Klipsch Synergy setup? Rear center speakers

Discussion in 'Speakers' started by Jeremy K, Mar 12, 2005.

  1. Jeremy K

    Jeremy K Stunt Coordinator

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    I am planning on purchasing some Klipsch speakers. I am going to go with the Synergy C-3 center channel, two F-3's up front, and two S-3's for the right and left surround. What is recommended for the rear center? Two S-3's, one S-3, or another center channel, the C-3 or 2 or 1? What is going to give me the best sound? As long as I stay in the Synergy line, money doesn't matter. I am going to be hooking them up to a Yamaha 5760 receiver right now, but would like to upgrade the receiver later, so if the speakers are too much for the receiver it doesn't matter. I don't think these will be, but if they are. Also, I have a Paradigm PDR-10 sub, is the Klipsch KSW-12 going to be a lot better? It is a fairly decent size room. Also since I have the Paridigms now, I have the CC-170 center channel and 4 Atoms, should I just get the Klipsch speakers for the front, and use some combination of the Paradigms in the rear? And if so, what? The center in the center rear, or all 4 atoms in the back?

    Long post, but any help would be much apprecated. Thanks

    Synergy link: http://www.klipsch.com/product/list....=1258&type=All
     
  2. Himanshu_S

    Himanshu_S Stunt Coordinator

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    I have similar klipsch setup except I have the 5790 receiver. I don't have the rear center but if I do decide to go with one, I would probably choose C2 since the rear center is rarely used. In your case, money doesn't matter so you should pick C3.

    I also had the KSW-12 sub but it didn't impress me at all so I returned it. Now I have SVS PB-10 and I really like it. If you can't afford to get an SVS, I would say wait until you can. Everytime I watch a movie, I am amazed at my sub's power.
     
  3. Jeremy K

    Jeremy K Stunt Coordinator

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    OK, thanks for the info. I wasn't sure about putting the center channel speaker in the rear, but if that is best that is what I'll do. Thanks for the info on the sub too, I get a real good discount at work, so I am tempted to get the sub also, but you don't think it's worth it? How do you think the Paridigm PDR-10 and the Klipsch KSW-12 compare to each other.

    I will look at the SVS though too thanks.
     
  4. Wayne Ernst

    Wayne Ernst Cinematographer

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    Why stay with the Synergy series? While they do sound good, going with the Reference series instead, can be just as economical. Plus, the Reference sound should be a bit better.

    The F3s run about $900 a pair @ Best Buy. A pair of RF-35s list at $500, each. However, most dealers can give a discount to make the price more competitive than the Synergy series.
     
  5. JohnPap

    JohnPap Auditioning

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    I second Wayne's suggestion. If you're set on Synergy, a pair of B-3s would be the matching rears, unless you want to splurge on another pair of F-3s.
     
  6. Himanshu_S

    Himanshu_S Stunt Coordinator

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    It seems that you work at retail place, most likely Best Buy. If so, the Synergy series are your best option considering that they will give you a lot more for LOT less. As far as the sub, I can't say how it compares with the other sub but I will say this: I had a choice of keeping the KSW-12 which I paid $270(employee discount w/tax) or spend 200(w/shipping) more and upgrade to SVS PB-10. As you know I chose the latter. The thing you have to keep in mind is that if you get the Klipsch sub now, later you will want more low bass. And that time you will likely to spend another $400 or so for a good sub. Why not just get it in the first place and spend your money wisely?
     
  7. Jeremy K

    Jeremy K Stunt Coordinator

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    OK, thanks again for the suggestions. I will follow your advice Himanshu, and go for a better sub, I will probably have to wait a little longer for the sub, but I have the Paradigm sub in the meantime.

    As for getting the reference series, yes, like Himanshu said, because of an Employee program I can get the Synergy series for a much better deal. Thanks for the suggestion though Wayne.

    JohnPap, it sounds tempting to get the F-3's all the way around, and I'd probably do it except for the room they are going in wouldn't work well with thise bigger speakers inthe back. I could maybe rearrange and make this work though. Would that be a good way to go? Would I get noticably better sound being only the surround anyway?
     
  8. SethH

    SethH Cinematographer

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    I would just run two of the Atoms for the rear center channel.
     
  9. Jeremy K

    Jeremy K Stunt Coordinator

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    If I run two Atoms for the center rear, shouldn't I run two atoms for the rear surrounds also. So that the rear is all timbre matched or whatever?

    I like the idea of trying the Klipsch with the Dispersion Surround Technology. I have always wanted to get some dipole speaers, and I am thinking this will be similar. Someone correct me if I am wrong about this.

    Thanks for the suggestion.
     
  10. Himanshu_S

    Himanshu_S Stunt Coordinator

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    Using two F3's are definitely an overkill for using as Surrounds. To me, that is a waste of money. Spend that extra money towards the sub and/or center channel. I am not sure about using Atoms since I haven't heard but from what others have said, they might also work.
     
  11. Jeremy K

    Jeremy K Stunt Coordinator

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    Yeah, I figured it was overkill. I will save the money towards the sub. I like the SVS you were recommending, I also see a lot of good about the HSU subs:

    http://www.hsuresearch.com/

    Thanks again for all your help.
     
  12. JohnPap

    JohnPap Auditioning

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    If your listening is strictly HT, the 4 Atoms as surrounds and R-surrounds may be fine. Best way to decide would be to bring in the Synergy L/C/R and listen for yourself or, even better, bring everything in and listen by swapping S/SRs between the Atoms and then Synergies.

    The suggestion about the F-3s in the back was strictly for 5-chan music listening but then, having S-3s would require to you to swap S & SRs. That's one of the reasons I don't like bi/dipoles at the sides, except for a dedicated HT room and then when you're able to place them properly.
     
  13. SethH

    SethH Cinematographer

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    Hsu is also a very good sub manufacturer. In the under-$500 range most around here prefer the SVS PB10, but others may prefer the Hsu offerings. Either of these will be much better choices than the Klipsch sub.
     
  14. Himanshu_S

    Himanshu_S Stunt Coordinator

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    Yes HSU is probably the only good competition against the SVS. However, please don't start another SVS vs. HSU thread. Personally, I am tired of those threads. They have no point and in the end people just forget what the original poster had asked. I am not trying to push you to buy SVS but I can tell you that I wasn't dissapointed with my purchase. In fact, I enjoy it everyday!

    Also, I actually forgot to mention the difference in specs between the Klipsch 12" vs. the SVS PB-10. This should help you at least give you an idea of what you're getting for $200 more.


    KSW-12 Specs:
    Driver size: 12"
    Power rating: 105 watts RMS
    Frequency response: 22-100Hz
    Weight: 35 lbs.


    PB-10:
    Driver size: 10"
    Power rating: 300 watts RMS
    Frequency response: 20-100Hz. It has actually been tested to go even lower but that depends on your room acoustics.
    Weight: 60 lbs. Almost twice as the Klipsch.

    You choose.
     
  15. Wayne Ernst

    Wayne Ernst Cinematographer

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    I've given this thread a bit of thought for the day. I've owned the Klipsch RF-35/RC-35 speakers before - albeit, for a short period of time. They provided about the most even soundstage that I've (IMHO) have ever heard out of speakers.

    Now, with that being said, let me offer some suggestions:

    1) When listening to the demo stations @ Best Buy, the F3s have got to be about the best sounding speaker, with the exception of some of the Athena models, that BB sells.

    2) The good listening experience of the F3s is what leads people to lean towards those speakers; and, I think this is quite a fine way to remember your listening experience.

    However ...

    3) In the real world of listening, I've grown accostomed to having my bass provided by a good subwoofer. (I had twin Shivas, but am now moving to a pair of IB subs from Acoustic Elegance.)

    4) I've found that I'd prefer - in the mix of things - something more along the lines of the RF-25 or F-3 from Klipsch, with their 6.5" drivers.

    Why, you ask? Well, when you get everything situated in your home environment - and your gear has been well broken in, I think the sound of the RF-25 speakers might be more appreciable. The RF-35 and F-3s with their (2) 8" drivers make for almost too much bass coming out of the front left/right speakers, and could mean that some of the dialogue in a movie could suffer a bit.

    Easing off on the bass a bit - and having the sub do more of what it's best at, might be the best choice. Sure, you could set the receiver's crossover point to 80Hz, but then, why even purchase the RF-35s or F-3s, if you were not going to use all the bass they could provide.

    Ideally, the RF-25s/F-2s with a receiver capable of crossing things over at 60 - 70Hz might be more ideal. Unfortunately, the Pioneer Elite only does 50Hz, 80Hz and some other higher frequencies. I'm assuming the 1014 is quite similar.

    Just my .02 [​IMG]
     
  16. Jeremy K

    Jeremy K Stunt Coordinator

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    OK, thanks again for all the good info. I will take all this into consideration before making a decision.

    For the sub, from what you guys recommended and I have read elsewhere, I think I will save up a little for the SVS. I added the info for the Paradigm I have now for comparision. It seems to me that it would be similar to the Klipsch anyway.

    KSW-12 Specs:
    Driver size: 12"
    Power rating: 105 watts RMS
    Frequency response: 22-100Hz
    Weight: 35 lbs.

    PB-10:
    Driver size: 10"
    Power rating: 300 watts RMS
    Frequency response: 20-100Hz. It has actually been tested to go even lower but that depends on your room acoustics.
    Weight: 60 lbs. Almost twice as the Klipsch.

    PDR-10
    Driver size: 10"
    Power rating: 120 watts RMS
    Low Frequency Extension: 27 Hz (DIN)*
    Weight: 28 lb

    And Wayne, I will think about the F-2's if that might be better once I get a good sub. The sub I have now, seems to me anyway, to be inadequate for my room. Iam using a 13 ft wide by 16 ft long corner of the room. The entire room is about 20 ft wide by 28 ft deep.

    I am going to have to look into the crossover and all that. I am not that familier with that stuff. You talk about a Pioneer, I have a Yamaha 5760, so I will have to see what that can do for this. If I can figure it out anyway[​IMG] .


    I really appreciate all the help everyone. Thanks
     
  17. Wayne Ernst

    Wayne Ernst Cinematographer

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    Jeremy,

    The Yamaha HTR-5760 is a very good receiver. I had that receiver before I purchased my Pioneer 54TX. I did a mini-review on the 5760 in the receiver section of this forum about a year ago.

    The Pioneer 54TX took me a bit longer to get used to it. The Pioneer had so many features: MCACC, hi-bit sampling, etc., etc. I had to get used to all of these options before I could set my system up properly to appreciate it. Now, however, I'm finally satisfied with a truly great receiver - one that I don't intend to sell anytime soon - even though I've owned 7 receivers over a 3-year period. [​IMG]
     
  18. JohnPap

    JohnPap Auditioning

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    That is true for all subs. Placement is very important. You should place your sub at the listening position, play some LF music or tones and walk arround the room listening for where bass sounds the best. Put the sub there. Using an SPL meter during this process, helps.
     
  19. Himanshu_S

    Himanshu_S Stunt Coordinator

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    I am not sure how much of the price difference is between the F2's and F3's with the employee purchase program. If it's not a lot, then I wouldn't cheap out on the F3's. If it is, then by all means consider the F2's as well. The F3's are really great for 2channel stereo music listening.

    About the Pioneer vs. Yamaha, I tested Yamaha 5790 and the much recommended Pioneer 1014. I did not like the sound of the Pioneer 1014 so I went with the Yamaha. For receiver, you just have to listen for yourself. Also, as Wayne mentioned, it might take sometime to get used to the Pioneer sound which I didn't give it to the Pioneer I tested, so my opinion is just well my opinion.

    JohnPap, I'm sure you are right that it is true for all subs.
    But I noted it because one of the member posted the review where it went down to 18hz. I can't seem to find that link at the moment. But even if you take out that statement, the SVS does go lower than other subs.

    Wayne, considering that he's getting the F3's for REALLY cheap compare to the reference series speakers, I don't think the extra cost is worth to upgrade to the reference series.
     
  20. JohnPap

    JohnPap Auditioning

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    I didn't mean to imply that the SVS was over-hyped, just making a general statement. I don't think that in the $400 range there's a sub that can go deeper while remaining flat. SVS specs the PB10-ISD 18-100Hz +-3dB. Secrets measured it 19-150Hz +-1dB anechoically and 15-100Hz +-5dB (average) in-room.

    Impressive numbers aside, the best sub for you is the one within your budget that sounds best in your room with your setup.

    PS. Can't post URLs yet, replace "dot" with ".":

    www dot hometheaterhifi.com/volume_11_4/svs-pb10-subwoofer-10-2004.html
     

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