My results on the Panasonic RP56 vrs. the Sony NS700p (1 Viewer)

[Ron-P]

Thanks Guys

Quote:

Joe...Joe...Joe,
You love it now? Just wait until you get into tweaking it and are able to use component outs. Then she will really shine. The red-push attenuator is a must. You can get all the parts at Radio Shack for about $15. Once you get a component connectiong going, get the attenuator.
As for your last question, I want some more power. Going to start saving for some amps.
Peace Out~ Link Removed
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http://home.earthlink.net/~peregrinefalcon

 

[John B. Holbrook]

Ron,
As a 4 month long owner of the 700P, I really appreciated seeing your review! Did you happen to check out any of my comments on the unit when considering the purchase?
I took a lot of criticism from the RP91 fans around here for my choice. I found a lot of their criticism died down after the Shootout II article came out which have extremely favorable comments to make about the 700P. Like you, I've never seen any instances of the elusive chroma bug on my unit.
Congrats and enjoy!
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John Holbrook
MY DVD Collection

 

[Andrew P]

John:
Ill chime in with an RP-91 opinion against the Sony. In one sentence, the RP-91 provides a sharper more detailed image without the chroma bug (which is a major problem).
Im glad you like your purchase though. Thats the only thing that matters.
Andy

 

[Ron-P]

quote: In one sentence, the RP-91 provides a sharper more detailed image without the chroma bug (which is a major problem).[/quote]
I did not test the RP-91 as it was out of my price range and had features I did not want to pay for. But, according to HThifi's review:
quote: Sony was using a chip of their own. It's not quite up to the level of the Silicon Image or Sage chips, but it's several notches better than the Genesis.[/quote]
The RP91 uses the Genesis chip. It would be hard to believe that the RP91 provides a sharper more detailed image. Unless they have some other type of image enhanceing software that I am not aware of. Now, a lot of this may be due to what TV you have and how well you have tweaked it, I do not know.
Also, this Chroma Bug issue is not near as big a deal as people make it up to be. It is no where near a major problem. I tried to find it on the NS700p and could not. If you have findings that show otherwise, please let me know. Believe me, the Flicker Bug on the RP56 is much more of an eye-catcher than the Chroma Bug.
Andrew, I'm am not doubting your opinion, just like to know if you did a head-to-head with the 700p and the RP91? I'd be very interested in your findings.
Peace Out~ Link Removed
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[Edited last by Ron-P on October 19, 2001 at 12:56 PM]

 

[StaceyS]

quote: The RP91 uses the Genesis chip. It would be hard to believe that the RP91 provides a sharper more detailed image. [/quote]
The RP91 has a better analog video section. (post deinterlace) This provides the sharper, more detailed, picture he was talking about.
[Edited last by StaceyS on October 19, 2001 at 01:09 PM]

 

[Andrew P]

Ron:
The Genesis chipset is not the greatest, but this is only for de-interlacing. The Panasonic RP-91 uses the best incarnation of this chipset that I have ever seen. I am susceptible to combing, but I have rarely noticed this on feature films. It is most noticeable on extra type materials.
The chroma bug is a major problem. It is very noticeable and a major distraction for me personally. Once you realize what it is you cannot unnotice it.
I have tested over 8 dvd players now. I just did the Kenwood DV-5700, Philips Q50, Panasonic DVD-RP91, Sony 700P, and the Denon DVD2800. The Philips Q50 produces the best picture I have ever seen followed by the Panasonic DVD-RP91, then the Kenwood DV-5700. The next tier is the Sony 700P and the Denon 2800.
After all these months it still boggles my mind how people can spend upwards of $2,000 on a progressive scan display, but skimp on a progressive scan dvd player. They go hand in hand to me. I dont think $500-$700 is too much to ask for when coupled with such an expensive tv.
My display devices are the Mitusbishi 73907 and the Cinema 13HD. I consider myself a pure videophile so that may explain the differences that we are seeing in the picture.
I think it is a disservice to the readers though to state that the 700P is in the same league as the RP-91. The Secrets shootout just took into account de-interlacing performance. You have to remember that. The Denon 2800 performed great in those tests, but im confident when the overall picture quality results come out that this player will be taken down one or two notches.
Andy

 

[Ron-P]

That would explain it, thanks Stacey.
And thanks Andy. It really depends on how much $$$ you have to spend. The more you spend, the better the picture quality you get (in most cases). I, unfortunatly do not have $5-700 to spend on a DVD player. So I was looking for the best in the $300.00 range. I had no idea you tested so many players, thats great. Personally, I would not want to do it again. Just doing the two I did was enough for me. But then again, I am not a vidophile and like you said that is where the difference most likely is.
Peace Out~ Link Removed
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[Edited last by Ron-P on October 19, 2001 at 01:21 PM]

 

[Kieran Coghlan]

quote: The RP91 uses the Genesis chip. It would be hard to believe that the RP91 provides a sharper more detailed image.[/quote] Ron, first of all great review. However, keep in mind that the de-interlacing chip has little to do with the claim that one player has a "sharper more detailed image". That has more to do with the MPEG decoder, and the video DACs in the player. The de-interlacing chip has more to do with how well the player creates a nice 480p conversion, when fed things like bad flags, or video instead of film source, etc.
(edit)
Well, I see that I was a little late to the game on that one! Well covered by Stacey and Andy.
(/edit)
Also, did you try to look for the Chroma error on the 700p in 480i mode? I can't remember from the Secret's site if the 700p was one of them, but many players that suffer from the Chroma bug have de-interlacing chipsets that greatly help to mask the chroma-errors. This would make it much more diffucult to see the problems in progressive mode.
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-Kieran
My HT Page
[Edited last by Kieran Coghlan on October 19, 2001 at 02:27 PM]

 

[Andrew P]

Testing players is difficult, but rewarding. I think if the 700p fits your budget then it is great for you. It is a good player, but I wanted to point out other options. I didnt want to come down on the 700p. I think Ron did a great job of reviewing the players as well.
As long as good quality information gets out then I am happy! Just look at how far dvd quality has come in 4 years. I remember the days when only the major cities carried dvd's and you couldnt even mail order them from certain internet sites. The times have surely changed!
Andy

 

[Ron-P]

Thanks for the comments guys. I had no idea how much was involved in these players. There is a lot of info to learn and thanks for taking the time to post and enlighten me.
I did enjoy testing the two players, but my HT set-up is not quite the easiest place to do so as everything is quite cramped in there.
BUT, with all this talk and learning about the other players, I am thinking, maybe, I should return the Sony and wait until after the 1st of the year and save enough to test a few of the higher end models, like the RP91 and others that Andy mentioned.
It is a difficult call. I like the Sony, but part of me wants to wait and try others.
What to do? Maybe I should enter an insane-asylum. This is one learning roller-coaster. I'll be back, need some Advil

Thanks again guys

Peace Out~ Link Removed
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[John B. Holbrook]

Ron,
I'm holding out for an error free mega changer progressive DVD/SACD/DVD-A player that's under $1000.00. I figure that may be upwards of 2 years away, maybe less. Until that time, my Sony 700P will hold me just fine. I'd maybe look at your upgrade path as to whether or not you want to hold on to your 700p.
Andrew - The chroma problem is a major problem to you (and virtually no other person with whom I've seen or heard to the degree you claim). I think the disservice to the readers is to make as much to do about the chroma bug as you do. The 700p is a great player, as is the RP91. The chroma problem is present in the 700p, but at such a diminished degree (as compared to other players) that it IS NOT noticable to the VAST MAJORITY of DVD viewing public. Another thing: If you had purchased, say, a Camelot DVD player, you would have a legitimate claim as to purchasing a DVD player in line with your display. Your purchase of the RP91 does not fall into this category.
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John Holbrook
MY DVD Collection
[Edited last by John B. Holbrook on October 19, 2001 at 04:01 PM]

 

[Mark Zimmer]

Ron, while you've still got the RP56, can you tell me whether it has 1) layer indicator displays and 2) audio and video bit level displays?
Thanks
Mark
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"This movie has warped my fragile little mind."

 

[Ron-P]

I was a little surprised by Andy's comments on the Chroma Bug, it was the first I had heard about it being so bad, but I know were he is coming from, once you see an artifact, it is there for good and you will always pick up on it and look for it no matter what you watch.
Same went for me with the Flicker Bug on the RP56. After I saw it on the TS:2 intro it was down hill from there. Every time there after I put a disk in that player I caught myself looking for the bug.
Personally, I like the Sony 700p. IMO, it is a good player, with good features, good quality and a good progressive/interlace picture for the price of $300. I am going to give her a good week like I did with the RP56. But, I can see this one being a keeper and moving on, out of the progressive player issue.
Mark, I am sorry to say that she went back at lunch today. Just post a new thread and someone will answer that for you.
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[Andrew P]

The chroma bug to is a terrible problem, but I am very picky. Sometimes I cant even enjoy the movie I am watching because of these picture defects. It might not be bothersome to some people, but my issue is with Sony or any other manufacturer who does not use a chroma bug free mpeg decoder.
I expect more after 4+ years of dvd players especially since the Sony 7000 (Sony's first dvd player for those who are new to the game) did not exhibit this problem. There is no excuse to produce a player in 2001 that exhibits this problem no matter how slight it may be.
I also expect people who buy the player to defend their pourchase vigourosly. I have purchased 8 players in the last 2 months alone (6 of them returned) so I consider myself pretty unbiased. I just want the perfect player and right now the Panasonic RP-91 is as close as it gets without spending upwards of $2,000. Trust me I want a new player soon. I like to upgrade my dvd player every 6 months if it warrants it. If Philips can work out all the glitches with the Q50 then that is definitely my player. Im also willing to give the Sony 900 a look if Sony changed mpeg decoders.
Andy

 

[George Fogel]

Andrew,
How did you get a Philips Q50 to test???
I've been eagerly waiting for this model to hit the stores (cyber or bm) and, to the best of my knowledge, they are not yet on the market in the US. I've contacted Philips, and all that they could say was that it should be released sometime this fall.
George
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[Andrew P]

I purchased the Philips from Onecall for $449, but it had too many issues although I loved the picture.
The image is shifted upwards. This really hurts any movie filmed in the 1.85:1 aspect ratio. There were also sudden random freezes and sometimes the player did not recognize discs.
Andy

 

[George Fogel]

Andrew,
Thanks for your quick response. I'm a bit surprised about your comments concerning this player, since all the reviews I've read have been extremely positive (and none have mentioned anything about the image shifting.)
Now my simple selection has become more complicated.
Can you (or anyone else here) tell me which progressive scan players do the following:
1. Pass through both DD and DTS signals (the Sony 700P does NOT pass DTS)
2. Allow for image modification in the case of non-anamorphically enhanced DVD's to get around the full screen lock (I have a Pioneer SD-532-HD set which, I understand will lock into Full mode when it detects a progressive scan signal).
HELP!!!
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[Kwang Suh]

2. Allow for image modification in the case of non-anamorphically enhanced DVD's to get around the full screen lock (I have a Pioneer SD-532-HD set which, I understand will lock into Full mode when it detects a progressive scan signal).

Panny RP91, Toshiba SD3750... I'm sure there's a few more.

 

[George Fogel]

I was definitely misinformed about the DTS passthrough for the Sony NS700p -- my source was the Crutchfield web site which has heretofore generally been very reliable. I just returned from Best Buy and happened to notice a stack of NS700p's on sale ($283, btw); the DTS logo was very prominently displayed on both the in-store display card and the boxes themselves.
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[Ron-P]

Well, I just picked up the JVC S60 Progressive Player (see my other thread). I plan on putting it up against the 700p tonight. HThifi gives it a top-notch comment for progressive picture although not so good for video. We shall see.
Peace Out~

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http://home.earthlink.net/~peregrinefalcon