Man.....I REALLY hate to ask

Discussion in 'Speakers & Subwoofers' started by Jason Brent, Apr 27, 2004.

  1. Jason Brent

    Jason Brent Second Unit

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    Sorry guys, I really hate to post yet another one of these threads, but could y'all humor me a little?

    Going to pull the trigger on an SVS. 20-39 PC+ or PB2-isd. Currently I'm in a small 2 bedroom apt (1000 sq ft) with a small living room. I'm by myself most of the time, and WAF is not a factor anymore (as of the last 2 months....)

    Obviously either would be WAY overkill in my current arrangement. But things may (and probably will) change sometime in the next year or two. I think the isd will barely fit. Tonight I'm going to try to construct a cardboard mock up just to make sure.

    Should I get the isd for future proofing? Should I save the extra $150, go with the +, and start rebuilding some of my lost DVD collection (she got some)?

    ....can't decide[​IMG].....
     
  2. WayneO

    WayneO Supporting Actor

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    I'd get the tube then maybe another if you need it in your next place.
     
  3. Joey_V

    Joey_V Second Unit

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    tube!!!! it is defintely easier to place and situate... easily corner loaded - and boy, i love the db-12 woofers... much better looking than the isd woofer - if this actually matters!! [​IMG]
     
  4. Jason Brent

    Jason Brent Second Unit

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    Ha, ha Joey...

    I appreciate your enthusiastic response. I agree that having the 'better' woofer would be cool, but I'll never see either of the drivers.

    And I really like the look of the 'unconventional' tube. For me it adds a little bit more wow and coolness factor. But performance is the main determiner here.

    I will not likely be able to add a second sub when I move again, so I would like to get what I'm gonna get now, and be fine with it for some time.

    Another thing Eric told me is that, if for some reason I don't like the PB2-isd, sending it back is very cost prohibitive. So to a certain extent there is less overall risk with the PC+.

    BTW, if it makes any difference with the opinions, here's the associated equip: HK 525, and Paradigm ref 60's, CC, and Atlantic Tech 374 THX dipoles.

    Listening tastes vary wildly. I've been enjoying Maroon 5 the last couple of days, but I also listen to a fair bit of Jazz, classical, blues, and hip hop. I only have a few DVD-A's to take advantage of hi-rez. I ocassionally like to listen fairly loud as well (when neighbors allow). I haven't actually taken a RS SPL meter reading (I'll try to do that sometime) of what kind of musical SPL peaks I have now, sans sub, at louder levels to give you an idea of volume preferences.

    I calibrate to -10 on my HK for reference, and occasionally do listen there, even in my apartment. (Higher than that prior to being an apartment dweller)

    Thanks for humoring me guys.... :b
     
  5. SethH

    SethH Cinematographer

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    Reasons I think I would take the tube if I were in your situation:

    1. smaller foot-print
    2. better driver
    3. cheaper shipping if needed (as you mentioned)
    4. easier to get it up off the floor for the sake of the people below you.
    5. if you need higher spl when you move out of the apartment it will still have a very high resale value and you can pick-up a pb2 (but i doubt you'll need the extra spl)
    6. looks cooler (as you mentioned)
    7. cost

    The only reason not to get the tube is the spl increase with the pb2. since this won't be an issue for at least a year or two i wouldn't worry about it now.
     
  6. Jason Brent

    Jason Brent Second Unit

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    OK....staying up way to late...(but gonna send out the money tomorrow)

    The PB2 will fit. Just have to move the sofa 4". No big deal.

    But you guys are helping me. I originally planned on the PC+, but then got to thinking....hmmmm, only $150 more (with shipping)....hmmmm.[​IMG] But the tube is probably the more sensible choice.

    BTW, there is only one spot in my current setup to put either....in the right rear corner....about 4-5 feet from my listening spot.

    If I go with the tube (probably should), should I stay with my initial choice of the 20 Hz model?
     
  7. Joey_V

    Joey_V Second Unit

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    i have the 25-31PC+... but in your situation, u would be wise to get the 20-39PC+ - great balance of extension and output imho.

    u could go for the PB2+ and end any nagging doubts!!! [​IMG]
     
  8. JohnSmith

    JohnSmith Supporting Actor

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    I use the 20-39 PC Plus in a similar sized room; more than enough..the PB2 would be way way overkill, and would impose into the room. This coming from a man with 2K (RMS) of clean audio power into respective loads, in a 1000 cu foot room ;-) that would be about 20,000W PMPO ;-)

    A bit of overkill is good (headroom) but way overkill is just a waste of money/space. (ie replacing all my amps with Krells, total of ~8KW of audio power) ;-)

    I think the Plus Cylinder would be ideal. Trust me, getting something too big for a room seems OK at first, but eventually you yearn to save that space (CRT RP into a small room) ;-)

    If you do move into another house the PC Plus might still be more than adequate.

    And not forgetting the 16/20 cylinder is tuned lower than the box (25hz)
     
  9. DonnyD

    DonnyD Screenwriter

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    A SVS sub in an apartment? Either you are gonna have lots of company or very irritated neighbors....
     
  10. Jeff Gatie

    Jeff Gatie Lead Actor

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    Not necessarily. I have owned a 22-35PCi in two apartments, listening at 20-15 (on rare occasions 10-5)below reference for 3 years without one complaint. The first was a 1st floor, concrete construction and the current one is a townhouse. It all depends on the construction of the unit and the sensitivity of your neighbors. I think it helped that both apartments were/are less than 10 years old, so they were constructed with noise dampening between the units in mind.
     
  11. Jason Brent

    Jason Brent Second Unit

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    John,

    I understand about imposing on the room. But with my current setup, it would actually match all the other stuff that's too big for the room. I'm sitting only about 8 ft from my 47" CRT RPTV, this on my oversized 110" long sofa.

    The sofa actually somewhat conceals the PB2.

    After sleeping on it.....I still am uncertain. I also emailed Tom again last night (what a patient guy to put up with me), so we'll see what he says.
     
  12. Wayne Ernst

    Wayne Ernst Cinematographer

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    Don't feel bad. The only bad question is a question that is not asked. [​IMG]
     
  13. JohnSmith

    JohnSmith Supporting Actor

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    A subwoofer might not sound it's best in that position (behind/next?) to the sofa. I had my SVS pratically next to the chair- didn't sound boomy but it did sound alot better moving it further away, along the front wall- more integrated to the main speakers. A PB2 ISD would have fitted next to me too (but not along the front wall) so despite the PB2 being a "better" subs due to location contraints it would be a bad sub choice. Because the cylinder fits nicely along the front wall I have that choice.

    It's possible it'll be the same for you.

    If you don't have the flexibility to move it to another location (because the thing is just too big)then IMO it will degrade the sound (overall)
     
  14. Jason Brent

    Jason Brent Second Unit

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    Hi John,

    Well, without doing some MAJOR rearranging (like totally getting rid of my big 1.5 sized chair) the front wall is already too full. I could maybe, maybe just fit a cylinder right up against the rear of the RPTV, but then magnetic interference would be a problem.

    I totally realize that my current situation is very much less than ideal. I'm still waiting to hear from Tom (c'mon Tom it's been like 8 hours already:wink[​IMG] to hear his recommendations.

    I sent him all of the same info. BTW, my apartment isn't that big (1000 sq ft) but is fairly open, as most apartments are. I've got at the very least a good 2200-2300 cu. ft. to fill.

    I sure would like to make up my mind, so I can just order the damn thing!
     
  15. Jason Brent

    Jason Brent Second Unit

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    Hmmmm,

    Just re-reading everyone's posts.....not one thumbs up for the PB2-isd.

    OK, for the tubes.....20-39 or the 25-31? or should I even be considering the real tall one?
     
  16. JohnSmith

    JohnSmith Supporting Actor

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    Well according to SVS's (and other people's comments) most stuff is the 20hz range..with only some rare occurrences it dips to 16hz and below.

    You will loose outright SPL for the lower tuned models (or port plugging) 20hz is the good middle ground of the two. Reading the FAQ on SVS's site should help, and reading Mingl waterfall graphs too (most LF appears ~20hz) course going to get stuff down to 5hz like B.H.D. but you can't expect any sub to output that at reference levels!

    I haven't seen anyone comparing the three different models.. although it is possible to tune a 25hz lower (ie 20hz) - it's not the same as the 20hz stock model.

    edit- here's mings thread..
    http://www.hometheaterforum.com/htfo...hreadid=144887
     
  17. Mike SJ

    Mike SJ Supporting Actor

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    Jason, live anywhere in the KC area? im downtown right now

    my opinion is to save ALL your money untill you upgrade. an SVS isso much overkill for an pt.

    Best idea was to buy one tube and get the match later if you need it.
     
  18. Dan Halchak

    Dan Halchak Stunt Coordinator

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    If you are going to listen to music mainly I would suggest the 25-31, for the little bit more headroom that you will no doubt want (and it's also cheaper!).

    If you do watch a fair amount of movies, more and more are hitting the 16Hz range (dropping off around 20Hz), so the 20-39 would be better suited. I wouldn't hit up the 16-46 unless you like organ music a lot, it will definitely MOVE things...but there's not a whole lot that goes down that far that you would really miss it (especially if you are mainly music).

    For you I would consider either the PC+ 25-31 I think. For the sheer reason that when you do move into a bigger place, you can easily add another (if need be), or sell it and get something better (PB2+!!!).

    I got the PC+ 20-39, and it's great, no regrets what so ever (and mine's not corner loaded, and I sit about 4 feet from it)....but I know it's potential as I took it over a friends house and was like [​IMG]

    So that made me happy knowing that it doesn't sound it's best where it's at now, but when I get things done...wooo hoo!
     
  19. Jason Brent

    Jason Brent Second Unit

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    Oops!! forgot to update my profile. I move around so much. In the last four years I've lived in Oakland, Salina (KS), Hawaii, back to Wichita, and now in FL! Plus I just got back yesterday from considering a job in Tucson. Don't think I'm moving to AZ, though. (sure did have a BLAST in Nogalez, Mexico the last couple of days there, though!)

    Mike, I used to fly to Kansas City Downtown airport all the time. I took all of my private pilot students there on cross country training flights. Fun little airport.

    Well, even though I haven't yet heard back from Tom, I think I'm gonna put the order in for the 20-39 PC+.

    I really appreciate all the thoughts from you all. I guess I should have just trusted my initial thoughts in the first place. I just started second guessing with that great price for the PB2-ISD.

    *rushing off to the phone as he types....*[​IMG]
     
  20. Joey_V

    Joey_V Second Unit

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    the 20-39PC+ is great... but i like the 25-31PC+ for its smallish size - dorm rooms can be a pain. this relates to your apartment situation - the 25-31 can be hidden by the couch - somewhat... whereas the 20-39 will stick out.

    either way - its a great sub... just that the positioning wont be ideal i think - i feel that subs sound best when they are in a corner far from listening position.. i dont know - my opinion.
     

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