More Disney OAR/MAR nonsense (1 Viewer)

[SteveK]

I have thanked them, but I'll admit it was belatedly. I thanked them and congratulated them for their previous outstanding releases and then asked them to not resort to issuing fullframe only releases in the future. I probably should have thanked them a long time ago, but at least I've done so now. Better late than never. I also sent them a possible script they could use in which Mickey Mouse, Donald Duck, Goofy are watching a DVD on Donald's brand new DVD player and complaining about widescreen until Ludwig Von Drake educates them about widescreen. I'm sure the Disney geniuses could devise a better script than I did, but I didn't think it was too bad overall.

I fail to understand how releasing a movie ONLY in fullframe could be more profitable than releasing it in OAR and P&S. I understand more people seem to want fullframe than OAR, but if you turn your back on even a small percentage of the market you're losing sales. Surely the small incremental cost to include both versions would be more than made up for by pleasing everybody and angering nobody. Even if widescreen only accounts for 10% of a given title's sales, that is still a lot of sales that might not otherwise have been made. I just can't see how lost sales can be profitable.

Steve K.

 

[Michael St. Clair]

I thought I was thanking them by buying DVDs by the truckload.

 

[Tony_Faville]

I thought I was thanking them by buying DVDs by the truckload.

I agree, that should have been enough. But apparently, the squeaky wheel get's the grease in this case. Sure, we may have been buying the OAR releases but the J6P's that were calling and complaining about "those darn black bars" garnered more of the studios attention.

It all makes me wonder if the studios have actually looked at the sales statistics.

I know I have looked at the stats in a laymans manner.....look at the displays on release day when there is a fullscreen and a widescreen release of the same title....sure seems like alot of Fullscreens left in the display while the widescreens are leaving the store.

Something just isn't right.

 

[Jeff Swindoll]

Not according to Walt Disney. He started his "business" to bring magic to children and adults everywhere. That was his goal. Making money was something that served to accomplish this goal, not sacrifice it.

Remember it was Walt that scrapped the original squid in 20,000 Leagues under the Sea ,at great expense, because it didnt look good enough to him. Unfortunately, we have suits these days that release half baked tripe (instead of fully cooked tripe ) into the theaters to try and reap a little $$ before the reviews get out. I sure miss Walt :frowning:

 

[Oscar]

Well why dont studios and retailers educate the audiences about the benefits of widescreen?
I told to a guy who was buying the P&S version of Jurassic Park 3.
That he shouldnt buy that one, and he answered me cussing words.
I showed him a comparsion on paper i have between widescreen and full screen, and he looked for the WS version.
But it wasnt there, so he said to me "Im going to buy it in F.Y.E.".
I have an idea and proposal, next time you go to a place were they sell DVDs educate the guys there about widescreen.
Bring in printings of any widescreen vs. full screen they have done in any website.
I can assure guys, this can work.
Lets cross our fingers.

 

[Mark Hanson]

The truth is we won the first battle with the studios. We are down, but not out in the second battle, first because we did not know it was gong to happen until we got the release notices.

The main point has been that P&S sells more, but there is another thing that is not counted. None sales, I know on Princess Diaries which my family wanted it took me 7 stores that did not stock it and finally an internet order to get the WS version. I did nothing them like we all did. If we continue that way there will be little to find in WS sources just like WS VHS.

So when you do not find it in a store or it is P&S only, fill out a comment card. They will know they lost a sale, hey if your are in XXXXmart, fill one out on a movie like Willy Wonka just to help. For each P&S only version send one to the studio, they need to have a way to count LOST sales.

Since there have been enough choices to date, if there was a P&S only choice, so what, I cannot afford all that I want anyway. But is all is like VHS, the number of sales from people who buy 10 times the amount will drop since the excitement is gone.

As for the business end, in the discussion of amamorphic there was the cost for making a seperate transfer was very low. The big cost quoted at the time was making a WS look realistic in P&S. So the cost of the extra transfer was low since the theatrical version was already WS. What is the cost of P&S on the fly?

 

[Kimmo Jaskari]

This is why I've always hated that they release separate versions. I knew that the commodity stores would stock only the pan&scan version, I knew we'd get this darn "confusion" issue raised, and I knew studios would become even more prone to resist releasing dual versions - because it has to cost them more money to make two versions. Two runs to print, two separate packaging choices etc.

Dual versions on both discs would serve everyone much better, the way they actually did for a long time on many discs - both versions available on all discs. Whether they do it via the on-the-fly p&s or by including two transfers is completely immaterial, but having separate packaging and separate discs entirely is a disaster for those of us who want OAR.

As for the retailers, they have to dislike it too. It takes twice the shelf space to display p&s and OAR over just one disc with everything included, assuming they don't want to have to restock the shelf continuously for whichever version sells the most. Also, some people are bound to buy the wrong version and return it, creating another hassle for them they don't need.

We need to get back to dual versions in one package!

 

[DaViD Boulet]

It took forever for anyone to go RSDL from standard dual-side and dual layer until people petitioned for T2 to be 16x9 and a non-flipper and Live decided to take the plunge and do the first RSDL release.
Maybe everyone's "waiting" for a studio to make "real" use of the electronic P/S feature bcs they are worried about compatibility. If we can get a studio to use this feature on a high-profile title and prove that it works, maybe we can get the other studios to start making use of this feature.
one transfer. less disc space. 2 aspect ratios. WIN WIN

 

[Dean M]

C'mon people, Disney only makes sound business decisions. They pay their exalted CEO $140 million dollars for a reason! Just look at their five-year return on investment:
http://finance.yahoo.com/q?s=DIS&d=c...y&l=on&z=m&q=l
From $25 to $23 during that period and they have a fantastic Web presence with the Go Network... oh sorry, it went under. Well, there's always Who Wants to Be a Millionaire? to fall back on...
Michael Eisner rules

 

[Cees Alons]

In my market (Birmingham, Al.) the consumer was barely given the choice of purchasing the Widescreen version of this title.
As far as I was able to tell only Best Buy and Suncoast in this area ever stocked the Widescreen version.
All the other retailers and rental outlets here stocked only the P&S version of the title.
So ... In this particular market at least, this was not a fair test.

Not only that: they (the studio) are deceived.
If you don't have a choice except the one you don't prefer, you will not buy - unless you want the movie so badly, you either buy the P&S anyway or go through great lengths to find the OAR version. But I think many of us when shopping around, pick up a DVD - and then simply lay it down again if it isn't OAR. So that 10% or 20% may even be misleading: they lost some sale!
And now those "hundreds of customers" calling. That little? I know at least thousands of people (here!) who want (at least a choice of) OAR. And would be willing to telephone BV for it! So if we really represent only 20% or less of the market, that should make them think again .
Cees
PS: I'm afraid, what they really mean is: their customers phoned, i.e. some big retailer chains.
C.

 

[DaViD Boulet]

Then as consumers we need to let our voice be heard by the big retailers...let them know we want OAR and we're NOT an insignificant minority.

Anyhow...we need to form a "widescreen advocacy" group and all become *official* representatives and try and get some cooperation going with some of these chains (best buy and Block Buster to start).

-dave

 

[Chris Beveridge]

I think I've only seen it mentioned once or twice in this thread, but a couple of people have nailed down exactly what needs to be done. The petitions and the phone calls have reached their limit, and Disney is doing their cleanup PR wise of it now by doing the various interviews and explanations.

What remains is for the reviewing sites to do what the magazines won't do, and that is to simply not review any product from the offending company. Magazines survive by the money from the advertisers. Review sites survive by the users who use the banners, etc.

The large number of DVD reviewing sites need to make that group move to stop reviewing the offending companies materials. Having statements why available on the site for individual titles and so forth. They need to make the stand for the consumer in the publicity department.

Frankly, all the effort that went into the whole Star Wars/TPM push of the past couple of years was misguided. This day has been coming for awhile, and the potential may have been squandered on that.

 

[DaViD Boulet]

That and we need to get the retailers to see our point of view so they quit ASKING the studios to go P/S only!!!

 

[Jesse Skeen]

"Widescreen Review" won't review any pan and scan discs; even on ones with both formats they refuse to acknowledge the existence of the pan and scan version

 

[Dean M]

So what is the answer? Should a web site be set up that just deals with OAR issues. Something that would help to educate the general population as well as pressure the studios and retailers. If there are people out there willing to contribute to such an endeavor I am more than willing to put my money were my mouth is. I will gladly register a domain name, help pay for a site (I'm not sure what a large site cost per month) and to work on graphics/layout (as I have retired young).

Let's do more than what is being done now.

 

[AaronMK]

Should a web site be set up that just deals with OAR issues. Something that would help to educate the general population as well as pressure the studios and retailers.

I was under the impression that this was suppoesed to be the purpose of Widescreen Advocate. They have some great educational materials, but actual advocacy is limited to online petitions (which are easily ignored).
Hopefully, they will set themselves up as a sort of command center for ours and other forums' OAR advocacy efforts. Right now, we are very scattered. Our goals views range from unrealistic (ex. getting the studios to stop P&S altogether) to unsatisfactory (ex. lets just make sure this doesn't happen with HD-DVD). We have some who believe we should put pressure on the studios and some who believe the pressure should be on the retailers.
Our forces are scattered and our efforts are being spread too thinly, and it is therefore easier for companies to ignore us. I think we would be much more effective if we all rallied behind an attainable and realistic goal, and had organized advocacy efforts. This would not be so different from many other advocacy organizations.
I think more effectively organizing our efforts is key. It will make us harder to ignore, and will serve to better unite the OAR community.

 

[DaViD Boulet]

Aaron,

that's exactly what I've been saying. We need to "unite" under a widescreen organization that puts us all under one lid here in the US (and abroad?). Then when we petition retailers or ask Block Buster to let us set up a widescreen demonstration booth in their store we can get some better respect. We could even have T-shirts, handouts, and cards to pass out that all have our widescreen "logo" on them. I think that the widescreen advocate website is the natural place to start. I'm talking with Philip right now to see if we can use his website as our "offical" website.

We need a core-group of a dedicated few who can figure out what needs to be done to "organize" and get the structure in place. Then we can begin to recruit other enthusiasts to help out with the logical next step.

One thing we'll have to do as an organiation *and* as individual consumers is begin to write and petition the retailers.

-dave

 

[Oscar]

Whoa, whoa, guys. It seemed that everybody ignored my god-damnded proposal about going to everysingle place were they sell DVDs and educate people about the benefits of widescreen.

 

[DaViD Boulet]

Oscar,

right there with you. We just need an *organization* we can say we belong to in order to make that work. We can't look like zealots when we go to the store manager and ask that we do this. We need to say "Hi, I'm a member of the widescreen education consortium and I'd like to talk to you about hosting some education seminars on your premises..."

We need to have a business card to hand to the store manager. We need a brochure that tell him (and other consumers) about what we do. We need an official website to link to for on-line information (widescreen advocate).

The bottom line is that to host these "in store" demos we need to look like we've got some official backing. It would make it much easier to get permission to host these things and make a better impression on consumers to who stop to check out what we're talking about.

-dave

 

[Oscar]

EXCELLENT IDEA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :star: :star: :star: :star: :star: