International Night Passage (1957) out now in France (1 Viewer)

[aHorseofCourse]

Looks a bit smoothed over to me so I will wait for the version from Explosive media. They already retained a more filmlike picture and a higher bitrate for Comanche Station compared to the French release from Sidonis so it will hopefully again be a better release.

Yes, looking closely at the disc (and getting right up to the screen) there might be a little edge enhancement/digital manipulation, which isn't unusual from Universal. But in motion the film looks excellent.
And don't equate this Elephant release with others from Sidonis. I agree that Blus and DVDs from Sidonis can be truly awful, but this is much better quality than those. So not all French Blus are bad (Carlotta's discs, for example, are really excellent). And while Explosive Media do great stuff, I'd still be surprised if Universal isn't supplying the same scan for their release. Nice to have two releases to pick from regardless!

 

[OliverK]

Yes, looking closely at the disc (and getting right up to the screen) there might be a little edge enhancement/digital manipulation, which isn't unusual from Universal. But in motion the film looks excellent.
And don't equate this Elephant release with others from Sidonis. I agree that Blus and DVDs from Sidonis can be truly awful, but this is much better quality than those. So not all French Blus are bad (Carlotta's discs, for example, are really excellent). And while Explosive Media do great stuff, I'd still be surprised if Universal isn't supplying the same scan for their release. Nice to have two releases to pick from regardless!

I agree that they do not all have to be bad and Sidonis also has good releases, there are also a number of very bad German Blu-rays.

But when I can see that things look a bit fishy and when there is another release coming out I will be happy to wait for it.

I agree that the Explosive release may look the same as the processing has already been applied by Universal and that will be fine with me, too but I would rather wait for that.

Sidonis did get the same master fro Comanche Station that Explosive Meida got to my knowledge and look how different the grain is handled, not that one would expect that much grain from a technirama production:

http://www.dvdclassik.com/upload/images/galeries/disque-comanche-station13.jpg

vs

http://caps-a-holic.com/c.php?go=1&a=0&d1=9987&d2=9986&s1=97141&s2=97133&i=6&l=0

This is a DVD to Blu-ray comparison so you have to use a mouseover - I hope they will add the Sidonis release at some point.

 

[aHorseofCourse]

I agree that they do not all have to be bad and Sidonis also has good releases, there are also a number of very bad German Blu-rays.

But when I can see that things look a bit fishy and when there is another release coming out I will be happy to wait for it.

I hope your patience is rewarded, OliverK.
Even if they do turn out to be the same transfer, you can at least take comfort from the fact that it's nothing like the Sidonis "Comanche Station" release. Those caps all look like recreations of movie scenes by Madame Tussauds!

 

[OliverK]

I hope your patience is rewarded, OliverK.
Even if they do turn out to be the same transfer, you can at least take comfort from the fact that it's nothing like the Sidonis "Comanche Station" release. Those caps all look like recreations of movie scenes by Madame Tussauds!

I do not really expect much of an improvement as Universal has been know to "treat" its older masters in certain ways but who knows I might be in for a surprise!

Yes Comanche Station is a very unfortunate example of a company getting a decent but relatively old master and trying to "improve" it. This isn't the only title that Sidonis released like that so I would never buy anything from them without seeing some caps first.

 

[Robin9]

The only edge enhancement I noticed was in the scene in the barn where Dianne Foster is standing in profile at the door with only the left side of her face towards the camera. William Daniels lit her from the right so that the moon illuminates the right side of her forehead. In that scene there is a pronounced halo around her nose. It's been decades since I saw a print of Night Passage but I doubt that William Daniels made an elementary mistake in over lighting his actress. He may of course have believed film stock of the time would reduce the effect.

I was pleased with the presentation of the film. I thought the colors were superb; and such variety! I'd have to see a different presentation before forming an opinion about the images being "smoothed" but I did notice that the faces of middle-aged actors did not have as many lines and wrinkles as I would normally expect. I wasn't troubled by that as it may have been caused by the make-up artists.

My one reservation is about the sound. First, to removes the subtitles I had to use the remote control. Using the screen menu did not remove subtitles when James Stewart is singing! Second, the dialog was not in synchronization with the images and was about one second ahead of the images. I was fiddling about with my remote trying compensate for this but gave up. I'm going to watch this disc again tonight with two other Blu-ray players. The disc is Zone-free so I'm not restricted in that regard!

 

[OliverK]

The only edge enhancement I noticed was in the scene in the barn where Dianne Foster is standing in profile at the door with only the left side of her face towards the camera. William Daniels lit her from the right so that the moon illuminates the right side of her forehead. In that scene there is a pronounced halo around her nose. It's been decades since I saw a print of Night Passage but I doubt that William Daniels made an elementary mistake in over lighting his actress. He may of course have believed film stock of the time would reduce the effect.

I was pleased with the presentation of the film. I thought the colors were superb; and such variety! I'd have to see a different presentation before forming an opinion about the images being "smoothed" but I did notice that the faces of middle-aged actors did not have as many lines and wrinkles as I would normally expect. I wasn't troubled by that as it may have been caused by the make-up artists.

My one reservation is about the sound. First, to removes the subtitles I had to use the remote control. Using the screen menu did not remove subtitles when James Stewart is singing! Second, the dialog was not in synchronization with the images and was about one second ahead of the images. I was fiddling about with my remote trying compensate for this but gave up. I'm going to watch this disc again tonight with two other Blu-ray players. The disc is Zone-free so I'm not restricted in that regard!

Thanks for taking one for the team - there seem to be some issues with the disc from what you say and even if it gets exchanged it would be quite a hassle for somebody ordering from abroad. I will look for the scene you mention - and the faces - on the German disc. This will be my first time watching this movie though so I will try not to scrutinize the picture quality too much.

 

[aHorseofCourse]

My one reservation is about the sound. First, to removes the subtitles I had to use the remote control. Using the screen menu did not remove subtitles when James Stewart is singing! Second, the dialog was not in synchronization with the images and was about one second ahead of the images. I was fiddling about with my remote trying compensate for this but gave up. I'm going to watch this disc again tonight with two other Blu-ray players. The disc is Zone-free so I'm not restricted in that regard!

That's odd, Robin9. I didn't notice any issues with the sound sync playing back on my Oppo 93, although it was only a quick run through and I wasn't paying as much attention as you obviously did. I was also able to remove the subtitles at the menu stage, first by selecting the English version then selecting "Sans" subs. Be interesting to see how others find it.

 

[haineshisway]

Thanks for taking one for the team - there seem to be some issues with the disc from what you say and even if it gets exchanged it would be quite a hassle for somebody ordering from abroad. I will look for the scene you mention - and the faces - on the German disc. This will be my first time watching this movie though so I will try not to scrutinize the picture quality too much.

What he's actually saying is that he's not sure if it's his player, so best not to make the auto leap to "there seem to be some issues with the disc" - the poster above me has already stated he didn't notice any issues with the disc - sound sync, in my experience, is the fault of the player, not the disc. As to edge enhancement, he's not saying definitively that it's there and even if he was saying it, he's saying it's in one SHOT, which makes me think it's not there at all or it's on the entire film and he didn't notice it. I should have it in a few days and will be more than happy to report on it.

 

[OliverK]

What he's actually saying is that he's not sure if it's his player, so best not to make the auto leap to "there seem to be some issues with the disc" - the poster above me has already stated he didn't notice any issues with the disc - sound sync, in my experience, is the fault of the player, not the disc. As to edge enhancement, he's not saying definitively that it's there and even if he was saying it, he's saying it's in one SHOT, which makes me think it's not there at all or it's on the entire film and he didn't notice it. I should have it in a few days and will be more than happy to report on it.

Some discs only have issues with certain players makes or models but if one owns one of them it still is not very helpful, so I was expecting him to get back to us with a report from his other players.

As for the edge enhancement I am not sure why you are adressing me as I have not brought it up as being there or being a problem, just that i would have a look. Looking forward to your report while I am biding my time waiting for the Explosive Media release.

 

[Robin9]

That's odd, Robin9. I didn't notice any issues with the sound sync playing back on my Oppo 93, although it was only a quick run through and I wasn't paying as much attention as you obviously did. I was also able to remove the subtitles at the menu stage, first by selecting the English version then selecting "Sans" subs. Be interesting to see how others find it.

It is odd. In my set-up, selecting "sans" from the menu disables the French subtitles except for the main title and when James Stewart is singing! I have no explanation for that, but it was the same last night with a Zone B Sony Blu-ray player.

 

[Robin9]

What he's actually saying is that he's not sure if it's his player, so best not to make the auto leap to "there seem to be some issues with the disc" - the poster above me has already stated he didn't notice any issues with the disc - sound sync, in my experience, is the fault of the player, not the disc. As to edge enhancement, he's not saying definitively that it's there and even if he was saying it, he's saying it's in one SHOT, which makes me think it's not there at all or it's on the entire film and he didn't notice it. I should have it in a few days and will be more than happy to report on it.

The sound issues must be player dependant. I watched the disc again last night with a different Blu-ray player, and the sound synchronization problem was reduced although still there.

The halo effect is very prominent in that one scene and nowhere else. (I'm projecting a ten foot wide image which may exaggerate the problem. I'll play it on my 50" plasma to see if it's still noticeable) I should emphasize that it only affects Dianne Foster and does not affect Audie Murphy who's also in the scene. In total I'm very pleased with this disc's presentation of the film. It's a massive upgrade from the original DVD.

 

[aHorseofCourse]

^ Yes, I went back and skipped through different scenes and didn't have any problem with sound synchronisation. And I didn't get any English subtitles for the first song either, although the main title is subtitled in English after selecting "sans" subtitles from the menu. And again the image quality was frequently stunning.
I've been digging around trying to find some info about Elephant's release of "Ulzana's Raid". This thread (all in French) suggests that it contains both the US (the "Aldrich cut") and European (the "Lancaster cut") versions of the film:

http://www.dvdclassik.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=22&t=37174

One poster says, "FUREUR APACHE chez Elephant est annoncé pour mars prochain. ca sera un combo, et il possèdera 2 montages, celui voulu par Lancaster et celui voulu par Aldrich", which, according to Google translate, is, "FUREUR APACHE at Elephant is announced for next March. It will be a combo, and it will have 2 assemblies, that wanted by Lancaster and that wanted by Aldrich."

A good discussion of the background and differences can be found here: http://www.avmaniacs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=15475&s=a37d9ab1b71e44e4a87534d8a83e91fc

 

[Alan Tully]

Yes, I'm looking forward to buying Ulzana's Raid, but I'll wait for the German release in May.

 

[Pictureman]

Just got this today and sadly can confirm the English track is out of sync, just enough to make it unwatchable for me. I've tried it on two players, a Sony and a Panasonic, with different sound systems. The Panny, which I use with a projector, wouldn't remove the subtitles from the songs or the main title either.

At least the included DVD is good quality with none of these issues.

 

[Robin9]

Just got this today and sadly can confirm the English track is out of sync, just enough to make it unwatchable for me. I've tried it on two players, a Sony and a Panasonic, with different sound systems. The Panny, which I use with a projector, wouldn't remove the subtitles from the songs or the main title either.

At least the included DVD is good quality with none of these issues.

I haven't tried the DVD yet! I hadn't thought of that.

Welcome to HTF, by the way.

 

[bigshot]

Elephant Films license from Universal. They do a good job of mastering as long as Universal gives them a good transfer to work with.

 

[John Hermes]

After taking a closer look/listen with four different players and three displays, here's what I see/hear. The sync on my gear seems fine until about the 19:00 mark. When Stewart goes into the railroad car to meet J.C. Flippen the sound gets ahead of the picture a bit. On my two LG players the sync is close enough for my satisfaction. On one of my Panasonic players there is slightly more disparity, and then even more on the final Panasonic and display. The funny thing I see are the gunshots seem in perfect sync but the dialogue is what is off. Anyway, it's good enough on my LG players and the picture quality is fantastic, especially for the rather low bitrate used.

 

[John Hermes]

Just got this today and sadly can confirm the English track is out of sync, just enough to make it unwatchable for me. I've tried it on two players, a Sony and a Panasonic, with different sound systems. The Panny, which I use with a projector, wouldn't remove the subtitles from the songs or the main title either.

At least the included DVD is good quality with none of these issues.

On my gear the sync issue is the same on the DVD, so it must be in the original master.

 

[Robin9]

Amazon Germany is now listing Night Passage and two other James Stewart Westerns, Bend Of The River and The Rare Breed.

Maureen O'Hara has been doing well on Blu-ray in the past twelve months or so!

 

[John Hermes]

Amazon Germany is now listing Night Passage and two other James Stewart Westerns, Bend Of The River and The Rare Breed.

Maureen O'Hara has been doing well on Blu-ray in the past twelve months or so!

I wonder how the sync issue with Night Passage will be on the German Blu-ray?