Mac/PC ads: Why doesn't Microsoft refute them?

MarkHastings

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I still don't think it has much to do with the video card as it does the translation between the video card and the CPU, but I don't have much proof in my theory - I'm just going by the little I do know about Macs capabilities in the 3D realm.

I believe it might have something to do with Direct X. I don't think Mac has anything similar to Direct X and that's why PC's can compute massive 3D environments in real time (i.e. as in games).

I know this is an old article, but HAS Direct X ever been successfully implemented into Macs (for porting of hard core games)?
http://www.macworld.com/news/2002/04/17/macdx/
 

RobertR

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I certainly wouldn't proudly say "My doctor operated on me and I have no idea what he did or why!", or say "I took my car to be serviced, and I have no idea what was done or why!". Not having the same skill or knowledge as others doesn't equate to complete ignorance, nor does not enjoying being so equate to "elitism".
 

MarkHastings

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I think a more appropriate comparison would be this:

Let's say my cars engine stopped working. I did something to it and it started working again. If someone mentioned how hard it was to work on car engines, I would say (proudly): "I fixed my car and I don't know the first thing about auto repair".


Or let's say I was really sick and a friend of mine had the same sickness. This friend goes to the Dr.'s and gets medication and after a week, they feel better. I (on the other hand) don't go to the doctors...instead, I create my own remedy that cures me just as fast as my friend.

If my friend said "After taking the Dr.'s advice, I got better" - To that, I would say (proudly): "I don't know the first thing about medicine and I cured myself."



See how one can be very proud of ignorance.....well, it should actually be "Proud of getting the job done, despite being ignorant." - Now that's something to be proud of.
 

Ken Chan

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You can get a Mac Pro with a Quadro FX 4500, which nVidia markets as "ultra-high-end" workstation graphics. The ATI X1900 XT is hardly a slouch, either. They also have x16 PCI Express slots, like any other PC.

Lack of DirectX is a big issue. Macs support (industry-standard) OpenGL; Direct3D is the counterpart in DirectX (which also includes APIs for sound and controls). ATI recently released porting tools to convert Direct3D to OpenGL.
 

RobertR

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It wouldn’t make sense that the remedies you mentioned were picked out of thin air, though, Mark. If, for example, you felt better after thinking and acting on the idea that the flu is caused by wearing badly coordinated clothes (some weird feng shui idea), that would be nothing to be proud of. You’d have to have SOME idea of the processes involved.
 

MarkHastings

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Well, anyone who actually uses a computer successfully can't exactly say they don't know anything about computers either. The commercial wasn't meant to be litteral. I still think it was meant to show how proud this woman was that she was able to use something that she didn't think she had the knowledge to use.

i.e. Macs are so easy to use that even if you think you don't know a damn thing about computers, you will be amazed at how proficient you actually will be while using a Mac.
 

RobertR

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Actually, Mark, the woman was acting like she was proud that she had no ideal how to deal with computer problems (she was talking to a PC guy struggling with something).
 

RichP

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And why exactly shouldn't she be "proud" to not have to know how to deal with computer problems?? Why should she have to deal with them at all??

Spoken like a true Windows user who has come to accept that dealing with computer problems is a fact of everyday life... how sad.

99% of the population use computers as a tool to get their work done. They should have no need at all to "fix the tool", and to have to do so is not something that one should necessarily be "proud" of.

Regardless, your comment about "smirking" because this woman had no desire to understand how her computer worked speaks volumes about you.
 

RobertR

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If you're claiming that Macs are problem-free, I'd say that's not true. And yes, I do have disdain for the clueless ("don't bore me with that home theater stuff. Just give me the cute Bose cubes that fit my decor").
 

PeterTHX

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I always saw it akin not to the mechanic or doctor thing, but "I don't know how to drive so I bought this Lexus!"

As for misrepresentation, the one where the guy is so proud of the fact Apple bundled all those wonderful apps....Microsoft was sued because of that!

Or the "talk" camera thing. My PC talks to any camera plugged into it as well.
 

MarkHastings

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and why do you say that?

p.s. and before this gets into a semantics debate, I'd say Macs are 'virtually' problem free. MUCH more so than PC's.

I work more on my Mac (at work) than my PC (at work) and basically ever since OSX, I have almost never had an issue on the Mac. My current Mac has been running for close to 3 years without even the slightest bit of maintenance. In fact, no one at the company knows how to fix Macs, so if there is a problem, it's up to me and I've yet to touch it. I can't say the same for my PC. I barely use the thing and I seem to run into an issue every week with it. It's mind numbing how much I have to keep up with it.

Just like my laptops. My current PC laptop is less than a year old and I can not begin to tell you the crap I've had to do with this OS!!! Whereas my Mac laptop (one of the very first titaniums) has been running without ANY maintenance. Through all of it's use, it still runs the same as it did from day one.
 

PeterTHX

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With a much more limited hardware spec and application library, it should be.
 

MarkHastings

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You don't mean limited - you mean "controlled".

What's the phrase? Too many cooks spoil the soup?
 

RichP

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???

Uh, you may want to step into the 21st century Peter. Do a little research on what Macintosh computers run on and what apps they run. Show me 2 things that can be done on a PC that cannot be done as well or better on a Mac. Should be easy since the application library is so limited.

Unless you meant something else?
 

Adam Lenhardt

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What did Vista really steal from OS X, though? Granted there are some similar features (often much to my chigrin) but most of the more direct comparisons Apple stole/acquired from the existing marketplace (Dashboard for instance)
 

Adam Lenhardt

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You clearly need a new PC, then!
I only run into problems with my laptop every couple months, and that's because the fan vents get clogged. (Pentium 4 definitely wasn't designed to be portable...)

Meanwhile, when I use a Mac (in an office and/or lab setting since I don't have one personally), I'll be working on something in Photoshop, Acrobat, or Audition and then all of a sudden this spinning color wheel pops out of nowhere, replacing my cursor, and I can't click on anything. Eventually it will tell me I have to force quit and then when I try to restart the program, it won't let me because it needs an adminstrator password to repair it first. WTF? In those same labs I have far few instances of a program crashing, and when it does, I can just restart the program and be back in business. When I'm working on files from the central server, I also have to mount it in Mac OS X, where as when I login the Windows workstations with my server account, My Documents links right to my storage space on the server.
 

MarkHastings

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That's because it isn't being utilized properly. Any system has to have a certain amount of proper usage before you can claim that it has any issues. I can easily make a Mac not work properly, but that doesn't count when we are talking about "problem free".

Case in point, I can not begin to tell you the damage that loading applications (in the PC world) does. And I'm not talking about low end stuff, I'm talking professional apps. Roxio 9 will basically wipe out any video editing functionality due to it's conflicting drivers. It is absolutely HORRIBLE how this application took down my video PC. And that's only one example. I am constantly running into conflicts when installing new versions of apps.

In fact, our graphics department was crippled for many days because of badly designed updates to "Professional" applications. It's so bad that our IT department has a lock down on anything new to be installed. Any time one of the artists needs a new app (or update) installed, a TON of research must be done to make sure the system won't go to shit by installing it.

It's mind blowing.
 

MarkHastings

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before anyone says "Your problem is the fact that you are using McAfee", I receieved an update to McAfee security center when my PC was barely a month old. The update was SHIT! It caused so many conflicts and damage on my system that I had to take it down.

Now, I know most people don't like McAfee, but a major application like this should NOT (I repeat NOT) do what it did to my brand new computer. This happens quite a bit. Having to have a ton of graphics, video, animation, design, etc. applications installed at once, the more I start adding to the PC, the more conflicts I run into - and the more that's installed, the more chance for things to go wrong. And I do know what I'm doing on a PC. I'm not talking out of ingroance here. I'm talking cold hard facts that I have actually researched and are in knowledgebases from these companies.
In fact, I've even helped IBM identify a bad sound driver issue on their old ThinkPads that went into a white paper.

I've never had this experience with anything in Mac OSX.
 

DaveF

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I think we're speaking about two different things. Now, PC and Macs are only separated by the software operating system. The hardware is identical. There's no "translation between the video card and the CPU" difference between the systems. This evinced by Windows running without modification on Macs, and reports of OSX running with a bit of hacking on regular PCs.

DirectX won't run under OSX, of course, since it's a Widows driver / software system. But hardware's hardware, and OSX can (or could) take advantage of hardware acceleration if Apple chose to implement it.

Or, there could be a nVidia 7900 in an iMac and I could play games under WIndows via BootCamp. That would be just fine with me. (in fact, that would be great
)

As for Ken's comment on the Quadro 4500 FX: this is not a reasonable gaming option. That's a $2000 video card meant for high-end graphics users. I'm talking about mainstream cards, that are readily found for $150 - $350 at BestBuy, suitable for today's games.

So, Mac doesn't really do games. Fine. But maybe, just perhaps, pretty please, offer something mid-level as an iMac upgrade so I can bootcamp my way to UT3 this Christmas...


(I realize the 24" iMac offers a 7600 GT upgrade option. But as the top-end card in a $3000 computer, that's pretty weak.)
 

MarkHastings

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Since PC's video cards use DirectX, they are handling 3D processes much better than the Mac. This is why they are best for 3D gaming. DirectX is a powerhouse in the real time 3D rendering world.
 

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