Klipsch vs. Axiom, re: brightness

Discussion in 'Speakers' started by Ray_C, Jan 30, 2004.

  1. Ray_C

    Ray_C Stunt Coordinator

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    Hello All,

    I've had the Klipsch Reference series RC-25, RB-25's, and RS-25's for several months now. I initially liked the upper detail and forwardness of the RB-25's, but rather than get used to and more comfortable with them, they've become to grating and sharp for extended listening. They actually fill the room nicely and sound okay from 10 feet away, but for my seated listening position, about seven feet, their just too sharp for music. For 5.1 movie listening they're much less so.

    I prefer fairly forward-sounding speakers, rather than 'laid-back', but the RB-25's are just too much. I was considering a set of Axiom M22's (maybe even a full surround set). Many have cited that the Axioms are bright. Has anyone compared them to Klipsch Reference speakers?
     
  2. Michael R Price

    Michael R Price Screenwriter

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    Before you try to replace the speakers, have you tried placing them closer to the wall or rotating them so they're facing straight ahead instead of pointing at you? Those are controlled directivity horns which have noticeably less treble off-axis; and they may be designed with a bass deficiency which is counteracted by placement near other surfaces. You could also try using a higher crossover on your subwoofer (100Hz?) to reduce strain on the speakers.
     
  3. Mike Carter

    Mike Carter Agent

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    Many people say Klipsch are bright but as a Klipsch owner since 1977 (various models) I totally do not agree. I would love to hear Axiom speakers since the direct internet deal looks good and the speaker are very nice looking. I am a professional drummer and I will tell you Klipsch Referance series usually sound very life like.
    I have been listening to many speaker lately and will tell you Dyna Audio are the brightest speakers i have ever heard. I asked the sales guy to turn the treble down and he said everything was flat plus there was no tone controls on the pre-amp. WOW!
     
  4. Ray_C

    Ray_C Stunt Coordinator

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    Thanks for the replies, guys. Yes Michael, I have tried pointing them straight out (I have them that way now), and it does help the issue a bit, but there's still a very 'cutting' quality to them. On some selected tracks, like on the Nora Jones CD, there are times where I feel like the vocals are trying to slice my head off. When the speakers were 'toed-in', I think I was flirting with brain damage. I'm using a Denon AVR2803 as a pre/pro into a Marantz MM9000 amp. Maybe not the warmest source, but I'm happy with that part of the set-up, so without going too mellow on the speakers, or too expensive (similar price range), I'd like to smooth things out a bit. I was even considering getting a dedicated pair of speakers just for stereo listening, but I don't have the space to place them optimally except on the walls. The good thing about Axiom is in dealing direct, they have a very consumer-friendly return policy, so it's at least worth an audition for a week or so.
     
  5. Brandon D

    Brandon D Agent

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    wow. not trying to flame or anything, but i'm sure the preamp was the one torching those dyne's. Dynaudio has a reputation for being super lifelike and neutral. I've owned and listened to many, many of their products and "bright" is not one of thier characteristics - transparent and neutral are words I usually associate with dyne's.
     
  6. Shane Martin

    Shane Martin Producer

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    Are you talking about Dynaudio or DYNA AUDIO? The former are in no way bright. The later sound like something you can buy from the back of a white van.

    As for Klipsch and Axiom, they're both bright(to me and very fatiguing).

    Ray_C: I'd go find a B&W dealer. I find them to be "forward" but not bright. I can't remember ever being fatigued listening to B&W's but I didn't care for the forward sound(you just might).
     
  7. Mike Carter

    Mike Carter Agent

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    Brandon D..no flame taken at all, just a friendly discussion! The speakers were Dynaudio, all one word, I listen to them through Parasound. The highs had some serious bite/grain to them and there was no/zero/nada mid bass to them. This made the Dynaudio speakers sound thin I also listened to JM Labs Electra 936 &946, McIntosh and B&W 801's and they were much more life like with better mid bass, mids and highs. The Paradigm sounded a lot like the Dynaudio's except the Paradigm's did not bite as much on the high end.

    The salesman said he did not think I would like the Dynaudio's because they are more of an audiophile type of speaker and not as life like as a musician would like to hear in a speaker.
     
  8. Brandon D

    Brandon D Agent

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    hrmmmmm....

    well congratulations - you are perhaps the first person to think dyne's are bright [​IMG]

    The obvious answer is that your ear is more used to a forward sound. Forward is usually associated with bright. I will conclude that it is probably not likely they sounded "thin" if they had a smokin top end, as they would be anything but that. I don't know what to tell you other than trust your ears.

    One thing that really strikes me funny is that your salesman said you wouldn't like the dyne's because they are more audiophile. If you're are in deed a professional musician I would be looking for a set of speakers that truly reproduced what the recording was supposed to get across. I dunno, just my observations.



    Not to totally discredit anyone or anything, what music were you using to audition the dynes.
     
  9. Michael R Price

    Michael R Price Screenwriter

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    Ray,

    Wow that is unfortunate, it must just be a reflective room. If the Klipsches have a serious harshness problem then you may want to try tone controls, room treatments, or drastically different (perhaps larger) speakers.
     
  10. Mike Carter

    Mike Carter Agent

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    Brandon, I listened to a great disc from a band called Incognito it has awesome percussion, drums, horn section keys and bass and female vocal, then some extremely well recroded live jazz (drums, 2 sax, trombone and trumpet) electric bass, 3 doors down, Metallic's Unforgiven, Mighty Sam McClain and some acoutic guitar and female vocal cd that the salesman had. The acoutic guitar on the cd sound natural and very much like an acoustic guitar with steel stings should sound on the JM Labs but the Dynaudio was super bringht in the 8k and up range. Sorry Dynaudio guys but that's how I heard it.

    My wife a friend and I went to audition B&W 801's and Klipsch RF7's again today...the wife even picked the Klipsch. We listened to the Klipsch with Krell amps and Meridian CD and pre-pro.
     
  11. Ray_C

    Ray_C Stunt Coordinator

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    Yes, the RF-7's are a much different animal than anything in the reference lineup...but I don't have the space or budget for such massive drivers. I did a little rearranging and set my speakers about 7 ft apart, as opposed to the 4-1/2 like before, and even toed them in. A major difference than before (for the better), but I still feel that the RB-25's are too edgy. I play in a band, too, Mike, and I don't even like standing right in front of my guitar amp. I always try to place it as far back from me as possible (a 22-watt Fender Deluxe Reverb...not exactly a behemoth). But I also do a lot of editing and sound work for films, and many times I've been editing sound two feet a way from a pair of Yamaha NS-10's (which can be the brightest things on Earth at times), but never felt the kind of listening fatigue that I'm experiencing with the Klipschs sutting seven feet away. At a distance of about 12 feet, I can see why many like the 'live' characteristics of these speakers, but we're talking 'front-row' live. Even with our four-piece blues band in a small-to-medium sized club, I wouldn't want to be the people seated way up front with that snare and cymbals, and a couple of Fender amps wailing away...and we don't even play that loud. Maybe it's the horns, I don't know. I guess I'll give the Axioms a spin next week.
     
  12. Mike Carter

    Mike Carter Agent

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    Hi Ray, PLEASE give your take on what the Axiom's sound like especially since you have Klipsch speakers and can give a truthful and honest opinion.

    I guess to me I just like the live impact, air and realness Klipsch RF7's have and I thought the B&W 801's very much lacked dynamics. I could not hear a $8,000 differance between the RF7's and 801's.

    I will be putting my Klipsch Ref 7 system in a room with a 12' cofered ceiling, and 20x23'. I will be sitting approx 16 feet away from the RF7's too.

    Ray I work for DW drums & Paiste cymbals so I know your drummer has heard of these brands. I travel a lot through out the southeast. You & your band do not happen to be in a southern state do you? I'd love to come out to a club and hear you guys.
    Thanks!, Mike
     

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