New Blue Tube for my RPTV

Discussion in 'Displays' started by kumar, Sep 28, 2005.

  1. kumar

    kumar Stunt Coordinator

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    I own a sony 57WS510 ( about 20 months old now).

    History:
    I have been having a blue screen problem, wherein when I cold start the TV I get a blue screen embossed on the picture for about 2 - 15 mins and then goes away. the picture is normal after that.The blue screen is more visible when I switch to a video input that is not connected to any source.

    Called the BB service center and then they sent a guy about 3 weeks back. The guy came looked at the problem (without even opening the backside of the TV) and said the blue tube is gone bad and needs a replacement. Good I bought the extended warranty from BB this was covered. If the blue tube is bad, will it still show me rich blue color when I watch my programs (cable/DVD)?

    Now:
    Yesterday they came to replace the Blue tube part. The guy also did the convergance settings. Since it was the daytime and my room has lot of ambient light I could not notice this much. I thought when it gets darker I will calibrate the TV using my AVIA disk. I switch the TV on around 8:30 last night and I notice the blue color more. The focus isnt sharp enough. When there is a white color or white letters(like on a closed caption) there is blue border around the white.
    I tried using AVIA to calibrate still I could not get it back to the original shape.
    Blue is not visible when I switch to video output which is not connected to any source.
    First I thought it could be because my component cable is not connected properly. But this happens even when I use S-Video Cable. I ran the TV for close to over 2 hours thinking it will warm up (I am sure 2 hours more than enough for the tubes to warm up) still the blue haze. This is different from the problem I had earlier.

    I will be calling the BB guys again soon.

    Meanwhile, any ideas why this is happening.

    I hope I explained it correct and not confuse anyone.

    Kumar.
     
  2. kumar

    kumar Stunt Coordinator

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    I tried to get into the TV Menu's Convergence and I could see blue bleeding/overlapping white crosses.
    If I start adjusting it do I have to do it for all the input source I will be using and in all the four wide angle modes for all the pic mode? that is close to 32 times doing it?

    Is there a copy and paste for convergence settings?

    Kumar.
     
  3. ChrisWiggles

    ChrisWiggles Producer

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    Is the blue border all the way around? This indeed does indicate that blue focus is quite poor, either optically or electronically. If it's not all the way around it might be a convergence problem, but it does sound like you are correct if the blue is "larger" so to speak compared to the other colors. you can see this very precisely if you throw up a dots pattern from Avia, or internally. you can see exactly the dot size and shape of the display system.

    Just remember that it may just be an optical focus problem, or a beam setup problem. Full CRT replacement and setup takes quite a while to do properly, and I don't know that BB has people that really know what they are doing. It is quite possible he didn't do a very good job on the beam setup/electronic focus system, and/or the optical focusing on the replaced blue. Also make sure to check the color temperature, because if the set is older and the G and R tubes have diminished light output your greyscale may be biased towards the brighter new B tube, so check to see what your color temperature is like carefully by eye if not with colorimetry equipment.
     
  4. Steve Berger

    Steve Berger Supporting Actor

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    Two points:
    1: The blue beam is intentionally slightly larger than the other two colors and the blue spot is defocused as a slight oval. (this is very, very subtle, however) This is to blend the scan lines so as to avoid gaps between scan lines.

    2: Full alignment after CRT replacement can take 3-6 hours or more unless you're really lucky (and/or ignore the various scan modes).
    A: For which no warranty coverage will ever pay the servicer sufficiently.
    B: And is almost impossible to do in the livingroom with someone looking over your shoulder.

    There's a reason those ISF technicians charge what they must.

    You might want to check if there is a "Sony Authorized Servicer" locally. Your extended warranty is an insurance coverage and many servicers other than the dealer honor them, no matter what the dealer tells you. The dealer is a "self servicing dealer" not an "authorized servicer" and is not required to have any training or equipment as an "authorized servicer" is required to. They may have it but are not scrutinized the same way an independent servicer is. It may be too late to do anything except insist on a better job (be sure to check the results in each scan and zoom mode) but you might be able to get them to hand off to an authorized servicer.
     
  5. ChrisWiggles

    ChrisWiggles Producer

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    It's actually done to increase light output on the blue tube which usually saturates first. This defocus is *very* slight and it not really observable with the naked eye. The method for focusing, and then slightly defocusing blue relies on the brightness drop that occurs with a really tightly focused blue beam because your eyes can't physically focus on blue as well as R or G. In any case, blue defocus should not be visible at all except in its affect on the grayscale tracking through to the brightest ranges of whites.

    Anyway, I really doubt a BB tech guy would know anything about defocusing blue, it's probably just a sloppy install job, I would try to find a TV repair place or a sony repair place to help out, you never really know who BB has back there trying to fix things.
     
  6. kumar

    kumar Stunt Coordinator

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    Thanks guys for your response.

    Btw, it was not the BB guy who came to replace. They have a TV Tech Service (apparantly a Sony Auth Serv) who came to work on it. But I am disappointed.

    I have called them again.

    I went to the Manual Convergance last night and tried fixing it but does not seem to have fixed it completely. I do see some improvment but not whole lot.

    Meanwhile, the question is, will I harm the TV watching it though till it is fixed.

    Kumar.
     
  7. ChrisWiggles

    ChrisWiggles Producer

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    No.
     
  8. kumar

    kumar Stunt Coordinator

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    I have called the service guy again. He should be here on Tuesday. Meanwhile I tried going through the Sony TVs manual convergence settings. I tried to bring them as close to white cross as possible. Things I noticed, it is tough to keep the white around the 4 borders.
    After I spent about an hour to do this. I popped up the AVIA disk and tried to set the White, Black level, Hue, Saturation, Sharpness, and color settings.

    My settings are Sharpness about 50%, Black about 45%, white about 40%, Color about 60%, Hue about 49%. and the color temparature is warm.

    I do some improvment. But I still feel sometimes the picture is not focused pretty well and has a slight fog. Or I am not sure if it is just me starring at the TV all this time.

    When I get into Advanced Video Calibration menu in AVIA, how do I work with the circles, cross patterns that it throws. Do I have to get into Sony's Service menu for that?
    What is the code to get into their SERvice Menu?
    hmm... another long mail [​IMG]


    Kumar.
     
  9. kumar

    kumar Stunt Coordinator

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    The service guy is coming in today. Hope he fixes the issue.

    I will update you guys accordingly.

    Meanwhile could someone answer my Avia questions from the previous posting in this thread?

    Thanks
    Kumar.
     
  10. kumar

    kumar Stunt Coordinator

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    AAAARRGGGGHHH!!!!

    This is how I feel now.... Guy came fixed it by refocusing the red tube. Things were fine until I switched it on back that night to see the screen now with original problem except instead of blue screen now it is red screen. The Red arcs stays on the screen with every program and it is highly visible with dark backgrounds. Atleast the blue went away after a while. This red is staying.

    I called the guys again (this time I told the BB rep that I DONT WANT THE SAME @#$$ING GUY COME IN). They are sending another person by this friday (14th Oct).

    If its any indication of the same problem like the blue one I had earlier, I am going to ask these guys to change the Red and the Green tube.

    can the red arcs cause permanent damage??

    If not change the TV to a better model since I am covered with the Extended Warranty. Anyone tried this before?Meanwhile my question is, can the red arcs make permanent damage
     
  11. ChrisWiggles

    ChrisWiggles Producer

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    Where did arcs come from, arcs can definitely cause damage, but arcing is a loud pop sound, not a coloration in the black, which can be due to wrong G2 settings.
     
  12. kumar

    kumar Stunt Coordinator

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    The arcs(curves) are on the tv when I switch on. There were no pop sound. The tv has a light red instead of total black when the TV is on but inputs are off. On the the red screen I get Red curves (about 10 of them) running from left to right. Like one of the convergance curves. I will make sure I take a picture this evening in my digital camera and put it here. My black level and white levels are kind of in 40% I hope it does not burn in.
     
  13. ChrisWiggles

    ChrisWiggles Producer

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    ding! Light expoded in my head! [​IMG] :b You meant "arc" as in a curve, not arc in the electrical sense. My mistake. If your set is arcing in the electrical sense, that would be a loud popping noise that could definitely nuke circuit boards inside with HV etc. Anyway, the curved lines you are seeing do sound like a problem, have service out again to fix it, see what they say.
     
  14. kumar

    kumar Stunt Coordinator

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    ha! I should have found the word curve earlier.. but only when I was typing in this note.. one of the pop windows came with J.Loz photo on it. no I am serious, only then I caught the word Curve.

    Will keep you updated, Chris.
    Now more for me to read about the electrical "arc".. let me go in search of those articles.
     
  15. kumar

    kumar Stunt Coordinator

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    Long time no update!

    Ok this is what happend.

    The BB guy came two fridays ago. He opened the panels and start meddling with the controls for the three guns for few minutes and boom the red curves are gone. Then he made some more adjustments and the picutre looked even better.

    Then he took out a BK Electronics Pattern Generator Box and connected to the back of my TV and started generating patterns and adjusted.

    Now, after two weeks, my picture looks even better than the before.
    I was pretty surprised for a BB tech guy to fix this problem whereas a certified Sony tech guy screwed up.
    I really thanked this guy for his wonderful work.

    There is a time/sleeper light that keeps flashing five times every now and then. I asked this guy whats the deal about. He went through the service manual and said that something could be going wrong and this could be like a warning sign on the problem that may come on the TV. But it is tough to analyze what it is when everything looks ok. He said since you are anyway covered by the warranty for another two years lets wait and see.

    Except the tiny light flashing being annoying rest of the stuff looks awesome. I even feel the SD looks little more crisper now.

    I will have to run my AVIA during these days to setup the usual brightness, contrast sharpness and color etc.

    Thats the story!!!
     

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