Merged Thread: Who Framed Roger Rabbit Problems (1 Viewer)

[CraigF]

is there something wrong with the framing

Too bad WFRR doesn't have a framing problem, or BTTF a timing problem...sorry, but I would be amused

 

[Mark Lee]

The dvd freezes multiple times for about 10 seconds. This is probably due to the fact that I played it on my Sony DVP-S9000ES as this problem is similar to the problem many sony player owners had with the Spy Kids 2 dvd.

Chalk me up as another S9000ES owner who's having freeze-up problems with this release. I'd have to go back and pinpoint exactly where it locked up, but it happened once (that I noticed), and it was fairly early on in the movie.

One other thing I noticed is that the subtitles frequently "lock-up" as well -- they get stuck on a particular line, and stay that way until I cycle thru the subtitle options again to the English.

Sigh. Does that mean returning this disc to Best Buy won't fix the problem after all?

 

[PatLeo]

I have this disc and on my Sony 9000, I was listening to the audio commentary but the Spanish Subtitles kept showing up even though the Subtitles were turned off, but it would only show up when the subtitles were showing you what was written on a newspaper or building or something like that. It also had a 20 second freeze up at the layer break. I have almost never seen a layer break on this machine.

 

[ScottR]

The framing was the same in the theatre. I think the intention of that particular scene was to show as many familiar characters without giving too much away.

 

[Kevin Davis]

I had a pretty harsh layer change on my Toshiba SD-3755 but the only real "problem" I noticed with the set I found last night. I was systematically going through the bonus features on disc 2. In the "Valiant Files" section of disc two (I was entering at the galleries from the "list" interface - I wasn't using the picture to navigate) I discovered something irritating. When I was in any of the galleries, the screen showed no "highlight" or mark of any kind indicating which picture or option I was choosing. The first few times I had no idea where I was navigating to when I would hit ENTER on the remote. Eventually, I got a feel for where each selection screen would put you when you entered and, from there, I was able to navigate by counting the number of times, and direction, I hit the arrow keys on the remote. Pretty irritating and, surely, a mistake in the interface design. Anyone else notice this yet?

UPDATE: Actually, after I posted the above info, I checked the disc again and NOW I get a magnifying glass that indicates which image I've selected as well as a blue highlight when I choose an option such as forward, back or exit. Must have been a fluke in my player last night...wierd.

 

[Paul E. Fox II]

Double Post!

 

[Paul E. Fox II]

No Freezing on my Toshiba SD-3109, but the Flickering is MADDENING! It appears to be on every live action scene where animated characters were added so could it be attributed to the process used to merge the two together?

 

[Derek Miner]

I think Paul is correct. There's no flickering on scenes with just live action (the scene where Eddie enters Maroon's office, for instance). The flickers didn't surprise me, because I have noticed assorted noise when watching older animation, just because each frame is a separate element photographed individually. Anyone remember that documentary on Tron where they talked about how they had a problem where every few frames would come back much brighter than the rest? Just the technical gremlins involved in trying something that hasn't been done before, just like Roger Rabbit.

Remember those notes they used to put on CDs, "Because of the high resolution of the compact disc, it may reveal limitations of the source material"? I think this is the same kind of thing. The DVD is capable of reproducing such a good picture, you're going to notice more imperfections.

And I'll also throw in my two cents that the framing in question earlier is correct.

 

[AndrewA]

No freezing on my Panny RP-91 and the flickering wasn't too obvious on my display (actually, I didn't notice any, I watched it on a Mits 65908)...or I might just be blind.

 

[Dean Cooper]

I have this disc and on my Sony 9000, I was listening to the audio commentary but the Spanish Subtitles kept showing up even though the Subtitles were turned off, but it would only show up when the subtitles were showing you what was written on a newspaper or building or something like that. It also had a 20 second freeze up at the layer break. I have almost never seen a layer break on this machine.

I am having exactly the same problem but with a JVC player and the French subtitles. I had to turn on the English subtitles and then turn them back off for the movie to play correctly.

 

[JimmyK]

No Freezing on my Toshiba SD-3109, but the Flickering is MADDENING! It appears to be on every live action scene where animated characters were added so could it be attributed to the process used to merge the two together?

I noticed the same thing. I suspect this is from the original elements and not a result of a bad transfer. I wish I still had my original release so I could do a comparison. I don't remember seeing flickering on the original release, but the transfer quality wasn't as good either. Could be that the leeser quality release masked some of the flickering effect, or perhaps I just didn't notice it so much since I wasn't looking for it.

Other than the flickering, I had no other problems playing the new release on my Toshiba SD6200.

I'll have to try it on my Pioneer DV414 this weekend to see if it has any problems.

JimmyK

 

[Felix Martinez]

No Freezing on my Toshiba SD-3109, but the Flickering is MADDENING! It appears to be on every live action scene where animated characters were added so could it be attributed to the process used to merge the two together?

Re: the flickering...

Folks, this is the wonderful world of good 'ol photochemical optical effects. These "flickering" shots are at *least* one generation removed from non-optical elements. The only way around this is to do a grounds up restoration of WFRR, going back to all the original elements, scanning them into the computer as high-res files and digitally compositing them.

Cheers,
Felix

 

[Richard Gilmore]

It's been years since I've seen it, but I don't remember flickering on my Laserdisc copy of WFRR. It could just be that my memory's gone, however

 

[george kaplan]

I can't speak to the dvd as I'm not going to buy it, but I did watch the laser disc on Tuesday, and saw no flickering.

 

[Felix Martinez]

I can't speak to the dvd as I'm not going to buy it, but I did watch the laser disc on Tuesday, and saw no flickering.

I have the LD and the new DVD. The differences between scenes of opticals and non-opticals are much more pronounced on the new DVD. Unless I'm misunderstanding the descriptions of "flickering" in this thread, I think this is what's being noticed.

BTW - while I did notice the quality differences from shot to shot, I was not overly distracted by them, even on a 92 inch screen. I think the new WFRR DVD is pretty darn good. My one annoyance is that the audio is quite harsh. It has always been harsh and shrill, but I was hoping for a more balanced track in the re-mix.

Cheers,
Felix

 

[Daniel Lee]

For those that are seeing "descriptive" type sub-titles pop up...have you checked to see what language your players are set at? In each players set-up menu there are choices the user can make or change to indicate your primary language. Are yours set to English? Might this make a difference?

It's worth a try.

Dan

 

[Mark Lee]

The subtitle glitch people here are mentioning w/regard to the Sony S9000ES is not unique to this release -- similar things have been seen on a slew of previous releases, where even with the subtitles ostensibly turned off, foreign-language subtitles show up on scenes that display some kind of English-language text on-screen (signs, title cards, etc). Most recently, I know this comes up on the Band of Brothers set, where French subtitles would pop up whenever some text showed up onscreen. It only seemed to start happening if one had turned on the subtitles at any point while watching the disc (if you never turned on the subtitles, it wouldn't happen), and the only way to stop it was to eject and re-insert the disc (or turn the player off and on again). Seems to be a glitch in the 9000ES subtitle function.

 

[Daniel Lee]

I hear what you are saying Mark but my question still stands. Some discs (many of Disney's for example) are authored to look for the players language setting and trip whatever flags are needed to playback in that language, sub-title etc. It might be these settings that are triggering this.

Dan

 

[James Bergeron]

Sorry guys, no flickering here I was looking for it. I have a Panny RP-91 with no problems. I noticed it looked a little "blurry" on the animation characters when they were with live action characters, but only if they were really close to the camera. And mostly later in the film. It wasn't enough to distract.

The film looked great, sorry you guys are having these problems.

I'm also running in progressive mode, I'm not sure if everyone with the flickering is or isn't.

 

[PaulEB]

The March issue of Widescreen Review reviewed this DVD and mentions that the movie is a modified/revised version which includes changes to frames in Chapter 1 with Baby Herman and in Chapter 14 with Jessica Rabbit. They also mention that source element artifacts and film grain are amplified in some of the live-action/animation composite shots. The review is posted online.

PS: I'm not sure if references to magazines are allowed in this forum, so let me know.