Music Fidelity A3 24 Question (1 Viewer)

[Lin Park]

Should have the demo DAC unit in my setup tonight and will post my thoughts later this week. Not to mention, I'm finally getting to have my Vandersteen Model Fives tuned for the room. Should improve the Bass response quite a bit - not that it's bad now but I'm anxious to see what improvements are made.

Anyone here have the A3 24 that wants to comment?

Lin

 

[KeithH]

Lin, I don't have the A324, but I would be curious to hear your thoughts on its performance.

 

[Rob Rodier]

Secondly, Upscale Audio is supposed to be offering an upsampling upgrade for the Ah! in the near future that interests me. An op-amp upgrade is already available, which I would like to try.

The upsample is already available for $299.

-rob

 

[KeithH]

Rob, Upscale Audio's web site still says that the upsampling board will be available in late August. They are still taking pre-orders.

 

[AndyHangartner]

Keith

You are correct, the upsampler is not yet available. I spoke with Kevin (at Upscale)on Monday. Ask about the MF and he advised to wait for the upsampler coming for the AH!. He stated that the MF was nice but a little dark, and he had just heard the AH unit stating it was killer.

andy

 

[Lin Park]

Here's my initial thoughts on the Music Fidelity A324 DAC and please keep in mind that I am not a professional writer for Stereophile nor do I play one on TV. Also, keep in mind that this is the first external DAC that I have ever heard.
In each instance, the following equipment stayed the same:
Vandersteen Model Five speakers
QuickSilver V4 Monoblock tube amps with KT-88's
Denon AVR-2700 used as preamp (gotta upgrade this someday)
I started by using my Denon DCM-370 as the transport and connecting it to the DAC with a coaxial interconnect with the analog outputs of the DAC feeding into the CD inputs of the preamp. I also fed the analog outputs of the CD player into the VCR-1 inputs of the preamp for on the fly comparisons. My intial listening tests had to be done at very low volumes so that I wouldn't wake up my 16 month old son. I thought I heard differences but would have been hard pressed to pass a blind test.
Early today, I was able to listen at more respectable levels to confirm my beliefs - the DAC does make a difference. The only way I can describe it is that it's as if a thin film is being removed from the music so that I can get closer to it (sort of like that stuff that comes on new electronics that you peel off). Each entity in the music is clearer, sharper, and easier to single out. Soundstaging improves and some sounds even eminate from what appears to be a more natural position. Details in vocals are just superb and I can hear things that I know I haven't heard before. Depending on the source, I can also say that some of these approach the quality of several of my better DVD-A titles.
My next test will involve using the Panasonic RP-91 as the transport and I may start trying to play with 96kHz upsampling rather than the 192kHz which was used in all of the tests so far.
I'm sure there are going to be those who chime in and disregard all of this as just my desire to hear a difference but I really think you should sample this unit for yourself before passing that kind of judgement. I'm not saying that this is the greatest thing since sliced bread but I am saying that I think it enriches the musical experience enough to warrant a purchase. Also, if you're in the area of Maplewood, NJ and would like to check this thing out, drop me an e-mail and maybe we can setup some time to do some listening together - heck, we could also have a few drinks and then things would really start to sound good.
Cheers,
Lin

 

[KeithH]

Lin,

I am not about to disregard your opinion as being construed out of a desire to hear a difference. You are comparing a $250 CD changer to a $1200 upsampling DAC that has garnered high praise in Stereophile. The A324 should beat the '370 via the analog outputs handily. I have the '370, and while it is good for the price, there is plenty of room for improvement. Frankly, I'm sure many people out there have their A324 paired with a better player than the '370 and are observing improvements. The A324 should do wonders for the '370. Even though the '370 probably isn't a wunderkind as a transport, it isn't a wunderkind via the analog outputs either. The A324 should be a marked improvement over what you are used to hearing from the '370.

Andy,

Thanks for the info. I have the Ah! Njoe Tjoeb 4000 and had pre-ordered the upsampling board about six weeks ago or so. However, I cancelled the order when I started hearing good things about the A324. There is obviously a big price jump between the upsampling board and A324, but I considered making the jump to the latter. In addition, I decided to wait for some reviews of the upsampling board, as I am a bit skeptical about how good it will be. Perhaps I will re-order the upsampling board at some point. I will be looking for reviews in about a month or so over on Audio Asylum.

 

[Doug_B]

Keith,

I have the Ah! Njoe Tjoeb 4000 and had pre-ordered the upsampling board about six weeks ago or so. However, I cancelled the order when I started hearing good things about the A324.

You were supposed to be my guinea pig on this one :frowning: . Remember, you're supposed to be saving your money for your wedding, not spending more than $1K on an external DAC. I guess I'll have to rely on the inmates of the Asylum, too
Doug

 

[KeithH]

Doug, the impending wedding also played a part in my decision to cancel the order for the upsampling board. In the end, $300 would not be an issue, but I am trying to be more responsible these days. It might seem irresponsible for me to spend $1200 on the A324, but if the A324 were "all that", it might be a smarter purchase than the upsampling board for the Ah!. I'd spend quite a bit more money on the A324, but I would potentially have a better device and get more use out of it. I could pair it with my better players (i.e., 'C555ES and '777ES). In any event, I am buying neither for now.

 

[Rob Rodier]

Thanks for the info Lim, that is why I love reading these boards.

As for the Ah! I was reading the August Stereophile that has an ad that claims it as "new". Kind of deceptive, but still right around the corner.

Sorry about that

-rob

 

[KeithH]

No problem, Rob. Hopefully we will see some reviews on Audio Asylum soon. I know some people who frequent the Digital Drive board there have pre-ordered the upsampling board. That is, unless they all cancelled their orders like I did.

 

[Jeremy Hegna]

Andrew....where are you????

Those measurements on jitter are great! I would love to know where he got them, anybody?

Is jitter measurable for cheap?

It seems that in the past couple of years jitter has been acknoledged as digital distortion, and those gear measurements show it...the 9000ES being higher than the 900V. That's very interesting.

It would be good to find out how some of the DVD players are measuring these days...post 2000/01 production dates.

The MF DAC is very intriguing, I read the article in April and have been curious ever since.

If one was to use this DAC on a DVD player, would everything work correctly on DD and DTS playback?

Jeremy

 

[KeithH]

Jeremy asked:

If one was to use this DAC on a DVD player, would everything work correctly on DD and DTS playback?

I'm not sure I follow your question. You could not route your DVD player through the A324 for playback of Dolby Digital and DTS movie soundtracks. The A324 is a stereo DAC. Thus, it has no ability to decode Dolby Digital or DTS and has no 5.1-channel outputs for connection to a pre/pro or receiver. Also, it has no digital pass-through to bypass processing when you want to use the DVD player for movies (i.e., no digital in/digital out). If you were to use your DVD player with the A324 for music, you would have to run a second digital cable from the DVD player to your pre/pro or receiver for movies (unless, of course, your player has Dolby Digital and DTS decoders, in which case you could use the 5.1-channel outputs).

 

[AndyHangartner]

Keith

I'll have that upsampler as soon as it hits the streets and I will post my findings after a week or so. I figure at $299 hard to go wrong. Besides I have confidence in Kevin at Upscale. His integrity is what builds his business. He could have easily have said buy the MF and I would be way ahead, but that was not the case. Remember he has heard both units. Besides which I think if you got (anyone) got the upsampler and didn't like it, he'd be more than reasonable about trading it back for the MF.

andy

 

[KeithH]

Andy, thanks for the information. I look forward to your review. You are right about Kevin Deal at Upscale Audio. He is excellent to do business with. I'm sure if you were unhappy with the upsampling board, he would take it back for a refund or would credit the $299 to the price of the A324.

One thing that does bother me about the upsampling board is that it upsamples to 24/192 by default. There is no way around it. With the A324 and other upsampling DACs, you can turn off the upsampling feature. Upsampling has garnered a lot of criticism in the audio press and on Audio Asylum, and I'm not sure I want to be "stuck" with it in the Ah!. Of course, the upsampling board utilizes a different DAC than what in the stock Ah!, and the new DAC in combination with upsampling could make for a much better player. We shall see.

 

[Jeremy Hegna]

Thanks Keith.

I don't believe that will work for me, unless I was to use the Toslink for DD and DTS. My machine does not have 6 channel output, just analog two channel, coax, and tos.

Jeremy

 

[KeithH]

Jeremy, yes, you would have to use both digital outputs from your DVD player to route it to both your pre/pro or receiver and the A324. What are you using as a DVD player?

 

[Jeremy Hegna]

I'm using the Denon 2800MK 2. They replaced my original 2800 because of audio dropout issues. I love the new machine, but since finding out they've fixed the chroma issue in the 38/9000, I'm considering selling it on ebay and going for the 9000.

My 5800 goes in for the upgrade this week, so the Denon Link would be fun to experiment with....just not sure if it is worth the extra grand or two. Especially if I could improve the performance of my 2800 for CD with the MF DAC. The new DAC and the purchase of a 3800 would be less than that of a 9000....decisions, decision.

Hence, I'm curious what the jitter numbers are for the 2800MKII as a transport deck. Are you aware of jitter measuring devices, perhaps available at repair shops or B&M stores?

Jeremy

 

[Jeremy Hegna]

Doesn't it also mention (article on the MF DAC) that there is jitter correction going on in there too?

I thought I read that somewhere...maybe at audioasylum. If that's the case, I wonder how well it does correct jitter.

Jeremy

 

[Lin Park]

Hope it's not illegal to post this but here is a quote from Sam Tellig's article in Stereophile:

"Antony, in his exuberance, suggests that any old CD player with a digital output will suffice as a transport. After all, as part of the upsampling process, the A324 reclocks the incoming digital datastream, suppressing jitter."

Lin