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Is the b&w era of TV on DVD slowly coming to an end?

Discussion in 'TV on DVD and Blu-ray' started by Gary OS, Jan 12, 2012.

  1. Lecagr

    Lecagr Supporting Actor

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    That's true about Father Knows Best season 1, that DVD set is a mess with several edited episodes. From season 2 and forward, the episodes are uncut. Mister Ed season 1 on DVD originally had several edited episodes also, but later Shout Factory corrected the error and when Mister Ed was released as a complete series, season 1 had all uncut episodes.
     
  2. smithbrad

    smithbrad Screenwriter

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    It isn't so much whether the disks are manufactured "pressed" or MOD DVD-R's, since either could contain syndicated or un-cut episodes, but the MOD approach does tend to signify a risk mitigating strategy and using existing video elements is definitely cost cutting, so it isn't a surprise both came together for the later My Three Son's releases
     
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  3. smithbrad

    smithbrad Screenwriter

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    One thing to also remember is that there are other differences between us that may explain the shifting priorities. I'm a very visual person, but not good on audio or dialog recall. I know people that can watch a movie one time and recite lines years later, while I can watch a movie ten times and have difficulty with dialog details the next day. I watched the first two seasons of My Three Son's and did not notice anything related to swapped out music. I've watched some syndicated shows and not noticed edits unless blatant due to the lack of proper fade in/out at commercials. I'm not a video elitist in that I happily watch taped basketball games from the 80's and 90's, but I quickly notice variability in video quality across episodes within a series. So, it shouldn't be surprising that we may disagree on what we will accept and not accept within an imperfect release.
     
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  4. BobO'Link

    BobO'Link Producer

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    Sticker shock is why I'm leaving them at the store.
     
  5. Professor Echo

    Professor Echo Screenwriter

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    I own most every Timeless release and as most of us know, the quality on those runs the gamut. I’m happy with many of their sets, especially the later releases which were usually in better shape than the early ones. Some of that had to do with third party remastering, but even other more recent ones seemed to have more conscientious quality control to them.

    Early releases like BRANDED, GUNS OF WILL SONNETT and CHECKMATE were largely horrible in terms of edits and only encouraged my stance against cut prints. My appreciation of all three of those series was severely diminished by those releases and I’d be even hard pressed to declare them better than nothing. Other titles like M SQUAD were a mixed bag in terms of both edits and picture quality, but usually watchable and I’m very happy I took a gamble on those releases.

    My point of this is to show that I am not a snob when it comes to vintage TV or films on physical media. My tastes are all over the map, both in terms of subject matter and presentation, and my vast collections of thousands of DVDs and Blus reflect that. Unedited episodes are a priority, nice reproduction quality preferred, but at least watchable quality a must. After years of eye straining boots, I don’t seem to have the patience anymore for something that has really deteriorated, but if it’s rare enough I’ll give even that a shot. So while I do have my ideals for all of this stuff, I am not a slave to them. In the end I’m just glad to have so many titles to choose from, good, bad, ugly.
     
  6. smithbrad

    smithbrad Screenwriter

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    I have many Timeless releases as well. While I enjoyed BRANDED, I recall it having one of the worst edited episodes I have ever seen. It starred Martin Landau. I just remember seeing Landau's character at one location and then a second later he was in woods fighting another man with a sword (at least that's how I remember it). I was like, "whoa what just happened".

    One of my favorites from Timeless was LAWLESS YEARS, but I had to extract the episodes and heavily reduce the gold tinting from season one to enjoy it. Same with M SQUAD where the grey saturation was all over the map across episodes. I had to extract all the episodes and try to at least make the video consistent across the board to enjoy.
     
  7. Professor Echo

    Professor Echo Screenwriter

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    Yeah, there’s an episode of CHECKMATE where the ending appears to be completely missing. An abrupt cut in the middle of an action scene with dialog and then the end credits suddenly start with no story resolution whatsoever. So frustrating. I always hoped Timeless would redo some of their first releases, even after the dubious “merger” with Shout, I actually wondered if the latter might step up and improve rereleases of older Timeless titles. Was I naive or what?
     
  8. howard1908

    howard1908 Stunt Coordinator

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    Not to be rude but why would spend hours upon hours extacting files and editing them to create color consistency when you could spend 5 seconds turning off the color on your TV to get virtually the same effect.
     
  9. smithbrad

    smithbrad Screenwriter

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    Well...regarding LAWLESS YEARS, my intent wasn't to make them pure gray scale, I actually liked the effect of the tinting, it helped with the period look. However, I wanted to tone it down to a more minimal level and make it consistent across episodes (so not the same effect as stated by turning off the color). Especially, given that there were radically different amounts of tinting either applied or that more than likely had impacted the elements over time. In addition, both LAWLESS YEARS and M SQUAD had overly saturated gray scale (I believe that is correct for overly blown out whites) that had to be controlled on an episode by episode basis. While I imagine I could have tried to manually adjust TV controls for each episode, but that would have been overall more time consuming then to just use software to adjust it once for all future viewings. While it took a couple of hours, I believe stating hours upon hours sounds a bit exaggerated.
     
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  10. LouA

    LouA Screenwriter

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    I feel the same way , but if edited episodes is the only way to go (like Real McCoys and Shout Factory Ozzie And Harriet ) I'll still buy it , hoping that eventually something better will come along . With Real McCoys, a favorite of mine , nothing better came along but I still have the edited episode to watch and enjoy . For a while it looked like Ozzie And Harriet would get a proper release via Sam Nelson …. (But don't get me started on that !)
     
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  11. Tom.W

    Tom.W Stunt Coordinator

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    It seems likely that sales of seasons 1 and 2 were not good enough for CBS continue releasing remastered versions of subsequent seasons - partly as a result of complaints about music substitutions. So now they're releasing what's available. I'm not sure why remastering seasons 3,4, 5, etc. with the original music would be more costly than doing so with music substitutions unless there are legal reasons. But My Three Sons does not use a lot of music from external sources.

    I'm pretty sure seasons 1 through 5 (the b/w's) all ran uncut at least once on Nick at Nite in the 80's. Seems unlikely that CBS/Viacom lost some complete episodes.
     
  12. Neil Brock

    Neil Brock Producer

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    Yes, for ME-TV but clocking in at 22 minutes. I don't know if I have any network copies but I would guess considering the era the show ran, they probably came in originally at around 26 minutes at least. Unless CBS made 2 transfers, one complete and one cut for syndication running time.
     
  13. Message #3533 of 3825 Sep 22, 2019
    Last edited: Sep 22, 2019
    MatthewA

    MatthewA Lead Actor

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    No network sitcom prior to the introduction of TV ratings would run anywhere shorter than 23 minutes. The biggest decade-to-decade drop in running time was from the 1980s to the 1990s; compare any season one episode of The Golden Girls or Cheers to ones from their respective final seasons and there's a difference of almost a minute and a half. From the 1950s to the 1970s all the half-hour shows I've seen run 25-26 minutes without commercials. CBS seems to have neglected every sitcom from the 1950s they own other than I Love Lucy and The Honeymooners. That Our Miss Brooks is even re-airing at any length now is remarkable when it's gotten precious little air time in 20 years or more.

    CBS managed to screw Jim Nabors over twice: first by firing him and Frank Sutton in 1971 after they switched from Gomer to the variety show format, then by cutting the music out of the show on DVD. Maybe under the new corporate structure they'll fix it and other shows they treated this way, but I'm not sure they will if Andy Griffith couldn't move Blu-ray units and is now in a music rights lawsuit over the theme song. Frankly, they should have made a deal with Shout! when they had the chance.
     
  14. BobO'Link

    BobO'Link Producer

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    It's been a looong time so my times may be a bit off. From what I remember when I started working in broadcasting in the late 70s the standard length of a half hour program was in the 26:30 range. The network took ~3:00 for commercials/promos and the local broadcaster got ~00:35 for a commercial and station ID. That was normally segmented into 3 breaks with 2 inside the program at roughly 9 minute intervals and a an end break (that's where the broadcaster got their chance) between programs. Hour length programs had roughly the same amount of time removed for network commercials/promos per half hour but gave the broadcaster an extra 30 seconds in the mid-break. There'd typically be 4 breaks of ~60 seconds a ~90 second mid-break and a 60 second end break leaving ~53:30 for the program. The network usually ran their promos for other shows in the end and mid-breaks.
     
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  15. Gary OS

    Gary OS Producer

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    Picked up the 2nd Season of Public Defender on a recent sale. Looking forward to watching these.

    Gary "so happy to see this series released" O.
     
  16. Gary OS

    Gary OS Producer

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    Also finally picked up Mr Novak. Watched the opening episode and quite enjoyed it. Looking forward to continuing with this series.

    Gary “wish this series would have done a Christmas episode” O.
     
  17. bmasters9

    bmasters9 Producer

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    I think that second-season release ought to come sometime in the future (hopefully 2020).
     
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  18. Gary OS

    Gary OS Producer

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    Hope you are right.

    Gary “ :thumbsup: “ O.
     
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  19. Purple Wig

    Purple Wig Stunt Coordinator

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    I drove past Marshall High School, upon which Novak's place of employment was modeled, today. Unfortunately I didn't see anyone resembling James Franciscus, nor even anyone as nattily attired.
     
  20. Gary OS

    Gary OS Producer

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    Cool. I’ve driven past it on occasion when out in LA many years ago.

    Gary “am going to really enjoy watching this first season” O.
     

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