No new formats?

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by ChrisAG, Jul 11, 2002.

  1. ChrisAG

    ChrisAG Supporting Actor

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    It seems that for the past six years or so new formats were coming out fairly regularly, fast enough to make equipment obsolete very quickly. Examples, the order that I remember them:

    DD
    DTS
    DD EX
    DTS ES / ES Discreet
    DPL-2
    DTS 96/24
    Plus of course other enhancements such as dual rear centre surround and component video switching.

    Are we finally reaching the end of the road, or at least a slowdown of new format introductions? If so, what will the manufacturers do to entice us to upgrade?
     
  2. chung_sotheby

    chung_sotheby Supporting Actor

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    i myslef was happy with 5.1, but I must say that DPLII and DTS Neo are both very very good formats. I think that in terms of the sound formats, any addition to the 7 speaker configs that many of us already use would be overkill, for who can afford, or even fit, more than seven speakers peacefully in their listening rooms? I think that the only thing that we can count on are upgrades of the sound formats, kind of like Dolby Digital II or DTS II, where the logarithms are better worked out for even more ambience and naturalness, but I dont think that there will be any addtion of speakers anytime soon
     
  3. Michael Reuben

    Michael Reuben Studio Mogul

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  4. Charles J P

    Charles J P Cinematographer

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    The next things that will get people upgrading again will be more features that dont have anything to do with new sound formats, but still seem like must-haves
    --ease of use features like auto calibrating speakers like the new Pioneer Elite flagships
    --better remotes on cheaper units
    --amps that actually meet their specs would be nice. [​IMG]
    --more auto sensing format features or customizability like "I always want DTS if available"
    --of course theres DVD-A and SACD. If these features ever become recordable, we'll need high bandwidth recording loops, same with D-VHS and recordable DVD.
    A sound format is a feature. There will always be new features, and the old features will become cheaper to implement, and will move down the line to cheaper receivers.
     
  5. Greg_R

    Greg_R Screenwriter

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    Hopefully we'll see video conversion trickle down to other receivers as well!
     
  6. GordonL

    GordonL Supporting Actor

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    What about DD 7.1 discrete?
     
  7. Jason Wilcox

    Jason Wilcox Supporting Actor

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    dolby headphone should catch on soon
     
  8. BrianDD

    BrianDD Agent

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    I think one of the next things we'll see is a direct (and probably copy-protected) digital connection from DVD-A and SACD players to our recievers/preamps to replace analog. As far as surround formats go, yeah it has probably died down for a while. EX and ES still haven't really taken off as far as supporting software goes so it would be silly for any more formats to be introduced.
     
  9. Kevin C Brown

    Kevin C Brown Producer

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    Maybe not necessarily formats per se, but new "processing" that also should be in that list is Logic 7 and THX Ultra2.

    And, for example, I don't really think of DPL II or DTS:NEO 6 as formats anyway, because they both are *DPS* algorythms applied to good old stereo sources.

    But then again, for DSP processing, you could also add Rotel's xS modes and Outlaw's CES modes. (I.e., "expansion" of DD/DTS 5.1 sources to 6.1/7.1 speaker setups, not unlike Logic 7 and THX Ultra2.)
     
  10. GregK

    GregK Screenwriter

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    ..Don't discount a HEIGHT channel just yet either! :wink:
     
  11. Holadem

    Holadem Lead Actor

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    I have never been crazy about format wars. It will be along while before sixth speaker graces my living room...

    Everything I have read points to the 6 and 7 channel formats being marginal improvement at best over good ol 5.1.

    Last, I still wonder where the hardware people are running with all these features without software. We now have a boat load of 6.1 and 7.1 receivers. How many DVDs take advantage of those?

    --
    Holadem
     
  12. ling_w

    ling_w Second Unit

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    So sad seeing all the formats come out and making the previous one obsolete.

    Ambisonic, a 4 channel format that could be transported in 3 channels, has been around since the 70's. It does not limit the number of playback channels, it encodes in 3-D, so height information would be there from day 1. And nobody's equipment would be obsolete today if they got it 10-20 years ago. If you were Ambi-lite, you could just utilize 4 channels, but if you were serious multi-channel person, you could be having 23 or 48 channel ambisonic system with multiple-tiered hight channels.
     
  13. Geoff S

    Geoff S Stunt Coordinator

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    Perhaps 7.1 Discrete? Be easy to add to exisitng receivers that are 7.1 playing 6.1 sources. Simply make a format that has stereo in the surround back. However since 6.1 hasn't really taken off to the full extreme yet I don't forsee it any time soon, but this will probably will be the next step in a few more years.
    Keep in mind such a tiny few have 6.1 it is almost insignificant. More people have 5.1 and are happy with it (including me [​IMG]). Many still only use Pro-Logic. Lots of other use simple 2 channel stereo for everything. Those of us who make up the users of the upper end digital audio (5.1/6.1) are a very very small percentage. I'd say it's safe to buy a complete system now without fear of anything being obsolete for years to come. I see no need to go from 5.1 to 6.1 even. I will be ready for it when the times comes, but not yet for me. I'm sure 6.1 would sound great to me... in a huge room with the equipment manufacturers voices repeating in my head "this is better, this is better". In the end, is it really that much better than a great 5.1 system? (rhetorical)
    One more note... a possible playback format being played around with by Tomlinson Holman (THX) that deserves attention. Called THX 10.2. It is a playback system for multichannel music. Probably would Matrix 5.1 sources from DVD-A or SACD, or possibly a full 10.2 source. It uses a Center Channel, 2 main speakers in the near position, 2 main speakers in the high position, 2 mains in the wide position, 2 dipole surrounds, and a direct radiating surround in the rear, plus dual subs. However this would require us having new THX 10.2 processors, and 4 more main speakers in special positions that most of us don't have the money or room for. Perhaps in 20 years this might be what we're considering moving too. Just an FYI for those who haven't heard yet. Although I might have just opened a can of worms for this thread...
     
  14. Greg Haynes

    Greg Haynes Supporting Actor

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    One word...FIREWIRE

    Firewire won't be a new format but it will make equipment so easy to setup and the wiring nest behind everyone's rack will be eliminated. I see this as being hottest thing coming next year.
     
  15. ChrisAG

    ChrisAG Supporting Actor

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  16. Kevin C Brown

    Kevin C Brown Producer

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  17. Dan Hitchman

    Dan Hitchman Cinematographer

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    Any new HD-DVD format that comes out I want it to have the ability to playback 7.1 discrete DSD or MLP compressed (otherwise it's too large a file) 7.1 discrete PCM at up to 24 bit/192 kHz resolution on all channels. 7.1 = full range, stereo back channels.

    Some of these super capacity discs coming down the pike could pull it off if the manufacturers were smart enough to relegate DTS and Dolby Digital to the scrap heap. We don't need more compression, just more space to use LESS or NONE AT ALL.

    Dan
     
  18. JaleelK

    JaleelK Second Unit

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  19. Kevin C Brown

    Kevin C Brown Producer

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    Jaleel- Man, you really must not like any old movies! [​IMG] A LOT of movies are still only encoded with DD 2.0. *That's* what DPL-II is for. Just an improved DPL.
    I just watched the Parallax View. Great political thriller from '74 with Warren Beatty.
    BTW IMO, the *best* use of Logic 7 is to expand 5.1 DD/DTS soundtracks to 7.1.
     
  20. Greg Haynes

    Greg Haynes Supporting Actor

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    Yeah Jaleel, just to get rid of movie because it wasn't recorded in 5.1 seems pretty sad. Its sounds like your more interested in the sound than the actual picture. Do you watch any classic old movies? DPLII has greatly improved my classic movies.
    If your only interested in 5.1 and not the movie you might want to consider some of these fine titles [​IMG]
    Freddy Got Fingered
    Battlefield Earth
    Lucky Numbers
    Glitter
    All come in glorious 5.1 Dolby Digital.
     

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