iTunes, Apple ultimately in trouble? (1 Viewer)

[Lee Scoggins]

I think you have to give Apple some credit for the circuit board design, the box layout and the overall high level of design aesthetic. IBM did invent the chip but I betcha a group of Apple engineers had a lot of input into the G5 implementation and possibly even the chip design.

 

[Seth_L]

Not really. Innovate means to introduce something new. They didn't come up with something new (invent) any of those things I mentioned.

 

[Seth_L]

I wouldn't go that far. IBM and Motorola are responsible for that chip, not Apple. Apple just gets to use it and make false claims about it's performance.

 

[Walter Kittel]

http://www.barefeats.com/g5op.html

- Walter.

 

[Scott H]

First, I'm not a rabid Apple fan. Neither would I bash a company using erroneous information and skewed semantics. I am a pragmatric realist, thank you. And incidentally I have never owned a computer that used a Microsoft OS or Intel processor, and I've owned a lot of computers.

It is plainly clear that going round with you on these points would, in and of itself, be pointless. Nonetheless, Apple is synonymous with innovation. Your disputing that is just silly. Your point, mixed in with a lot of misinformation, seems to be analagous to saying that a Toyota Prius hybrid automobile is not innovative because Ford already made the Model T.

And to correct some of that misinformation (posted by another as well), Apple most certainly does deserve credit for the G5, and all other PowerPC processors, the most widely used embedded processor (telecommunications, space exploration, automobiles, PDVR, etc.). Please revisit computing history and chip development. Read about Apple bringing together Motorola and IBM in a joint development partnership that gave rise to the PowerPC, learn about the Somerset Design Center.


{In early 1991, a group of technical leaders from Apple, Motorola, and IBM began work to develop a sleeker and cleaner architecture with expanded function, using the POWER Architecture as a base}

from:
PowerPC Architecture
A High-Performance Architecture With A History
© IBM

 

[DavidLW]

Wrong again, it's the other way around. The technolgy code named "Firewire" was invented by Apple and the IEEE formed a committee to standardize that technology. Apple retained the "Firewire" trademark for it's version of "IEEE 1394". Once other companies adapt the technology they can call it what they want as long as it meets the "IEEE 1994" standard. (Sony call their's "ilink", most just refer to it by trade name). So IEEE 1394 is based on technology that Apple invented. The committe, that you think invented "Firewire", only got together to make the changes neccesary to form the "1394 standard".

And in anticipation of your next response

No, "Firewire" did not copy Intel's USB.

 

[Paul Bartlet]

I saw a TV movie on Steve Jobs and Gates. Think it was "Pirates of Silicon Valley".
S. Jobs got both "windows" and the "mouse" from xerox. Gates then in turn stole the "windows" from Jobs.

Both companys are guilty of this.

But, Apple has other troubles on the horizon with "iTunes / iPod".

Link Removed



Note, the Beatles Won this case back then, now Apple Computers "Is" in the Music business. I see big doo doo for Apple in the near future.

 

[Scott H]

Paul, that's a over-simplistic generalization of Jobs' application (read innovation) of the concepts he saw at PARC and how it was presented in an entertainment TV movie.

And what existed at PARC was hardly the windows environment brought forth by Jobs, but far more basic concepts of a GUI. Yes, Jobs absolutely ran with those concepts and brought a radically new user-friendly OS to the masses (read innovation). The reason MS Windows exists today is because John Sculley licensed Mac technology for Windows 1.0, but apparently overlooked a clause in the contract which allowed MS to continue to copy Mac elements in it's future OSs.

Anyway, the Apple Computer and Apple Music (now Apple Corps) story is not new, with a legal agreement dating back many years from which a few fights have arisen. Even this chapter is many months old now. If you are familiar with the Mac OS system alert sounds, there is one called Sosumi. Myth has it that was directed at Apple Music (so su mi; i.e. so sue me) after they filed suit when Apple Computer first bundled microphones with Macs.

Doo doo in Apple's future? Apple has never had a stronger product line-up, stronger technology, or been a stronger company. The Apple Corps. issue won't raise Jobs' blood pressure at all. Not even a bump in the road. It's a lawsuit. It is widely reported that Apple has $4.5-5 Billion in cash.


Incidentally, are the Pixar animated films not innovative? They certainly are. Credit Jobs.

And to repeat a fact, of which the repeated contradiction pretty much removes any credibility, Apple invented FireWire. And many other things as well, with countless patents for award winning industrial design innovations.

And then there's OS X...

 

[Seth--L]

The meaning of employment has been purposely watered down over the years. Many people that are inbetween jobs, but have taken up a part time job that does not include benefits, overtime and does little more than pay for tonight's meal are considered as "employed" for the sake of government statistics. Whenever these stats are produced, little thought is put into the difference between a job that you can support yourself with over the long-haul as opposed to the short.


I can't believe that people are having a 5th grade Apple vs. PC debate. But I will say that I was the only person in my film production class this semester that chose to edit on a PC running XP pro with Avid Xpress Pro instead of Final Cut Pro 4 on either a G4 or G5, and I was the only person out of 8 not to ever crash, freeze or drop frames (among other problems).

 

[Patrick Larkin]

some small apple innovations ....

- The graphical interface. yes, jobs ripped off PARC but innovated far beyond making the first commercial point and click interface (YEARS before Microsoft released the still clunky DOS shell, Windows.)
- Quicktime - A huge innovation. So huge Microsoft ripped off parts of the code,
- The Newton - Again, YEARS before Palm with handwriting recognition unmatched on even today's Palms.
- The Quicktake - I had a digital camera YEARS before the big box stores sold digital cameras.
- Laser printing - Way back in college, everyone went to mac labs because they had laser printing! Apple had networkable laser printers before Windows could network at all.
- Networking - I'm not sure the first time you could hook twoor more Windows machines together (probably Windows for Workgroups...) but it was WELL after Apple was providing EASY networking on all machines.

All of this is Apple innovation. In some cases, it involved taking existing technology and innovating real commercial products. In other cases, its the work of top notch engineers pushing the envelope...


As far as Apple being in trouble, as long as Jobs is there, I doubt it.

 

[Seth--L]

Oh come on. That's pulling straws. Handwriting recognition using a square inch tablet is a joke. That's why a BlackBerry has a built in mini keyboard.

 

[JerryLA]

I don't see Apple going away in my lifetime. I've been in the graphic arts business for over 30 years and until a few years ago Mac was the only choice. When my wife and I opened our own business 6 years ago we were forced to have Macs. After getting acquainted with the difference from PC to Mac.. I enjoy using them. The OS9 operating system was a joke. I think the jump to OSX was the best and smartest thing Apple ever did. One think I can't understand is this: Every die hard Mac-addict I've ever know has a relationship with their computer that seems a bit strange. They don't seem to view their Mac as a tool... it's like a child or something. Most I've know take great offense and even the mention of that dirty 2 letter word..PC. Apple has a winner with OSX and the new G5 is a sweet setup. But that's just my opinion.. I could be wrong!

 

[DavidLW]

Actually you're the only one having a 5th grade debate. The rest of us are merely stating the facts at a college level.

 

[Scott H]

I work in film production on a different level, with all due respect. I have participated or been privy to the creation of countless DVDs discussed on this board. I have controlled Arri motion pitcure cameras with Apple Powerbooks. I edited on Amigas in film school. My first computer was an Atari 800.

There is Apple hardware involved in the creation of the majority of DVD titles. Most editing I encounter in Los Angeles, from motion picture to comercial television to DVD supplements is done using Avid software on Apple hardware. Final Cut, always popular with the low budget crowd has matured and is being implemented in high-end situations more and more (clients love it because they can bring in their own FC projects from their home/small prod company post environments). Avid Xpress on Apple hardware is actually more popular among most of my professional acquaintences right now.

Anyway, the Apple vs. PC issue is waning, to say the least. I'm not debating that with you here. I'm defending the absurd claim that Apple is not innovative. That's comical. I don't care what you use, and I won't bash it. But I will correct misinformation, when so inclined, and substantiate my comments. What is there to debate regarding PCs? There's OS X and there's Linux distros. There's Moto and IBM PowerPC and there's AMD. Don't know of any other viable options Would you like to hear how Apple has assisted with AMDs development and release of their 64-bit processor. It's got to do with Apple processor innovations and partnerships. Let me know...

 

[Brian-W]

Tell that to the MULTI-MILLION users that own Palm Pilots or Pocket PCs instead of the 1% of the PDA market that the Blackberry has.

Sorry, you've totally surpassed the point of being ludicrous. In fact, with a statement like the one I'm quoting you on, you really have no idea what you're talking about.

 

[Seth--L]

And that's because most people who own something like a Palm don't really need one. When you have to actually write sentences quickly because you're frequently sending email from your PDA, you're going to want to do it with one that has a keyboard instead of a touch pad exclusively.

Scott H.,

My point is this: Originally I was going to edit on a Mac because everyone says you can only do digital video editing on a Mac. I talked to some "industry" people and they said my PC would be fine and to use Avid. Ironically, everything worked better for me and my PC than people using the Mac. (I did use Avid on a MAC with no problems).

 

[RolandDeschain]

Boy you really don't know anything do you? None of this would have started if you hadn't made the moronic statement that you did.

And FYI, Apple takes tremendous pride in their innovation and industrial design. Jonathan Ive has won numerous awards for his work at Apple. But Apple doesn't innovate right? Tell us again how Apple didn't invent FireWire?

 

[Ken Seeber]

Roland, is there a reason you feel the need to attack other members in all your posts? Every post I've ever seen from you has been hostile to the point of being childish.

 

[Seth_L]

Maybe because he is a child?

 

[JerryLA]

I think any company that can make a comeback as Apple has should be applauded. But..... until Macs are more affordable they will never see the mainstream as PC's have. The cost of a new G5 is outrageous as is the upper end PC line. Where you can get an entry level PC for about $500 or less you can't step into a Mac for anywhere close to that. I certainly don't know anything about video editing but for Graphic design the Mac is the best bet. For my own personal use I prefer a PC. I'm not sure why Apple can't make an affordable unit for entry level users if they want to become more mainstream. Maybe that is a market they don't really care to jump into.