot and heavy now - much to Barnabas' chagrin. There was a nice little character moment where Burke talks about his father and Vickie mentions the foundling home.
 
I find it very funny how Julia and Willie are nagging Barnabas to keep on the straight and narrow. It's almost like they've become his parents, and his annoyed reaction to these lectures are becoming funny too. It's also kind of strange that Willie being bitten by a vampire has had the opposite of the usual effect - he turned into a decent guy.
 
Roger's really been MIA.

 

[Ockeghem]

Over the weekend, we watched ten episodes (nos. 301-310). We watched each of these episodes twice. We also caught the special feature of Sharon Smythe (Sarah Collins) a second time.
 
Willie's cleverness pretty much saved Burke Devlin's life. Barnabas listened to Willie, and Vicky listented to Barnabas, and Burke listened to Vicky -- all due to Willie's suggestion that Burke's life might be able to be spared.
 
Sarah has figured very prominently in several of these episodes. And she and David are discovering some neat things about the mausoleum -- one of which will land David in a bit of a fix for a couple of days.
 
It was nice to see David's crystal ball back in action. And I liked how 'Kitten' actually took him seriously when he said that he saw Sarah's whereabouts in it -- that was a nice touch, especially from someone who has in the past referred (rightfully, I might add) to cousin David as a 'little monster.'
 
The ultimatum issued by Victoria to Burke was wonderful. It really woke Burke up, and Barnabas came out of it not only unscathed, but actually looking quite good in both of their eyes (not that he wasn't already at the top of the platonic pedestal from Victoria's point of view, of course).
 
{N.B.: I thought I'd add that Maggie has good taste in drinks -- scotch. When I used to drink, that was my drink of choice. And kudos to Bob -- he really has his hands full at the Blue Whale, given that he doesn't have all that much help in addition to himself. }
 
Speaking of the Blue Whale, it was neat to hear a few standards from the 1960s playing on the juke box. I recall hearing these tunes when I was a child, and hearing them again brought back some nice memories of my childhood.
 
The scenes just prior to Barnabas visiting the Great House -- at which time he will get his apology from Burke -- were interspersed very effectively with Julia's 'sensing' of Sarah at the Old House, and just outside of the Old House. And for much of this particular scene at the Old House, we get what my daughter and I refer to as 'level three' ghost music -- and it repeats over and over, which to our ears was a welcome treat. All too often, we get this theme, but it's too short as hints of a ghost don't usually last this long at one time in one scene. The eerie quality of the music is exceptional, and this particular theme is among my most favorite musical excerpts of the series -- very TOL (original series) in parts.
 
This series is so very good on a variety of levels. And I really don't think I'll ever appreciate sets for other series (daytime or otherwise) as much as I do those used on Dark Shadows.

 

[GeorgeJA]

Hey Scott,
 
I caught up with you after tearing through the latest DS disk over the long weekend.
 
These were some wonderful episodes for me because it brought out what is probably my favorite aspect of DS - where the characters try to solve a mystery. First, there is Burke and his suspicions of Barnabas - getting all the clues that seem to be pointing toward Barnabas being the maniac that kidnapped Maggie. First, he interviews Dave Woodard, then speaks to Blair (haven't seen him in awhile, but I love good continuity), then Maggie herself. Burke was doing his best imitation of Columbo here. And the piece de resistance was talking to Vickie and hearing the music box with the tinkling sound that was Maggie's sole memory of the experience. Now, why a savvy guy like Burke didn't take it a step further and play the music for Maggie, I don't know (yes, i do know. The writers didn't want him to find out the truth

Then we have everybody's search for Sarah, but I especially enjoyed Joe and Sam's investigation. If Burke was the not quite Columbo, I guess they could be considered Simon and Simon I especially ate up that scene at the Blue Whale with Joe, Sam, Maggie, Vickie, and then Burke comparing notes and trying to put the clues together about who is Sarah, where did she come from, why does she dress like that?
 
Scott, yes the music is so terrific in that scene where Julia senses Sarah in the Old House. This is one of those shows where music plays such an important part. I don't know if you've been following the saga of "The Fugitive" on DVD, where they replaced a good chunk of the music for that show. Fans of that show are rightfully enraged over this, but imagine if there was a music rights issue for this DS DVD collection. That would be utterly devastating to the enjoyment of this show.
 
Finally, I'll comment about David and the mausoleum. That last episode in the disk, I think I do remember seeing this.

 

[Ockeghem]

George,
 
Those are some interesting observations / insights.
 
That entire music box sequence sure is compelling. It reminds me in some ways of the story line involving Burke's pen. While watching these episodes, it occurred to me how strange it would be for a newbie to see veteran viewers so engaged at the opening and closing of a music box, or a little girl playing catch with a grown woman in her bedroom, or the smell of jasmine having so much meaning in a particular scene, or how slowly characters like Barnabas and Willie open up a creaking door to a mausoleum, etc. The writers and others for this show were quite gifted in many ways.
 
That scene in the Blue Whale was awesome, wasn't it? And whenever a character mentioned that 'old fashioned' dress, the wheels started turning in the minds of the characters as well as those of the viewer. Have you noticed that Sarah's last name has rarely been alluded to (with the exception of a listing or two in the credits) in the show thus far?
 
As far as The Fugitive and the music issues are concerned, it is a travesty. I picked up the entire series on DVD a few years ago, so replacement music has never been an issue for me. I am very pleased that similar issues did not exist with The Outer Limits (original series), Dark Shadows, or Star Trek. It could have ruined these shows for me, I believe.
 
"Finally, I'll comment about David and the mausoleum. That last episode in the disk, I think I do remember seeing this."
 
You're correct, it closes out the disc. When we got to this point, our younger children were pleading for me to put on another episode. But since we had watched a ton already, I told them that they would have to wait a few more days.
 
Addendum: Last night, our daughters were thrilled when I surprised them with more episodes of Dark Shadows. Even our five-year old was getting into the 'David is trapped in the mausoleum' story. We watched three episodes (nos. 311-313). More viewing this weekend!

 

[GeorgeJA]

Scott,
 
I can relate to your kid's fascination with David's predicament - I was a youngun' myself when I first saw those episodes, and looking back at it, that was a perfect introduction to DS for me.
 
This storyline reminds of me of another aspect of DS that I really love -- the near miss. It looked like Roger and Joe were going to find David, but due to circumstances, it didn't happen. We saw that already when Matthew Morgan was holding Vickie hostage in the Old House when Burke, and I think it was Joe again, came so close to finding her, but not quite.
 
A funny thing happened - during one of the Eagle Hill scenes, I was thinking about whatever happened to the Caretaker, and the minute I thought that, he suddenly he pops up! I have to admit I laughed when the Caretaker reacted to David's cry of 'Help' with 'There's no help for you!', thinking it was one of the ghosts. Roger's reaction to the Caretaker's babbling was priceless too.
 
Barnabas' paranoia is fascinating to watch, and how well-done the writing captures this. When David runs into Barnabas, he lies to him to keep Sarah's promise, but those lies just make Barnabas more paranoid. On top of that, Barnabas' actions have actually done more to make David suspicious of him. It's funny because the secrets David and Sarah share are totally innocent.
 
I have two more episodes to watch on this disc before exchanging with the next one. I have learned to time this well, so that I don't have too much downtime between discs.

 

[Ockeghem]

George (and others who may not yet own this series on DVD),
 
I wrote to MPI this morning, and they are selling the Dark Shadows DVD Collections for app. $35.00 at the moment. They are normally just under $60.00 per collection. Amazon.com is also selling them for around $25.00; however, depending on the seller, the price can also go as high (if not higher) than that of the normal price offered by MPI.

 

[Jack Cleveland]

I've been purchasing my DVDs from Amazon at a savings of 50% off for a while... I have 10 volumes waiting, as I am only on Vol 11 of the series. When I finish these (years from now!!) I will start picking up the first year. I figure I better buy while I can... What if they run out of a volume or two?