Is most of today's music just plain bad? (1 Viewer)

[Bruce Hedtke]

I am mostly a fan of swing, big-band and jazz. But, I don't think all of mainstream music of today is bad. I don't listen to it much, but there have been some performers I like. Macy Gray, Nelly Fretado and even The Verve are all performers I've taken a liking to. Of course, not listening to it helps to filter out alot of shit, too.
Bruce
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[Brian Bunn]

As an example of just how bad the state of the music industry is in these days look no further than the recent developments concerning the outstanding pop/rock band WILCO. I started a thread (linked below) a while back on what I thought at the time was the soon to be released new WILCO album (Yankee Hotel Foxtrot). http://www.hometheaterforum.com/uub/...ML/000549.html
As it turned out, the WILCO album was REJECTED by its record company (Reprise Records) saying it wasn't "commercial" enough and there wasn't any "radio singles" on the album. Reprise wanted WILCO to makes some changes and Jeff Tweedy refused and told them that the album was completed, take it or leave it. Reprise told him they would not release it in its current form. So WILCO and Reprise parted ways. WILCO bought back the rights to the album and are now shopping it around to other record companies for release, probably not until next year. The good news is that I've read that they have had 30 plus offers from record companies to release the album. I have heard the album and to my ears it is outstanding. How Reprise could refuse to release it is beyond me. WILCO is not a mega hit kind of band, but they have a very loyal following and I am sure generate a fair amount of money for the record company. To ask a band like WILCO to make changes to its album is a ridiculous notion.
It just epitomizes the really sad state the music industry is in today in a nutshell. It is currently ruled by teeny boppers and rappers/hip hoppers pretty much exclusively. Don't get me wrong. I have nothing against the teeny boppers and rappers. There is a place for that sort of stuff...obviously. But not at the expense of truly talented bands like WILCO. It is really disheartening.
But...all that being said, there is still a ton of great music out there just waiting to be discovered, mostly on the indie labels, but there is some good stuff on some of the major labels as well. As others have said here, you have to search for it, but it is there. Definitely not on mainstream radio. I haven't listened to a music radio station in years...only AM talk and sports radio.
For a good place to start for good pop/rock music, check out Amplfier Magazine at:
http://www.twomp.com/amplifier
It will help point you in the right direction.
Also check out these web sites:
Link Removed http://www.cdbaby.com Link Removed (and buy Steve Ward's super album!) http://www.fufkin.com http://www.powerpop.org/shakitup http://www.emusic.com
Those links should help you get started on a search that will once again spark your interest in music if you have been turned off and "out of the loop" for a while. Check 'em out.
There is a whole lot of good stuff out there. Personally, I have found quite a lot that I have really enjoyed listening to just in the last few months.

 

[Brian Bunn]

Oh...and buy THE WAXWINGS outstanding album "Low To The Ground". It could single-handedly reaffirm your faith in music!

 

[Scott H]

Brian, Wilco/YHF is my favorite album of 2001 thus far (released or not).
As much as their situation may be indicative of the sorry state of business at large record companies, it is also a great example of the positive state of music. Wilco is but one example of many great artists/bands that put the music first. Many. But you aren't likely to hear them between the commercials on the radio.
Of note is the origin of Wilco's name in regards to the business side of making music... When Uncle Tupelo disbanded, still under contract with Reprise, the boys had to get back to work and make another record... Hence, 'will comply'.
Btw, one of my favorite places to here tantalizing tidbits of great bands/songs is the segues between stories on NPR...
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[Dean DeMass]

IMHO, most music is pretty bad, there are not many new bands coming out where I go "I have to have that CD".
Here is what I am listening to now.
Perry Farrell's new CD
The Crystal Methods new CD
Anything by Tool
Anything by The Grateful Dead and Jerry Garcia Band
Anything by NIN
Ben Folds new CD
Geting Garbage's new CD today
Stone Temple Pilots new CD
Foo Fighters
Pink Floyd - Animals
Nirvana - In Utero
I avoid the radio like the plague.
-Dean-
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[Mark Pfeiffer]

Earlier I stated that plenty of good stuff is out there, so I figured I should back up the statement. Here are artists who have released new, worthwhile albums this year:
Guided By Voices
Spoon
Bob Dylan
Lucinda Williams
Bruce Robison
Charlie Robison
Ryan Adams
The Strokes
White Stripes
Jay Farrar
R.E.M.
Radiohead
The Beta Band
Gillian Welch
Joe Henry
And that's just off the top of my head. There are probably plenty others. Recent albums from P.J. Harvey, U2, Jurassic 5, Sarah Harmer, Shelby Lynne, Tim Easton, Laura Cantrell, Billy Bragg and Wilco, Belle and Sebastian, Elliott Smith, Kelly Willis, Emmylou Harris, David Gray, Nelly Furtado, Aimee Mann, and Kasey Chambers are also worth your time.
There is good pop music, except it doesn't get played on the radio (think the Elephant 6 bands). Rap/hip hop is not a fad and is here to stay. I'm not nearly as conversant in the genre, but I love Jurassic 5's Quality Control. Again, I get the sense that the representation in the mainstream of the genre isn't always indicative of what else is available.
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[brentl]

I guess we agree that today popular mainstream musuc is garbage.
I will say that I loved Acoustic Soul by India Arie, an that would be considerd mainstream.
Help me out!! I'm looking for something with a heart...NOT hard rock or new age just something where the lyrics say something.
I need another storyteller.
LL cool B

 

[Brian Bunn]

I agree about the WILCO album...it is fantastic. If anyone needs "help" with the Wilco album let me know. I may be able to "help" you out.
Mark--You mentioned some good ones. Bob Dylan's new one is outstanding of course. He continues to do his thing and fly in the face of the music industry despite it all. Ryan Adams first 2 solo albums (released in a years time) are outstanding as well. I look forward to hearing Jay Farrar's new one. You mention some I will have to look into.
Brent--You want storytellers and lyrics that "mean" something? Here are a few names to check out:
Freedy Johnston
Tim Easton
Ryan Adams
Steve Earle
Josh Rouse
Vigilantes of Love
Pete Yorn
Man, I could make a huge list of some great stuff. I will list some of the stuff I have been listening to recently:
Wilco-Yankee Hotel Foxtrot (of course)
Bob Dylan-Love and Theft
The Waxwings-Low To The Ground (buy this album!)
Neil Finn--One Nil
Josh Rouse-Dressed Up Like Nebraska and Home (get these!)
Vigilantes of Love-Summershine (don't miss it!)
The Honeydogs-Here's Luck
Whiskeytown-Strangers Almanac (maybe the best alt-country album ever)
Whiskeytown-Pneumonia
Pernice Brothers-The World Won't End (get it!)
Chappaquiddick Skyline
Travis-The Invisible Band
Tim Easton-The Truth About Us
Steve Ward-Opening Night (this one is a requirement!)
Cherry Twister-At Home With Cherry Twister (as is this one)
Freedy Johnston-Right Between The Promises
The Choir-Flap Your Wings (outstanding Christian Pop/Rock)
The Elms-Big Surprise (more outstanding Christian Pop/Rock)
Teenage Fanclub-Howdy!
Ryan Adams-Heartbreaker (don't miss)
Ryan Adams-Gold (ditto)
Ron Sexsmith-Blue Boy
Pete Yorn-Musicforthemorningafter
Old 97's-Satellite Rides
Neilson Hubbard-Why Men Fail
Map of Wyoming-Trouble Is
Map of Wyoming-Round Trip
Clem Snide-Your Favorite Music
Clem Snide-The Ghost Of Fashion
Ivy-Long Distance
Longwave-Endsongs (definitely check it out)
The Supers-Spklaang! (infectious pop/rock)
Orange Peels-So Far (more infectious pop/rock)
Adam Daniel-Blue Pop (even more infectious pop/rock)
The Drowners-Is There Something On Your Mind? (and more!)
The Apples In Stereo-The Discovery of a World Inside The Moone
The Flashing Lights-Where The Change Is
Quite a list! I ain't having no problem finding stuff I like. And even if you don't like music along these lines (pop/rock for the more "mature" listener) I am sure you can find other stuff to your liking with a little searching.
Seriously, any of the above is a great place to start. But start with The Waxwings and Steve Ward...if you don't like these albums I will personally refund your money!
[Edited last by Brian Bunn on October 02, 2001 at 11:00 AM]

 

[Mike Broadman]

A record company signs thousands of artists, the vast majority of which do not sell a lot of records. Their profits come from about 5% of their albums, so the ones that do sell have to sell a lot. The way to sell literally millions of copies nowadays is to integrate the performer with TV, videos, etc. Of course, this limits the super-successful performers to being attractive, pleasant, young, and generally bland and untalented.
But let's be honest folks, has been pop music ever really been good? I mean, musically, there's very little quality songwriting. If you take away nostalgia and the other non-musical considerations away from listening to music, you end up hearing processed, lame, repetitive corporate tripe.
Here are a few exceptions, IMO:
Paul Simon
Prince (sometimes)
Peter Gabriel
Steely Dan
The Beatles
As far as rock is concerned, the only real musical innovation is found in "progressive" rock (though I hate the term). Folks, you can't get more ground-breaking and fresh than Frank Zappa and King Crimson. In fact, Crimson is very active now and still making the boldest, most interesting rock music out there.
The worst is when bands from the 70s changed their sound to become more commercial. The worst two example of this are Yes and Genesis.
As far as rap/hip-hop is concerned, you must understand that it is no longer a fad or trend. It is a style that's here to stay, whether you like it or not. Though I don't like most of it, some of it is actually more interesting than populat rock music. Public Enemy and Digital Underground did some amazing things in the studio, and A Tribe Called Quest sounded more direct and honest than any of these "singer-song-writer" Lillith Fest types.
However, if you're really serious about exploring music, you're gonna hit a dead end if you stick to rock. Jazz is the most expressive creative force in the US, possibly the world. Anyone who says it all "basically sounds the same" hasn't really listened. It is so diverse, it's scary. Big band, free, bop, avant-garde, vocal, fusion- there's enough out there to explore for the rest of your life. What other kind of music combines improvisation, groove, and arrangements in that way? What else can be more expressive than someone composing on-the-spot, for that moment alone?
Ok, I'm done.

 

[Anthony Hom]

I think the thread here is getting askew, although alot of great viewpoints are coming out.
The problem centers around the definition of pop. I think it is music that has more universal appeal, songs that a wide group of audiences like. There are songs that have attained this, but this is not true anymore. I agree with a previous sentiment, that a record company has to take a chance on a different artist and not go with the "safe" acts. It happened with Elvis, British Invasion, New Wave, Alternative. In this decade, someone will come along that is good, but quirky and different enough to be noticed and to start a new trend of finding unusual artists. However, with recent events and the growing conservative movement in this country, be prepared for more of the "wholesome pop music" the industry wants everyone to listen to and forget the rest. Right now, music is right where it was in the 70's disco era. No new ground, just the same beats and lyrics. We need something like a punk movement to shake things up, but since that's been done already, its hard to imagine what will come next.

 

[Scott H]

Mark and Brian, great lists! But the ommission of Son Volt is glaring

Yes, I see Jay

Btw, Son Volt/Trace is a great album and the first track Windfall was an instant classic... I mention this because the last time I saw Steve Earle, in Austin, he covered it... Now there's a statement.
Rather than list tons of bands, I'll note what I'm listening to in recent days:
Bedhead
You Am I
Wilco
Sparklehorse
Sleater-Kinney
Gillian Welsh
Cosigner
P.J. Harvey
Whiskeytown
Grandaddy
Elliott Smith
Handsome Family
Nick Cave
Guided By Voices
Dirty Three
Death Cab For Cutie
Kasey Chambers
Calexico
Silkworm
Beulah
Neutral Milk Hotel
Tom Petty
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[Keith Paynter]

The ability to get today's bland sound-alike girl/boy/group music on the air is the equivalent of payola. When the hell are we gonna hear something (anything) that will change the course of radio?
Two local FM stations battled for the demographic that these songs are destined for - one failed miserably, and within a year became pop-lite (basically anything in the last 30 years). There is fortunately one real rock station left in town.
I'm darn near 40 and I still like new rock if it's got something to say. I've got a weekend band that plays music from The Doors, Green Day, Blink 182, Kiss and a host of others - there's good new rock out there that will have staying power, it's just got to get heard above this prefabricated crap.
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[John Garcia]

Are groups like The Matthew good Band, Creed, and Indian Ant Farm( ) going to save us??

Sorry, jumping in late, but it's ALIEN Ant Farm, not Indian... DOH!

Listen harder.
CREED? You have to be kidding me? Good yes, savior of music? NO WAY.
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[Todd H]

There's some great rock music out there. You just have to look for it. Rock usually is better when it is underground. Once it becomes mainstream, it deteriorates into pop blandness. Take 80's metal for instance. When it first appeared it was raw, dark, and heavy. But once it started to gain popularity, it metamorphosed into hair-metal. Personally, I can't wait for the Rage Against The Machine/Chris Cornell collaboration. Man is that going to be sweet!

 

[Scott Kriefall]

Thanks for the link to cdbaby.com Brian! I just spent 2 hours browsing through their stock and listening to clips. I also found a great review site called http://www.theglobalmuse.com.
My tastes may not match those of some of the previous posters, since I prefer folk/jazz/blues/world as well as female artists such as Sarah McLachlan and Ani DiFranco. But here are some of the artists that I came across that I really like:
Susan Raven
Marble Feather
Gypsy Soul
Nyree
Link Removed
Perhaps someone else might find that list useful.

 

[brentl]

Indian ... Alien My bad!
LL cool B

 

[Jim_F]

I loved AOR in the early 70s, before they called it AOR. Even then, there was lots of really lame stuff being overplayed that's since been all but forgotten. In addition, there was all the AM pop that I couldn't abide from day one. The surviving "classics" are a distillation of songs that stand up over a few decades.
It was important to have 3 rock stations in Metro Detroit, because one or two of them was frequently playing something I couldn't stand.
I don't think good current music is much, if any less rare. Nostalgia aside, there are lots of times when I just want to hear something new(er). I mean, Stairway to Heaven was a great tune, but now I've heard it more than enough times for one lifetime.
[Edited last by Jim_F on October 05, 2001 at 10:16 AM]

 

[David Lawson]

I'm fortunate enough to have WOXY 97X as a local station, and I think you'd be hard pressed to find a recent Miami University graduate (or student) who doesn't appreciate everything this station tries to do. There is a live audio feed from their site, found at www.woxy.com .
I wholeheartedly agree with Brian's recommendation of World Won't End from The Pernice Brothers. This album hasn't left my CD player for the last week.
Some other recommendations:
- Guster (any one of their three albums)
- Southern Culture On The Skids
- Treble Charger
- Stereophonics
- Kent (Hagnesta Hill is incredible)
- Shivaree
- The Sheila Divine
- K's Choice
- The Connells
I must confess that I don't understand the fuss over Bob Schneider's Lonelyland or Splashdown's Blueshift, although the latter's Redshift EP was excellent. Don't you dare pay eBay prices for it, though.
Edit: I agree with The Waxwings recommendation as well. 97X brought them on campus last year, along with 12 Rods and The Getaway People. I must admit, however, that I recommend The Getaway People even more. They stole the show.
[Edited last by David Lawson on October 07, 2001 at 09:47 PM]

 

[Brian Dobbs]

Radio sucks.
Listen to progressive rock.
Bands like....
Dream Theater
Spocks Beard
Transatlantic
Liquid Tension Experiment
Mullmuzzler

 

[Mike Broadman]

lol @ Brian.
Nice to see another prog pusher in our midst.