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Monster Power defective?

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by DanielSmi, Sep 29, 2002.

  1. DanielSmi

    DanielSmi Second Unit

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    I know this doesn't have to do with receivers but you guys would be the only people that might be able to help me. I built my own computer in april and have had problems with the power supply actually I've gone throught 4 different power supplies (2 compaq, 1 Enermax), 1 since April (Antec). The power supplies last about 2 to 4 months and then just go. I keep getting the same problem I lose any display to my monitor. I've tried 4 different motherboards of 3 different brands (2 Compaqs, 1 ASUS, and 1 Giga Byte), 3 different video cards (all Nvidia TNT2 Pro, GF3 Ti 500, and GF 4 Ti 4600), and 3 AMD processors 1.2GHz, 1800+, and 2000+. All with the same problem but one thing has remained constant and that is my Monster Power PowerCenter CG 500 UPS, could it be that this is sendong bad AC to my power supplies and eventually damages them. I don't know if it has a warranty because I won the UPS when I worked at Best Buy. If it was damaged how should I present this to Monster, how could I prove this to them that it's their product fault, I'm not sure it is myself? Is there some way I could find out if it sending a bad signal to the computer? Any opinions would help.

    Daniel Smith

    P.s. I've also tried different hard drive and cd drives, etc but don't think that will really have any effect on the video signal.
     
  2. Bill Kane

    Bill Kane Screenwriter

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    Sorry about yr computer travails. Regarding the Monster UPS, it's hard to say. You can plug the probes of a multimeter/voltmeter set at 200ACV into one of the UPS outlets and watch for awhile if you are getting a steady 117-120V.

    Only a series of prolonged undervoltages (brownouts) and overvoltages (>140V) cud over time do damage. But the UPS shouldnt kicked in in that case. And you wud've seen such voltage fluctuations elsewhere in the house.

    How have other household appliances and components acted during this time? Has the Monsterpower 5100 you have on yr HT given any sign that it's been active in catching surge/spikes? All the LEDs still glowing?

    I dont think that yr Monsterpower UPS can be sending "dirty power" to the computer unless there is evidence that the household supply also is affected. I cud be wrong. What do its LEDs indicate? Any indication its batteries have been draining? The unit also cud be bench-tested with an oscilloscope to measure its AC wave form in addn to the output voltage testing.

    Living in Florida, it's possible you experienced some major electrical storm lightning activity that may have pushed the UPS over the edge. But again, it should be tested. Many of our surge suppressors are designed to fail under massive hits, and we just replace them.
     
  3. DanielSmi

    DanielSmi Second Unit

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    On my 5100 I get on average about 120 the highest it goes normally is about 125-126 and I might get 118 but normally it's around 120-121. I've also tried plugging the Cg 500 into different outlets and still the I get failed power supplies. I take it you work for Monster. I checked all the lights that are supposed to be one for the 5100 are on and on the cg 500 only the protection light is on which is the only one that should be on. Also, I didn't mention this but on the GIGABYTE mobo I had actually 2 electrical fires one that burnt my prcessor (2000+) and another that made one of the IC chips on the sound portion of the motherboard (it has a built-in sound card) light up like a charcoal, it was actually glowing orange like an ember. I wouldn't go as far as to blame the cg 500 for that but the other 3 mobo it seems as if its the only thing left that I haven't placed blame on. There's no way that all the mobo or power supplies or video cards or even processors are causing the same problem the only constant is the cg 500, EVRYTHING else has changed:processor, hd, cdrom, dvd-rom, sound card , video card, mobo, processor, power supply, memory, everything. When it get a new power supply and a new system everything work fine for a few months then out of nowhere it fails. the computer is in the same room and on the same circuit as the 5100 so if that was the prob I'd probaly have problem with the HT but I haven't, I used to have the computer in my bedroom and had the problem the and then I had the cg 500. Everything just keeps leading me back to the cg 500 I never had any problem like this before i had the cg 500.

    Daniel Smith
     
  4. Bill Kane

    Bill Kane Screenwriter

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    Daniel,
    You have my greatest respect in building computers. I have abs. no inclination to do this because my learning curve wud be so high it wud be a real time suck! There are plenty of other things I need to learn[​IMG]
    So I wont say anything about computer power supplies. You posted in this forum, not the Computers forum.
    You are looking for a smoking gun, and your deductions lead you to want to blame the Monster500UPS because it has been a constant. If you make that assumption in the beginning, you will have a closed-loop logic that may rule out other things that can be going on in solving the problem. This is why I mention the bench-testing.
    I am just your humble HT hobbyist who happens to talk more than others about surge suppressors; sorta weird, but it's interesting to me. I own no stock in 'em, and in fact, I no longer work[​IMG] You may have seen my post some days ago about the new Monsterpower HT1000 UPS. It is just a heads-up; I had no idea Monster had an earlier generation of UPS such as yours. I even posted a mini-review of computer UPS ideas the other day in the HTF Computers Forum. I don't sell 'em.
    If you've gone thru 3-4 computer part replacements and you suspect the Monster UPS is outputting "dirty power," by all means get rid of it. Email Monster and see if you can send it back for replacement should they agree. Like I said, nearly all surge suppressors (that use MOVs) will wear down and then fail under prolonged surge/spike hits. This may even take some years. It depends on what they've "suffered."
    Oh, the electricity will still pass thru, but the surge/spike protection features can be degraded enough that components are left wide open to the next big surge/spike.
    I do not know if your Monster500 UPS is "line-interactive" meaning the batteries only kick on when household power goes bad. This is the desireable type. The other method uses the UPS DC inverter all the time to run off the battery which is constantly being charged. This can be problematical.
    G'luck on solving your problems and achieving your goals.
    regards,
    bill
     
  5. DanielSmi

    DanielSmi Second Unit

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    see the thing is that I didn't just start having this problem I've this problem for about a year and a half which is how long I've owned the cg 500. I first blamed it on the mobo Compaq mobo. I started out with a Compaq which a got for my birthday (Feb 2001) and then after i had this same problem with it and being unable to solve it decided to build my own and took a couple of spare parts out of it (hd, floppy and ethernet LAN card) abought all the other and put one together. With the Compaq since I worked at BB I bought the service plan and had them come out about 3 times to give me new hd, new mother boards, and everytime the came out and installed the parts it still wouldn't work. When I got a new video card i bought I new power supply after i noticed the video card required alot ofpower which i felt the current ps couldn't give it. the ps is reated a t 350w and the video card watned 300w so I decided to upgrade and bought a 550w Enermax and that worked fine and then after a few months Iost video signal so I called service techs, they came out gave me all kinds of new stuff which didn't solve the problem. Since I threw the original ps away when I got the new one the couldn't give me a new ps because they needed the orignal to take back. So I said screw it all and built my own computer. So when I put the Enermax in the new computer (plugged into cg 500) I still got no video display so I said it's my ps so I went out bought a new one installed and bam it worked. Now July comes around and I lose video signal to my monitor again but since I had just made an adjustment to my mobo before I lost the signal I blamd it on that so I bought another mobo (GIGABYTE) thinking the other one (ASUS) I had messed up. That the gigigabyte light on fire and yesterday I installed the old compaq mobo with Antec ps and try 2 of the video cards and none work. So that means my ps is broken which means I need a new one. But if I buy a new one it will fix my computer temporarily and it will break 2-3 mos down the road. It's a repeatitive cycle. I do have a digital multmeter I got from radio shack I'll have to check it out and I will post what I find.

    Daniel Smith
     
  6. DanielSmi

    DanielSmi Second Unit

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    I found my Multimeter and measured the AC voltage I got a reading of 123v and I looked at my 5100 and it had a readong of 121. They aren't plugged into the same outlet but are in the same room. I don't have an Oscilliscope but I know someone who might, if they did have one what might I look for in the signal it would read that would tell me something was wrong?

    Daniel Smith
     
  7. Bill Kane

    Bill Kane Screenwriter

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    Daniel,
    I see your frustration, and I'll give another shot at this and try to dump any bull$hit stuff.
    I'll explain what it does and why I think it has not gone bad. This is not what you want to hear, I know.
    What you have is a Monster Computer Surge Protector/500VA UPS (D'Oh bear with me) here. I have something almost identical from the Belkin company. These actually are simple devices and hard to break, unless they are really dropped and abused and connections inside start loosening. Again not too likely.
    As a surge suppressor, it's really just a big plug-in power center a lot like the Monster HTS800 or 850 for $150 or less. The computer runs off the CG500 outlet as if it were plugged into the wall. When there is a electrical outage from the power company, the UPS batteries immediately kick in and supply about 120VDC for a few minutes.
    Thirdly, the box has surge suppression coils to absorb and shunt that excess energy aside. This is what I'm talking about that can wear out after numerous "hits." You'll probably still ok because you haven't reported in this thread that lightning has struck around your house the past 18 months.
    Ok, with the surge suppressor and UPS batteries just waiting in the background until they're needed, all you want that box to do is deliver steady electrical power every day. That will be 117-120V at 60Hz or cycles, just like any wall outlet.
    Electronic power supplies are supposed to tolerate small variances say 5 percent either way. Even the power company hedges and uses a 3-5percent delivery standard.
    You've already checked with the multimeter. The different readings betw the Monster 5100 and the UPS dont mean anything. Recently, I've been checking my surge protector outlets several times a day and at night to see if it's steady within 2-3volts and it usually only varies 0.5V, but that's MY system.
    I dont have the equipment to check for 60Hz cycles. It takes an oscilloscope and someone who knows how to use. It you have this checked out, and it reads ok, meaning you're getting 120V 60Hz electricity that conforms to the same waveform produced out of a wall socket, then what can be wrong with your box?
    ...that's my thinking, hope it helps...
    bill
     
  8. DanielSmi

    DanielSmi Second Unit

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    I now it's not sending too much voltage or not enough. I'm not really thinking it's a problem with the surge protector but could it be possible that it's adding something to the signal that after extended exposure to this will cause a psu to fail. I'm not sure what going on but that's why I posted on this forum to see if anyone had any idea to what was wrong, some thing is consistently making every psu I get fail in 3-4 months.

    Daniel Smith
     

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