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lets talk...Takashi Miike (MERGED THREAD) (1 Viewer)

Colton

Supporting Actor
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Jan 12, 2004
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Could someone try to explain the ending to Ichi: The Killer? Just watched it and I'm confused ...

Colton
 

JonathonSan

Stunt Coordinator
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Feb 13, 2003
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After reading through a few threads here about Miike and his outrageous movies I decided to check out a few of them to see what the fuss was all about. So far I have been able to watch City of Lost Souls, Dead or Alive(R-rated...it'a all local video store had) and Ichi the Killer (Unrated...just joined Netflix). I found these movies to be quite interesting...a bit boring in the case of the first two, but definately worthy of a watch. Miike definately has style and talent to spare. My reaction after watching the much heralded Ichi was "that's it?" I was prepared to be disgusted and shocked...I was instead amused and pleasantly surprised by how cool the whole movie was, but offensive and "hard to watch" it was not. The violence never even seemed to reach the level of Texas Chainsaw Massacre. Now maybe this would be shocking to some, but neither myself or my fiance flinched at all during this movie. Anyway, just a personal observation. I have more Miike on the way...tonight it is Audition. Thanks to all in this forum that provide such an interesting read...and for the introduction to such unique and talented director. BTW, any other suggestions for "hard to watch" or gory movies...Dead Alive being king so far in the gory category...but that is all in good fun.
 

Rich Malloy

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My reaction after watching the much heralded Ichi was "that's it?" I was prepared to be disgusted and shocked...I was instead amused and pleasantly surprised by how cool the whole movie was, but offensive and "hard to watch" it was not. The violence never even seemed to reach the level of Texas Chainsaw Massacre.
"Amusingly cool" is the perfect description of "ICHI", but I'm a bit thrown by your TX Chainsaw comparison. "Ichi" is much more violent and graphic, whereas "Chainsaw" mostly suggests its violence rather than showing it.

And R-rated "Dead or Alive"? Tsk. You really should know better.

You have to see "Audition", but if you're going in expecting to be shocked and outraged, then you've already lost half the effect. The movie is a sucker-punch, and unfortunately you're now looking for it... too bad. Some movies are truly spoiled by "spoilers", but see it anyway. It's flat-out brilliant.

And "Visitor Q"? What can I say except I've never seen a "family values movie" (which arguably is exactly what it is) that contains quite this much corpse-fucking, incest, and bucket after bucket of bodily fluids and wastes. A peculiar little flick, and positively hilarious... plus, it promotes family values. How can you lose?
 

JonathonSan

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Feb 13, 2003
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I guess my "Texas Chainsaw Massacre" comment is based on the movie "feel". Ichi was by far more gory and visibly violent, but I didn't feel the menace and "real" contempt for life quite like I did in TCM. The very first killing in TCM was very unnearving, and not just because it was a surprise...it was the brutality...cringe inducing. Thanks for the heads up on these...I have "Audition" and "Fudoh" at waiting to be viewed and "Happiness of the Katakuris" and "Visitor Q" in my netflix queue.

As for the edited "Dead or Alive"...sigh...I hang my head in shame...I should have known better.

Jonathon
 

Rich Malloy

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I actually have no idea what was/wasn't cut from DOA (I liked it, but I prefer Miike's non-yakuza movies).

In case you can't tell, my favorites are (1) Audition (IMO his masterpiece thusfar); (2) Visitor Q (his most extreme film); (3) The Happiness of the Katakuris (probably the funniest, but I may have laughed a bit harder at some of the scenes/line in "Q"). "Ichi" was the first yakuza film by Miike that I really took a liking to.
 

JonathonSan

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Feb 13, 2003
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Well, I watched "Fudoh: The New Generation" and "Happiness of the Katakuris" this weekend. First off, let me say that "Happiness" was one wacky movie. The first musical number had me wide eyed with disbelief...it was so odd and out of place, but hugely entertaining. The son and all of his Marital Arts poses were cracking me up. Highly recommended to those who enjoy a truly bizarre romp. On a side note, the video quality of that movie was stunning. The filmed live action parts were a bit washed out, but this was fairly obviously the film, but the detail and smoothness of the image was excellent. The real standout was the claymation, the picture was so incredibly detailed on my projector. Blows away most of the Hollywood stuff I get on DVD.

Now for "Fudoh"...another yakuza film, but for some reason it entertained me a bit more than "Dead or Alive" and even "Ichi." A fun movie with some really bizarre stuff going on. Not as gory as his other yakuza stuff that I have seen, but the audacity of the film was right on for me. For anyone who has seen it, the scene between the blow dart girl and the teacher...WOW...really bizarre...but cool anyway. As for the picture quality in "Fudoh", it sucked. Non-anamorphic, very low budget looking, with artifacts everywhere, but it still didn't take me out of the movie.

I am waiting to watch Audition with my fiancé, who knows nothing about it...I'll post again soon with my thoughts.
 

BarryS

Second Unit
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Aug 1, 2002
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My video store has nearly all of Miike's major films, so I'm lucky. Anyone who is seriously interested in film should see something by Miike. He's one of the most dynamic filmmakers working today. Once again, I recommend Audition to anyone, and Ichi The Killer to Tarantino fans. Love the Kill Bill-style violence.
 

JonathonSan

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Feb 13, 2003
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Well, I recently finished watching two other Miike films; "Audition" and "Visitor Q". What can I say...the more I watch Miike's films, the more his style grows on me. I thouroughly enjoyed Visitor Q...probably my favorite film of his so far. The scene with the wet corpse
was so bizzare yet so funny. Very highly recommended for those that like bizzare with some serious taboo stuff in it. Also pretty feel good by the end...well, in a wierd sort of way.

Audition was very different from anything else Miike that I've seen. Very restrained. Masterfully executed. Has me scratching my head still...I'm not sure I got the ending...I have my theories, but it is still a bit fuzzy. Very good movie though.

Speaking of wierd endings...anybody care to share thoeries or explinations for Ichi? That one blew right over my head. Maybe I need to watch it again.

Jonathon
 

Kachi Khatri

Second Unit
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Oct 29, 2002
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Jay
I may be late in the game but I just viewed "Audition" last night. Wow! Great movie...just amazing!

I felt a clear distinction between what was reality and what was fantasy
and the ability of the film to so effortlessly play with our emotions is what made it extremely intense, unnerving and powerful.

My thoughts on the ending:

The fantasy sequence during the torture scenes is Aoyama's attempt to escape an intolerable and painful reality. At this point the audience is hoping that this is all a dream, and the director skilfully toys with us on this hope, before forcing us to accept that the nightmare is real.


This is what makes the shock of this movie so effective.

Like others who've seen it, I too, strongly recommend this movie.
 

JonathonSan

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Feb 13, 2003
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On Ichi
What idication was there that the body was Ichi's father in the film...also, what was up with the shot of Kahihari(sp) in the bath house type thing smoking?
I think I really need to watch this again.

On "Audition" That was definately one of my theories, but that doesn't explain the wierdness with his co-worker giving him head, then Asami as a child...not to mention Shigeharu talking to his wife at the restaurant. That happened before the torture started, but that could have been the drug in the drink talkin'. What about the jumps in time while at dinner to be filled in later on...dream or not. Another theory I have heard is that they are indeed bad dreams because of his guilt for tricking her as well as the misgivings of his friend added to the weirdness surrounding her and her past. Shrugs.

I'm usually pretty good about piecing together disjointed and trippy type films, but this one is pretty confusing. Maybe it was meant to be that way, but I am in total agreement about the effects of the visuals...masterful.
 

ericLee

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Oct 15, 2002
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135
You could put me in the "I just don't get it catagory". I watched Audition and ichi. Audition was a like a 4/10 for me and ichi the killer was for me like 2/10. I watched ichi the cut version and i was like, WTF is this.
It was the cut version so it was tammer but thats not relly what tuned me off it was just so pointless. Audition was kinda borring. Wow she kills people, and she has mental problems, so why is this supposed to be great? It wasn't relly scarry or suspensful, You kinda knew what was going to happen by the middle of the movie. Bad purchse for ichi, I paid $10 bucks to see rape, battery, murder, torture. tell me again why this is supposed to be entertaining? For me it certinly was not humorus at all.
 

Jason Seaver

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Jun 30, 1997
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9,303
Audition was kinda borring. Wow she kills people, and she has mental problems, so why is this supposed to be great? It wasn't relly scarry or suspensful, You kinda knew what was going to happen by the middle of the movie.
Well, part of the problem is that it's being sold as a thriller. When I saw it, it was just pitched as coming from one of Japan's most notable directors and having a twist in the middle; when the weird shit started happening, it shocked people in the theater. I had a hard time watching the last reel from all the walkouts.

I try to recreate that by telling people it's a romantic comedy before they watch it; most of the first half could actually work as one. But I think Audition is, in a way, sort of like Shall We Dance?, in that while it's not completely specific to gender relations in Japan, it's not quite universal, either. The basic thrust of the story, to me, is that while many men make noise about considering women equals, what many of them want in a relationship is what the main character seeks in Audition; someone interesting but not as interesting as him, who has or had great potential but is now defined as "his girlfriend" or "his wife"... someone who stimulates him but doesn't outshine him. It's an ideal that men don't say out loud much any more, but still often lurks close to the surface.

But it's not a natural state to be that kind of person. One has to be broken, through tragedy or abuse. And that can create a whole new set of psychological problems, especially now that women are publicly being encouraged to take their rightful place in society, to not take this sort of thing any more.

I think Audition is probably Miike's best movie, the one which has had the most thought put into it, and has the most to say. But it's not the thriller it's often sold as. It's a harsh, allegorical drama that disguises itself as a romantic comedy for the first half of its runtime.
 

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