New Yamaha extremely harsh in 2CH--is it broken?

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by DerekF, Dec 15, 2001.

  1. DerekF

    DerekF Stunt Coordinator

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    I just got the RX-V2200, and for HT I have no issues, but for 2CH music, I'm having some problems....

    Specifically: any vocals that contain the letter "S" sound particularly raspy--I listen to all genres of music, but a good example is Garth Brook's Friends in Low Places, where the chorus sounds like this:

    "I've got friendsss in low placssessss where the whissskey drownssss and the beer chasssessss...."

    I've turned the treble right down, and tried procesor direct on/off, to no avail It sounds as though I have eleven tweeters and a sub!

    Note: This is the same speakers I demo'd a Technics, a Kenwood and a Denon on, and they were fine with them--especially good with the Denon.

    Any Ideas? This receiver was shipped to me and the box was beat up--could it be broken? Ideas?

    Derek
     
  2. Luis A

    Luis A Second Unit

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    Derek,
    Just about every Yamaha I've used, I've borrowed several from work, all have had this same issue. The DSP-A1 is the only exception, but everything from the RXV-3000, 800, 2095, 2092, and 596 have all had this.
    Speaker cable and speaker location also play a big part, and if your Yamaha sounds fine in 5.1, I doubt there is anything wrong with the unit.
    What speakers, and cable are you using? Also how are your MAIN speakers positioned in your room?
    L
     
  3. DwightK

    DwightK Second Unit

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    I just set up my new RX-V1200 last night/this morning and have not noticed any harshness in 2ch stereo. My mains are Phasse Technology speakers set about 20" from the wall. I love the new 6ch stereo as well.

    I have only one issue with the receiver and that is I cannot get the OSD to work. No real loss as everything can be done using the front panel. (would end up turning off OSD anyways and I'm very sure it is my fault).

    Have you switched between 2ch stereo and the Direct Mode? That bypasses all processing and would probably narrow down the issue.
     
  4. Scott Basham

    Scott Basham Stunt Coordinator

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    Derek,

    I've got the RX-V1000 and while it sounds clear, it's not harsh as you've described. I'm using Klipsch RF-3 IIs on it.

    DwightK,

    Double check where you are running your video from on the back of your receiver. There is a video out and below that, there is a monitor out. You want the later (mon. out)in order to use OSD. Also, it will not display through components, it has to be through the RCA-video cable. Hope this helps!
     
  5. ChrisAG

    ChrisAG Supporting Actor

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    Derek,

    I auditioned the 1000 along side the Onkyo 898 in the same room with the same speakers (Mordaunt-Short 906), and I found the Yamaha to be harsh for 2 channel stereo. That's why I'm not looking at Yamaha for my next receiver.
     
  6. Sean Conklin

    Sean Conklin Screenwriter

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    I just don't understand. Why do the "lower"($700 and less usually) end Yamaha's sound like this? You would think a great company like Yamaha would be able to take the edge off their brightness!

    I too was looking at Yamaha for my HT a couple years ago, and I couldn't look(or hear, whichever you prefer) past the somewhat harsh brightness, I still go and listen at B&M's and still find them tinny and bright, WHY?

    The older Yams were not like this, I used to love Yamaha, but now I haven't been able to find one in the budget range that isn't bright.

    Maybe, just maybe this brightness is preferable to some listeners and Yamaha makes them like this intentionally.

    This is one of the reasons I always recommend Kenwoods, Denon's, Onkyo's, H/K, these receivers are generally flat(read:good,minimal colorization), full sounding, and not harsh on the treble.

    Maybe it's just the characteristic Yamaha strives for, I don't know.
     
  7. Kevin C Brown

    Kevin C Brown Producer

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    Derek- Have you tried analog input vs digital?

    Are you sure you don't have the treble control on your speakers turned up (if they have them)? (Sometimes on the back or under grill in the front.)

    I had an RX-V793 a few years ago, and it definately didn't sound "bright" or "forward" to me. Quite neutral in fact.
     
  8. Thomas_A

    Thomas_A Second Unit

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    Heck...I'm running a yammie 795a with Polk speakers.... and they are supposidly both "bright" in nature....I dont find your issue....
     
  9. DonnyD

    DonnyD Screenwriter

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    Well, this sounds like another "bright" vrs "warm" thread to me. BUT... I will put in my 2cents worth....

    I have owned several Yamahas over the past ten years and set up several Yamahas for friends and have never ran into this issue of harshness. I have dealt with the older and newer Yams from the 2092, 2095, 1000, 905, 1105, and now my newest the RX-V1. The RX-V1 is definitely smoother than all the others. We have had all types and brands of speakers on these various systems also.

    I will say this though, when I take a client to an audio store to demo systems, usually we listen to Yamahas and -----... but have also listened to a few ----- and ------ of various price levels. The Yamahas have always sounded neutral/bright to me when a/b'ed with others, where as the others sounded somewhat "colored" or as some would say "warm". All my clients chose Yamahas for the clarity they seemed to have over the comp.

    I upgrade almost yearly and always look at other receivers but have yet to change brands. The only allegiance I have is to my ears......

    My main speakers have always been some old JBL L-100 which had the tweet upgraded to titaniums. Now if anything is gonna have a harsh tone to it, those tweets whould show it up but all we ever hear is a clear presentation of sound, regardless of mode.

    All that being said, I will not argue that some will hear "harshness" out of some receivers. I just cannot imagine what that is but no doubt it is there for some. All I can say, is buy what you like and if the Yams are harsh, then don't buy one but bashing them in general is kinda out of place, don't you think? I believe the ----- is colored and warm like a pillow is over the speakers but I'm not gonna bash them here where a lot of people like it that way. There are those of us here who happen to have and like the Yamaha sound. For me, it is what works....
     
  10. Eric Sevigny

    Eric Sevigny Stunt Coordinator

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    I have the RXV-800, and do find that some CDs have the same symptoms you describe. But on the other hand, many others sound just perfect (most "live" CDs and most of the Jazz CDs I recently bought, Diana Krall, Jane Monheit, are fine).

    So I chalked it up to difference in audio engineering. Mind you, only a few are actually really bad.
     
  11. Johnny Lerner

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    This seems to be the usual results with Japanese-designed audio products.

    Here's a case where John Wayne seems to shoot from all 5-6-7 channels - and the helicopter goes overhead nicely - that is, the surround 'gimmisk' stuff 'works' - but as for ACCURACY or FIDELITY of audio - it is an entirely different story!

    That's why one can very seldom hear music OR a sound track as it was MEANT to be heard, using Tokyo-designed stuff. But you get 1,873 channels - enough lights to scare Las Vegas - and you have a chance to press so many buttons you don't get a chance to actually listen to something.
     
  12. DougO

    DougO Stunt Coordinator

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    ...and we should all be lining up to buy what?
     
  13. DwightK

    DwightK Second Unit

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    Scott, thanks for the suggestion. I just knew the OSD problem was my fault:b
    I'm surprised that the thing even worked with my s-video and rca outs going through the VCR2 outs.
    Interesting the anti-japanese retoric. Oh well.
    If you really don't like audio processing modes than you can always press the Direct button on the front of the receiver. That bypasses all the DSP circuitry. Sounds great for CD's and happens to be what I use (when not using the fancyschmansy stuff that is).
     
  14. Charles J P

    Charles J P Cinematographer

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    I have to chime in here too. I have had an RX-V1200 for a few months now with Paradigm speakers :gasp: isnt that supposed to be an ear bleeding combination? It sounds fine to me. My brother is getting a lower end yammie for x-mas with some Home Theater Direct level twos. I will see what the verdict is on the lower end if I have a chance to listen critically.
     
  15. Johnny Lerner

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    If you have any doubts about the Japanese having no interest in sound, please give me a list of known 'quality' Japanese speaker companies.

    If this realization doesn't open your ears - what will?

    Unfortunately most people have been sucked into the light, button and format show -- and the hell with the actual sound!
     
  16. Eric Sevigny

    Eric Sevigny Stunt Coordinator

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    -DwightK
    I am using the DSP mode where the display lights up with "EFFECT OFF" for 2ch. Do you know if there is any difference between this mode and pressing the DSP bypass button on the receiver ?
    I had the impression they were similar, but if it changes something I'll press the bypass for my 2ch music listening [​IMG]
    -Johnny Lerner
    I am not sure what you are getting at... Yamaha makes speakers too, along with a wide range of quality music accessories. I didn't buy my unit for the "glitter", but for the sound.
     
  17. Eric Sevigny

    Eric Sevigny Stunt Coordinator

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    Thanks Matthew D, I probably should have read a little more carefully the manual, I found it stated it pretty clearly :b
     
  18. Marty M

    Marty M Cinematographer

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    I, too have the dreaded Yamaha/Paradigm combination and really like the sound. I have a Yamaha 795, that might beconsidered a lower end model. A friend was listening to a CD and remarked on how it was a clean sound. I have never consider the Yamaha sounding harsh. It all boils down to personal preferences.
     
  19. Johnny Lerner

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    Where I'm going?

    Yes - Yamaha MAKES speakers - so does SONY, etc.

    Ever LISTEN to them?
     
  20. Eric Sevigny

    Eric Sevigny Stunt Coordinator

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    -Johnny Lerner

    And what does it have to do with the quality of Yamaha, or Sony receivers for that matter ?

    You are infering quality of one product using something completely different. I wont dispute your opinion that Sony or Yamaha speakers aren't good, but in what way does that imply that automatically, Sony or Yamaha receivers are poor for music ?

    Are you in on something we should know? Do you somehow know that the same sound engineers are working on both products? That they are equally incompetent at both? That by some sort of bizarre stroke of luck japanese-made speakers are converted to receivers with equaly bad sound caracteristics?

    Inquiring mind wants to know.
     

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