Isolated scores on region 2 DVD

Discussion in 'DVD' started by andySu, Jul 27, 2006.

  1. andySu

    andySu Cinematographer

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    Will this work, now I have done a mixing course many years ago, and have a little understanding of how it works, but it’s also simple mixing techniques and using the facilities to blend these tracks together, compression may be applied to some parts of the mix, to allow certain sounds to fit in without something giving. Once you have reached (0db) there is no other place to go! And compressing the music in certain parts is quite ludicrous; the composer must be thinking the same thing can they fix it so the dynamics fit into this without cutting back on the music mix.

    Now I have looked at one such matter, and it’s timing is crucial, most of the DVD films that we have on the shelves, have what’s called as an (isolated score) this is playing what is heard in the (DME) mix, dialogue music and effects, now the music mix has a bit more tone and richness that is missing in the (DME) mix, so how do you get the two to play similarly playing speeds, and even if you do, there will be some type of errors that will crop up, like the (laying change) of the DVD, also the disc must be cleaned before playing, if there’s any dirt or dry skin stuck to the surface of the disc will curse errors in the timing when the music cuts in. So you may have just said to yourself how do I get the music mix to playback if I’m only using one DVD?

    Well two of the same feature will be needed, another Dolby digital decoder and more amplifiers and loudspeakers equalizers and sub bass loudspeakers, oh yes it does sound like a lot, but that’s the only way, if there was a way to trick the programming on the DVD to play the output of the other language track on the DVD, then sync will no longer be a problem, nor would you need to buy two DVD’s, but you will still need the same amount of Dolby digital decoder amplifiers and loudspeakers equalizers and sub bass loudspeakers.


    Twister, what a mix done by Shawn Murphy, it’s a pity it doesn’t measure up to the levels of a tornado, but which would be the loudest, the orchestra or the tornado?

    Well I’m placing my bet on the tornado, depending on how close you are to it, or the 1812, with it’s cannon firing slamming in the room, so why do we have to put up with the scores weakness due to the sound effects, we would like to hear and feel all that is layered onto the final mix without limiting one of the tracks.

    Here is a list of DVD’s that have an isolated score mix on them.

    #1 Glory Dolby 4.0
    2# Superman the Movie Dolby 5.0
    3# Blade II Dolby 5.1
    4# Alien Dolby 2.0
    5# The Sound of Music Dolby 2.0 surround
    6# Hollow Man Dolby 5.1
    7# The Witches of Eastwick Dolby 5.1
    8# Planet of the Apes Dolby 2.0 surround
    9# Contact Dolby 5.1
    10# Mars Attacks Dolby 5.1
    11# Beatle Juice Dolby 5.1
    12# The Last of the Mohicans Dolby 5.1
    13# Amadeus
    14# Bicentennial Man Dolby 5.1
    15# L.A. Confidential Dolby 5.1

    That seams like a small list out of the 900 films that I have, well a lot of them don’t offer has much as the brainstorming around the table than one might think!

    Now there is one other problem, some of the isolated score tracks have an audio commentary, which fades out as soon as the score cuts in, or slightly afterwards so, if there was a way to make this work, hands on will be needed, to fade the isolated music track in at the right moment.

    There are some films that need an isolated score, or at least some EQ on the lower end of the mix.
     
  2. Steve Christou

    Steve Christou Long Member

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    Here's a list of isolated scores I have in my 1600+ DVD collection. I'm multi-regional so many of these are R1.

    It's a shame they rarely do music-only tracks now, being a lifelong soundtrack collector this feature was one of the big draws for me getting into DVD back in the late 90's. [​IMG]


    Adventures of Robin Hood
    Alien
    Any Given Sunday
    Assault on Precinct 13
    Bad Boys
    Beetlejuice
    Ben-Hur (1959)
    Bicentennial Man
    Blade
    Blade II
    Bridge on the River Kwai ,The
    Bug's Life ,A
    Cell ,The
    Contact
    Corpse Bride ,The
    Doctor Zhivago
    Duellists ,The
    Edward Scissorhands
    Enter The Dragon
    Final Fantasy - The Spirits Within
    Glory
    Heavy Metal.2000
    Hellboy (3-disc Dir.Cut)
    Hollow Man
    I Robot
    LA Confidential
    Last of the Mohicans
    Legend (Directors Cut)
    Legends of the Fall
    Leon (Dir.Cut)
    Little Shop of Horrors
    Lord of Illusions
    Mars Attacks
    Matrix ,The
    Meet Me in St.Louis
    1941
    North By Northwest
    Planet of the Apes (2001)
    Rebecca (Criterion 2-disc)
    Red Dragon
    Rush Hour
    Seven
    Short Circuit
    Sixth Day ,The
    Sound of Music ,The
    Starship Troopers
    Superman -The Movie
    Tomorrow Never Dies
    Usual Suspects ,The
    Witches of Eastwick ,The
    Wizard of Oz ,The
    Yellow Submarine
     
  3. andySu

    andySu Cinematographer

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    Steve

    I concur that is also my reason into buying DVD, the mixes sound better over the 2 channel CD versions, where they don’t carry split-surrounds on some, well that is a hell of list there, looks like you started well before me, I only started around 2000, and so far I’m close to the 1000 mark, and the DVD bookshelf is getting very tight!


    Looks like I missed of a few titles here,

    16# Doctor Zhivago
    17# I Robot

    18# North By Northwest?

    Not sure if my “North By Northwest” has an isolated score, it’s been around 2 years since I played it last, I’ll check it out later.

    Now if I brought a second AVR unit I could tinker around with this idea, thou I will still need more JBL loudspeakers placed at the front to make this work!

    The Surrounds are no problem I enough surrounds to sink a battleship!
     
  4. Douglas R

    Douglas R Cinematographer

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    North by Northwest certainly does have an isolated score. In addition to Steve's list there is Papillon, Carousel, The King and I and Camelot (R1 only). The latter three are, of course, all musicals but have an isolated music score, without the vocals.
     
  5. Nicholas Martin

    Nicholas Martin Cinematographer

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    The Jumanji DVD (2000 special edition, not the recent deluxe edition) features a 5.1 isolated score, but the surrounds are very quiet.

    I wish the Glory and Bicentennial Man DVDs were the same in R1 as R2 - the R1's don't have the isolated scores. Understandable, though - My limited understanding is that sometimes it's not possible to include one because the record companies that released the soundtrack albums are concerned about losing potential sales - why get a CD when you have a more complete, yet heavily volume compressed and edited, version of the film's score on DVD instead? Perhaps both Glory and Bicentennial Man are exempt from that outside North America, so only the other regions get it.
     
  6. andySu

    andySu Cinematographer

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    Nicholas

    Now that is quite disconcerting, who is in charge with the overall process of seeing these, so called special edition DVD reaching the stores for the consumers, and for worldwide distribution. They shouldn’t skip on the features it should be “universal” and therefore will satisfy the consumers without conflations!
     
  7. Nicholas Martin

    Nicholas Martin Cinematographer

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    ...and it's not limited to music - that special edition of Titanic was a prime example of this - North America received a 3 disc version, while the vast majority of the world received a 4 disc version.

    TV DVDs are also different at times, but it is limited to extras such as TV and home video trailers for the show, as well as recap segments.

    You may have to deal with PAL speed-up, but at the same time you sometimes get more extras, and PAL is a better video resolution, anyway.

    I don't sound too jealous, do I? [​IMG]
     
  8. andySu

    andySu Cinematographer

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    Nicholas

    You don’t need to explain the differences in NTSC VS PAL and speed up issues which should be (universal) I have worked in the cinema and thou you can speed up the projectors to play at 25fps, with careful adjustment, DVD on the other hand is very depressing at times, I have a fair few ole NTSC laserdiscs and when it comes to doing an A&B test with the region 2 DVD or a PAL laserdisc, Luke Skywalker sounds ridiculous like Mickey Mouse![​IMG]
     
  9. Nicholas Martin

    Nicholas Martin Cinematographer

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    I wasn't explaining the differences...I figure everyone who is a part of this forum knows what PAL speed-up is.

    I was only saying that it's a small price (or big price, if it bothers someone) to pay for better resolution, and sometimes better extras.
     
  10. andySu

    andySu Cinematographer

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    Yeah your right about “North by Northwest” it does have an isolated score on the region 2 DVD, thou it’s only in (2 channel stereo) and I noted there was a different musical cue in the isolated track that was different from the film.
     
  11. Sammy-G

    Sammy-G Stunt Coordinator

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    I have one little addition to this list: both the R1 and R2 WHV disc of Chaplin's 1952 film Limelight have an isolated score track.
     
  12. John H Ross

    John H Ross Screenwriter

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    RUDY and THE 6TH DAY also have isolated scores (in R1 at least). 6TH DAY includes a Rabin commentary.

    Plus there's a good selection of R2 Doctor Who releases with isolated scores including the upcoming "Mark Of The Rani".

    John
     
  13. Steve Christou

    Steve Christou Long Member

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    There's many more isolated scores listed in this old thread -

    http://www.hometheaterforum.com/htf/...ad.php?t=47520

    It's good to check around before buying. I remember a few years ago buying The Dark Crystal on R2 for about 20 quid and discovering later that a much cheaper R1 edition had an isolated score [bites fist]. [​IMG]
     
  14. John H Ross

    John H Ross Screenwriter

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