Interesting title for format comparisons

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by John Kotches, Jan 14, 2003.

  1. John Kotches

    John Kotches Cinematographer

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    Ray Brown's title from Concord Jazz, Soular Energy is available on SACD from Groove Note Records, and on DVD-Audio/Video from Hi-Res Music.
    Both labels received the same masters for use, so it will be interesting to see how the two compare.
    The Hi-Res title is uniquely authored, with DVD-V or DVD-A @ 24/96K on one side, and DVD-A only 24/192K on the other side.
    I picked up both of these at CES last week, but haven't had a chance to listen to either of them.
    Regards,
     
  2. Lee Scoggins

    Lee Scoggins Producer

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    John,
    If they are both from an "pure live to 2 track analog" tape, then it will be an okay comparison.
    If the session had both a pure DSD recording and a pure hi-rez PCM recording and the mastering was done consistently by the same team, that would be a better comparison.
    Plus, you need to make sure your DVDA and SACD players are on the same par from a hardware standpoint.
    [​IMG]
     
  3. John Kotches

    John Kotches Cinematographer

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    They are both from the same stereo master after multi-track mixdown, which is as close as we are likely to get for comparison in the forseeable future.
    God only knows what happened to the Dorian Records disc, which recorded the Lord & Taylor pipe organ in Philadelphia, which was supposed to have split the same mic feeds to DSD and PCM @ 24/192K. Neither version has seen the light of day yet.
    Given the claims made by some about the superiority of SACD, one would fully expect a $200 SACD player to sound better than a $2000 DVD-A player.
    We both know that's a bit ridiculous [​IMG]
    Regards,
     
  4. Dan Stone

    Dan Stone Stunt Coordinator

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    Oh no...here we go yet again. [​IMG]
     
  5. Dan Stone

    Dan Stone Stunt Coordinator

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  6. John Kotches

    John Kotches Cinematographer

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    Dan,

    I would say my SACD front end is weaker than my DVD-A frontend, so I can't really do a fair comparison.

    If someone is in my area that has something like an XA-777ES perhaps we could set something up for some weekend after the Meitner swichman is back in my rack.

    Going in, I'd say they will sound different... which is better will be a totally subjective and personal judgement.

    Regards,
     
  7. Lee Scoggins

    Lee Scoggins Producer

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  8. John Kotches

    John Kotches Cinematographer

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    These are analog masters. That's all Hi-Res has worked with to this point. Both Groove Note and Hi-Res were given copies of the same master tape.

    I can't tell you what Ying Tan did with the recording for release as an SACD. I bumped into him at the Alexis Park on Friday, but did not have the chance to speak with him as he was speaking with a few other people and I didn't want to interrupt his conversation.

    According to David Schwarz at High-Res music, they had one goal -- linear reproduction of what was on the master tape. They spent some time tweaking out the azimuth to get as precise a match as possible, and other items simply to get exactly what was on the tape to disc. There was no re-mixing for the DVD-A release done.


    Regards,
     
  9. Lee Scoggins

    Lee Scoggins Producer

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  10. Phil A

    Phil A Producer
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    I will get to hear the new Linn universal player Thursday night. After my modded XA-777ES comes back and breaks in, I might take the Linn home and see how that compares.

    John, regardless of which front end is better, please give us a review of the music and formats. I won't hold it against you if you prefer the DVD-A.:b
     
  11. LanceJ

    LanceJ Producer

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    Is there any way to run a 192kHZ PCM-derived music waveform and a DSD-derived waveform (from the same analog tape) to ascertain which format is truest to the original source? Not just which "sounds better". And I mean using waveforms audible to the average human being-not some useless impulse test measured in picoseconds or a 50kHz sinewave.
    Personally speaking, sacd sounds too soft, like a well-recorded but overly-worn vinyl record. PCM--to me--sounds cleaner and sharper. But that's just MY opinion.
    Which format is actually more accurate?
    LJ
     
  12. Lee Scoggins

    Lee Scoggins Producer

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  13. KeithH

    KeithH Lead Actor

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    John,
    I look forward to the results of your comparison. This title may represent the best yet for direct comparison of the two formats. What you need is a universal player that handles both SACD and DVD-Audio exceptionally at the player's price point. [​IMG]
    Lee said:
     
  14. Lee Scoggins

    Lee Scoggins Producer

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  15. Phil A

    Phil A Producer
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    Lee - flying monkees are know as 'Munchkins.'[​IMG]
     
  16. Joe Cole

    Joe Cole Second Unit

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    So? Can John Kotches get monkies to fly out as well?
    As for SACD vs DVD_A, I am 95% in the SACD camp because I love they way it sounds and I have very good equipment. DVD-A in the highest rez sounds very good but these are few and far between and not the kind of music I like any way. Which is the biggest problem for me at this time. I will not buy any more DVD-As unless they are 24-192.
    I may try the two almost equal Jazz disks from Grove Note my self.
    But I assure you no monkies will fly any where in my house. I am drug free and alchol abuse free for 28 years now! [​IMG]
     
  17. Kevin C Brown

    Kevin C Brown Producer

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    I have to admit, I was originally in the DVD-A camp, since I kind of don't like Sony. But since the Stones SACDs came out... [​IMG]
    Lee- Please get both and let us know what you think.
    John- Please get both and let us know what you think.
    Inquiring minds (attached to poorly discriminating ears) want to know! [​IMG]
     

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