HTF EARLY REVIEW: "Driven" - The next demo disc! (1 Viewer)

[Paul James]

Well I went and saw this film today at our local theater (still playing, abeit only twice a day and on it's way out in Australian cinemas), it would have to be THE worst film I have EVER seen. Wild horses could not drag me to buy the DVD. The person who allowed Stallone to write the screenplay should be taken out and shot !
Utter, utter garbage, HT demo or not. The film is terrible. I am lucky enough to get movie tickets for .50c and I almost demanded my money back.
Paul.

 

[Matthew_S]

Wow, this thread keeps getting better and better!! I have put a personal gag order on myself so I don't make anyone cry...One thing-I would really like to see Rob G. answer some of David Watters' posts with something other than "bullshit", "yeah, right", etc. Come on. I'm looking forward to answers to these comments by David and there are reply's that don't address the issue at all.

 

[Iain Lambert]

It does seem that its people in the field of the subject that have the most trouble with this. I remember a huge argument breaking out over 'Vertical Limit' as well, because while some of us thought it was exciting a few of the real climbers out there couldn't get past the technical innaccuracies. You only have to mention 'Independance Day' or 'Hackers' to a roomful of IT people to understand the kind of problem screenwriters can have with research...
Anyway, to return to this film, I'd expect that most of the board would be aware of the amount of flak this took at the time of the cinema release, so I really appreciate Ron's decision to let those who are interested know that the quality of the actual DVD itself is the best anyone could hope for, rather than following the tendency some reviews have to concentrate solely on the film. I've seen terrible transfers get great reviews in the mainstream press, just because the film you can make out through the grain and muffled sound that they fail to mention is one of their favorites.
p.s. - Just what exactly are you saying about Lightwave??? I love that software! But thats a whole other flamewar, where quality of ease of use between the programs and personal taste (Maya seems quite nice too, but I've never understood the 3D Studio fans) shouldn't be confused with the quality of results that the CG artists can achieve.

 

[Rob Gillespie]

Probably because there's no issue to answer Matthew. Exactly how many times does someone have to be told that it isn't that way before it sinks into their skulls? If people can't be bothered to read what is actually being posted that's their problem. The people who continue to come out with this kind of stuff without listening to what is being said are just trolls and are not welcome here.
"Ron is paid to give good reviews"
"No he isn't"
"Ron is paid to give good reviews"
"No he isn't"
And on and on and on.
None of the moderators/owners here are paid to write reviews. None of them always give good reviews for screener copies. This has been reiterated several times during the course of this thread and STILL you disbelieve. To that, all I can say is - you know where the door is. There's only so many times these accusations can be thrown around before the person or people being accused start getting pretty pissed off
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[Edited last by Rob Gillespie on September 04, 2001 at 08:29 AM]
[Edited last by Rob Gillespie on September 04, 2001 at 08:31 AM]

 

[chris rick]

This thread has become the most entertaining thing I've seen today...granted it isn't even 11:00 yet....

 

[Jeremy Anderson]

As if my previous allegorical statements about pork didn't make my feelings on DRIVEN clear, I will clarify:
I like the movie XANADU. I couldn't tell you why, but that movie just entertains the hell out of me. However, when I'm watching the movie, I accept that in real life people can not rollerskate into heaven by running into a wall with a painting of the muses. I also accept that Olivia Newton John, no matter how talented she may or may not be, can not spontaneously change wardrobe. BUT IT'S A FREAKIN' MOVIE, MAN! Can shuttles fly like they did in Armageddon? NO! Is there the sound of engines and laser fire in the vacuum of space, a la every frikkin' sci-fi movie ever made? NO! But when I watch those movies, technical accuracy isn't the paramount factor for my enjoyment.
Maybe DRIVEN isn't remotely authentic. Maybe the dialogue is horrible. Maybe it's the worst movie ever made... but hey, there are people who like SHOWGIRLS too. The review that started all this nonsense stated simply the technical merits of the disc itself (which coincides with DVDFILE.COM's review) and the personal OPINION of the reviewer that the movie was entertaining for two hours.
David's gripe seems to be that the review must be biased because the reviewer received the disc for free. My answer to that is WHAT CRITIC DOESN'T RECEIVE FREE MATERIAL TO REVIEW? These things are sent out for promotion... just like the big-name critics are given free screenings of movies, not because the studio is guaranteed a glowing review, but because if that person enjoys the product they'll give an honest review of it.
By reviewing only the product that he enjoys, he is thinning the herd so that you don't have to sit through pages of "this movie sucks". He's offering you only the discs that he finds worthwhile. But it's still HIS OPINION, and you can weigh those opinions however you wish. But David, know this: There's no motivation to promote anything from any studio on this forum or on any review site, as obviously evidenced by the many sound thrashings just about every studio has gotten here at one point or another. If you're going to hover around and be contrary, you're not only wasting your own time, you're wasting ours as well.
You don't like DRIVEN. FINE! WE GET THAT! MOVE ON, MAN!

 

[Jim_C]

>>Almost. I would change those to 1. Uneducated about Champ Car racing or 2. Getting paid to say it or 3. a suck-up or 4. Gets DVDs for free so has lost some perspective on having to chose a limited number of titles to own.

 

[Quint van der Vaart]

I think this thread is getting a bit out of hand.
Some people are attacking someone else's personal opinions
and I think that's wrong.
Everyone is entitled to have an opinion and say it even
if you don't agree with the other person's opinion (Ron's in this case) but please for the love of god don't attack
that person and make it a personal fun-ride.
That's just plain nasty to say the least and not very polite.
David you realy should cool down a bit.
The things you have said are realy below the belt and
uncalled for.
By saying that you don't owe Ron an appoligy that just shows that you don't have any manors.
On this board we all are movie/dvd-fans and this forum is meant for everyone who wants to share their findings and
questions and such.
So please treat every person here with the respect they
deserve even if you don't agree with that person's opinion.
Peace.....
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There is another world....The DVD WORLD !!
[Edited last by Quint van der Vaart on September 04, 2001 at 12:52 PM]

 

[David Oliver]

Well I haven't seen Driven and I really have no plans to buy the DVD. But I respect folks who wish to buy it for Demo purposes, or because they enjoyed it, or whatever their reasons are. Folks work 9 to 5 so they can spend their money on what they like.
I do have a question for Ron,
Why don't you review DVDs you don't like? That is just as helpful as a positive review.

 

[paul_v]

Matthew's opinion was attacked too, not just Ron's =). I can see why everyone wants to side with Ron...heck he runs an awesome sight. His post threatening to cancel people's accounts just because people didn't agree with what he said is making me think twice about sending a contribution in. I still will since I read the board every day and get a lot out of it.
Yeah the "Ron gets kickbacks for good reviews" comment was a little harsh for someone with no sense of humor. I on the other hand thought it was funny, even though I knew it wasn't true. I really think people need to lighten up here. Matthew was just trying to be funny, sheesh. Maybe it's just best not to have an opinion on this forum, or a sense of humor...at least that's what I'm getting from this thread.
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[Edited last by paul_v on September 04, 2001 at 01:37 PM]

 

[Matthew_S]

Paul, you are my new personal hero.

 

[Rob Gillespie]

Matthew, I have much more of a problem with your second post than your first.

 

[Matthew_S]

ok.

 

[MarcD]

About the movie Driven:
I'm an avid CART fan and watch all their races as well as other open-wheel racing like IRL & F1. I've been to many Toronto Molson Indy races including one where 2 people got killed. I've seen my favourite driver, Greg Moore, crash & die live on TV. Racing is a serious sport with serious consequences.
I also love movies whether they are realistic fact-based (like Apollo 13) or unrealistic fantasy-based. When I saw Stallone at last year's Toronto race I thought maybe the movie will be fact-based. I haven't seen the movie but from the commercials and Ron's comments I see it's more fantasy. When I do watch the movie that's how I'll look at it and will enjoy it as such regardless of it's unrealism (like the race seen in Charlie's Angels).
About Ron's review:
It's his opinion & I respect that along with all the opinions on the Forum. I've made purchase or viewing choices because of members' opinions and I appreciate that.
About this thread:
Though somewhat enjoyable, I think it's gone too far. I have noticed other threads with comments that are rude and I find it distasteful. I think apologies are owed and that this thread should end on a positive note. Like all communities there are rough edges but it's time to "kiss & make up"... or at least shake hands.
MarcD

 

[Rob Gillespie]

Maybe it's just best not to have an opinion on this forum, or a sense of humor...at least that's what I'm getting from this thread.

Paul, do you realise how utterly frustrating this kind of comment is? We've got five pages of messages in this thread, during which it has been made clear several times that OPINIONS are never a problem, but ATTITUDES are. Everyone's opinion is welcome - hell, that's what we're all here for is it not? But there's big difference between giving your thoughts and posting like a king troll. See some of Obi's comments earlier in the thread. They summ up the problem better than I can.
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[Ken Situ]

Anybody expecting a documentary out of DRIVEN is living in a fatasy world, or something is not hook up right. .
Anybody expecting a movie can and should capture the essence of a 900 horse-power, high-pitched whining turbo engine with chasis developed through years in the wind-tunnel knows nothing about CART and F1, eventhough he/she might somehow work in the said series.

By the way, why do you go to a movie about CART if you want to see it as close to the real thing as possible? Why don't you just watch ABC/ESPN butchering, and much tape delayed telecast instead?
By the way, quite a few CART drivers went to the LA opening of the movies, and none of them complained as loud as you, Dave - not for one second I am saying this movie is good in anyway. I am a whore about CART racing, so I will be buying this DVD for say about $20.00. It sure beats the shit out of paying $37.00 for a little hat from the merchanise trailers.
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[John Garcia]

I saw this movie in the theater also, and while I absolutely hated the movie, the sound was quite impressive. If I can find it cheap (say $12 or so) I will pick it up for the sound.
It was already said a few times:the point of the movie was not to be technically accurate (because it most certainly wasn't in ANY way), but to entertain. The visual effects were not impressive at all and the dialogue was awful, but the popcorn was good and I was entertained for a few minutes.

Was it worth it? Not really, but who cares? Gotta watch some bad ones to know which ones are GOOD.
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All progress is based upon a universal, innate desire on the part of every organism,
to live beyond it's income.
ITRCA ** Link Removed (sorry, car guy)

 

[Dan M]

This movie is meant to be totally serious, yet it plays like a comedy. In the theater where I saw this, people we're laughing non-stop, and my stomach/mid-section was killing me when I left the theater from the laughs

That's all the more reason why you should buy the DVD!!
If ANY movie had that much of an affect on me I'd certainly want it in my collection.
Sounds to me like you actually had a good time!
Sometimes, even when a particular film is meant to be serious and it turns out laughable, it can still have a substantial amount of entertainment value by the very fact that it made you laugh.

DRIVEN for me wasn't a great movie by any standards but it certainly delivered plenty of excitement and I'd be mighty proud to have a copy in my personal collection, right next to all of my other bad movies.
Bring on the pork
Another great little thread here at the HTF
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[JohnS]

If I remember correctly, Ron gave his opinion/review on Run Lola Run, and Ron WASN'T fond of it. So, he does report on stuff he doesn't like as well.
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[Edited last by JohnS on September 04, 2001 at 04:12 PM]

 

[Colin Jacobson]

Speaking as someone who does it, I find insinuations that DVD reviewers exchange positive reviews for free booty to be highly insulting. Unfortunately, a lot of people seem to think it's true. Perhaps they're jealous that we get $20 DVDs for "free". Lessee... My reviews average about 2000 words, which takes me at least two hours to write, and that doesn't include the time spent with the DVD itself. I'm making a solid $4/hour - what a scam!
For every movie I would have watched if I didn't write reviews, there are literally five or six I never would have screened. Admittedly, I try to stick with titles that interest me, but I still check out a lot of junk I would have skipped if I didn't work for a site.
I won't deny that screeners can be cool, but it's not as one-sided a deal as many think. As I noted, for every hot free title, I get five or six I could live without. It's part of the gig - to broaden the site's horizons, I have to sit through a lot of fairly uninteresting stuff. That's not a complaint, for I enjoy what I do. But it IS a fact - the perks are balanced by the responsibilities. None of us go "Whee!" and play in our piles of free booty while we mock the suckers who have to buy their stuff.
Personally, I don't think any review sites should review only positive articles. That attitude DOES look like they're afraid to bite the hand that feeds them. I agree with some who think that negative reviews are more valuable than positive ones, but both clearly have their place. A bad review may scare someone away from weak product, but a good one may steer someone toward something that they otherwise would avoid. Still, review sites should mix both. I wouldn't trust a site that never met a DVD they didn't like, and I also wouldn't trust anyone who hated everything.
That said, I have no problem with Ron's decision to only review discs that he enjoyed. This isn't a review site, and Ron isn't a "professional" reviewer. He's earned a certain deserved status, but reviewing isn't his regular bag. He does it on occasion, and it's nice when this happens. If he did it full-time, I'd disagree with his "only the good stuff" point of view, but as it stands, I think it's perfectly fine for him to review only the ones he likes.
This thread was fine as long as people just discussed the relative merits of the movie. I didn't like it when some argued that this shouldn't occur, but I think the movie's fair game; Ron liked it, some others did as well, others didn't - it's all part of the forum. However, when certain parties insinuated that Ron was on the take to provide a good review, that's where it really became ugly.
As others have stated, virtually EVERY critic of any sort gets their material for free. Movie reviewers go to free screenings, music reviewers go to free concerts, computer game critics get free software, etc. Hey, sports writers don't have to pay to see the games - maybe there's a sleazy aspect to that as well!
I can't claim that absolutely NO ONE has ever written a positive review because they're happy to get a free DVD, but I believe that such examples are exceedingly rare. As for the argument that studios will cut off our supply if we criticize them, that's a patently absurd thought. If I ever received any sign that a studio started to behave that way, I'd never write up another product of theirs again. Hopefully others would do the same. These folks aren't stupid - they'd never "threaten" us to give them positive reviews because the repercussions would be too negative.
But some folks seem intent on believing that we're all on the take and we lie to get free stuff. As Rob Gillespie implied, there's no way to alter that Flat Earth concept...
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Colin Jacobson
DVD Movie Guide
www.dvdmg.com