Maybe hirez sound quality does matter...

Discussion in 'Music' started by Lee Scoggins, Jul 22, 2004.

  1. Lee Scoggins

    Lee Scoggins Producer

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  2. Phil A

    Phil A Producer

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    I did not like them referring to me as:

    "Listening to music in ‘surround sound’ is a much higher preference among those aged 18-24 (66%) than those aged 45-54 (26%) – a recent Hi-Fi Choice column suggested that those who didn’t like multi-channel music were mostly tired old men, afraid to try something new… and that now appears to be statistically accurate, at least according to this poll!"

    I am not tired at all. I take my Geritol every day
    [​IMG]
     
  3. Seth--L

    Seth--L Screenwriter

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    Again this all comes down to how the question was worded. I prefer watching films in 35mm on a big screen, but I mainly watch them on a tube with DVD.
     
  4. Brian L

    Brian L Cinematographer

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    While I only skimmed the article, I would like to really understand what those that were surveyed consider good quality sound.

    Given that a bazillion people are said to have actually paid $$$ for 128K AAC files at iTunes, I suspect that the answers to that one would be all over the map.

    I would wager if you sat them down and played a few of those 128K tracks over a 1/2 decent rig, they would say sure, thats good SQ. Then play an AIX DVD-A or maybe Beck's Sea Change on SACD, and the jaws would hit the floor. Or maybe not?

    Oh, and I am 43. Can't I play too???

    BGL
     
  5. Michael St. Clair

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    Probably anything that isn't vinyl (clicks), tape (hiss), or analog radio (static).
     
  6. Lee Scoggins

    Lee Scoggins Producer

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    Well I disagree but to blend your post and Seth's I would argue the best survey would be to play a song (in a genre/band the listener is familiar with) first in MP3 and then in Red Book and then in DVDA/SACD on a reasonable but not expensive system and ask them what version they liked most without revealing the format.

    I betcha that most would prefer the hirez and some would prefer the Red Book, but very few would choose 128K sampling.
     
  7. Brian L

    Brian L Cinematographer

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    Well my point, perhaps poorly made is that, viewed without a comparison to true hi-rez stuff, many listeners would say that 128K SQ is "good".

    Again, the iTunes numbers speak volumes.

    Now, listened to in a true head to head, sure, anyone with two ears that work would likely choose the hi-rez. But then, the definition of SQ for 128K AAC would switch from "good" to "good enough".

    BGL
     
  8. Seth--L

    Seth--L Screenwriter

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    Lee,

    My point is that with any survey/poll you can produce the results you want through the wording, and with this one, commissioned by Philips, Sony and UMG, they've done that.

    What's ironic about this stat:

    Just because they think the SACD sounds better than the redbook and MP3 doesn't mean they're going to invest in SACD.
     
  9. Marc Colella

    Marc Colella Cinematographer

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    Yep, and they're already getting "crystal clear" sound with CD and MP3.

    I've heard many people refer to CD and MP3 as having "awesome sound". If it's loud and "pumping" - then it sounds good. Our definition of good sound quality is much different than the average consumer.

    Anything above and beyond CD and MP3 is overkill, and people just don't care and many won't even notice.
     
  10. Lee Scoggins

    Lee Scoggins Producer

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    In my opinion, the results here refute this.
     
  11. Michael St. Clair

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    Which results?
     
  12. Seth--L

    Seth--L Screenwriter

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    Results from some iffy poll done by the creators of SACD [​IMG]
     
  13. Marc Colella

    Marc Colella Cinematographer

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    There were no results.

    It was a general question about whether sound quality mattered to them - and they said yes. We have no qualification as to what they consider good sound quality.

    My friends also think sound quality is important - which is one of the reasons they like 192kbps MP3s.

    People have different ideas and expectations with regards to sound quality - so this survey tells us nothing.

    CD is the pinnicle of sound quality for the average consumer. If people cared, Hirez would have taken off and MP3s would have died already.
     
  14. Garrett Lundy

    Garrett Lundy Producer

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    100,000,000+ legal sales since april tell us that "Joe Average" is more than happy with his or her 128kbps/song. I'm going to wager a buck that this is alot more material than SACD or DVD-A has been purchased in this time.

    And I post on this forum so I guess I'm a step above uneducated mass consumer and I have 4 listening areas for music: Car, Portable, Computer, and Home stereo.

    Of the three, only on the home stereo is the equipment even remotely good enough to tell a difference (what with road/background noise and all).

    Most people don't have a deidicated home stereo anymore...and even if they did, most would agree that Apple's AAC is pretty good. I have trouble telling the difference most times betwixt the two.
     
  15. Lee Scoggins

    Lee Scoggins Producer

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    It's not a fair comparison for several reasons:

    1. Downloads are more convenient.
    2. Press coverage has been phenomenal.

    The issue is whether with a little education and marketing you can sell people on the benefits of hirez. I think you can.

    If you can't tell the difference between AAC and Red Book then you are not a likely candidate for hirez anyway.
     
  16. Seth--L

    Seth--L Screenwriter

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    It's getting more press because the media is right in assuming that J6P is more interested in a medium like MP3 than SACD because of its convenience and small size.
     
  17. Rachael B

    Rachael B Producer

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    Lee, tourists, philgrims, rookies, greenhorns, little old ladies, skuul teachers, flunkies, fisherman, and a whole lot of other people can't tell MP3 from S-A-C-D from Memorex. They might buy better sound quality but they'll never "hear" it like you or me. They may claim to? But, they won't. They might buy better sound quality on the perception that it's better but they never fully appreciate it, percieve it. They'll buy it cause it's new or because the minisystem fits on their shelf or because it's silver and matches the TV or because their bud got one.

    Even if they say they bought it for the sound quality, they didn't, really... Undoing the public's perception that CD is the ultimate purr-fect sound fur-ever will be hard, if it's even possible???

    I would hire rock & Jazz & classical stars and have them hard sell like used car salesmen. Imagine Roger Daltry standing there on TV with an electric guitar, he hits a powerchord, then he starts yelling about the virtues of SA-CD, yada, yada, yada.

    Of course this whole concept is pointless if there is no unified format/s/effort and the, now, big 4 can't be bothered to release software, and affordable software TOO! The music industry has no totally promising future till the Warner versus Sony fued ends, me thinks. Then they have other problems to address too. Will the industry wither and die over pride? They're off to a good start I'd say.[​IMG]

    Yeah Lee, people may buy sound quality but it won't be because they can actually hear it. [​IMG]
     
  18. Lee Scoggins

    Lee Scoggins Producer

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    Because the earlier stats cited relate to these other factors and may be masking issues some have with MP3 sound quality.
     
  19. Brian L

    Brian L Cinematographer

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    Man, this just seems like the same old same old; How do you sell hi-rez to the masses?

    You don't based on SQ alone, its not gonna do it. And has not done it. And it won't do it.

    Audiophiles go on and on about the HUGE increase in resolution between redbook and SACD or DVD-A. Well, to non-audiophiles, its an incremental improvement, if at all.

    You wanna sell hi-rez to the masses? Let them hear well done MC music on a 1/2 decent system. Its even money that those same folks DO have a surround sound HT system for movies, or at least no someone that has one. Let them hear "Dark Side of the Moon" (or any other music that they appreciate) in 5.1 and they will be interested.

    Play them the redbook version, and compare it to the 2CH hi-rez version, and they will just yawn.

    BGL
     
  20. Lee Scoggins

    Lee Scoggins Producer

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    The problem is many people do not have a 5.1 system.
     

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