Blu-ray Review HTF BLU-RAY REVIEW: Spartacus 50th Anniversary Edition (1 Viewer)

[smithb]

Originally Posted by Douglas Monce
I will admit that there are some films that I have bought that are less than high quality, for 2 reasons, one I just really love the film and want a copy, and two because its unlikely that another release would be coming any time soon.

I feel the same way, which is exactly why I choose to own it.

 

[Douglas R]

Originally Posted by warnerbro

Thank you very much, Kevin. I will. We all respect Mr. Harris' opinion greatly. I still can't believe Universal released this classic film looking like a smeared VHS. I concur with the opinion that it is unwatchable. And the fact that this has been released as high definition!

That sort of hyperbole "smeared VHS" is really absurd and is all too prevalent on forums. Of course it does not look like VHS and it is perfectly watchable and better than any previous versions.

 

[Vincent_P]

Originally Posted by Steve Christou

I managed to get a peek at the new blu-ray a few days ago, as I suspected it wasn't as bad as it's been made out to be. Yes it has DNR, but I'll take a spot of DNR over watching the film through a grainstorm anyday...

SPARTACUS was a large-format production. A proper scan with no obtrusive DNR would not only be practically grain-free to begin with, but would actually have A LOT of fine of detail as opposed to the a-bit-better-than-the-DVD that we have here.


Vincent

 

[Vincent_P]

Originally Posted by Douglas R
That sort of hyperbole "smeared VHS" is really absurd and is all too prevalent on forums. Of course it does not look like VHS and it is perfectly watchable and better than any previous versions.

Agree about some of the hyperbole, but neither Blu-ray nor HD-DVD was touted as "A Little Better than DVD". In Blu-ray's case, it was "Beyond High Definition", and HD-DVD was sold as "the Look and Sound of Perfect". There's no reason either of those descriptive terms couldn't have been truly applicable to SPARTACUS on HD optical media.


Vincent

 

[smithb]

Originally Posted by Vincent_P
Agree about some of the hyperbole, but neither Blu-ray nor HD-DVD was touted as "A Little Better than DVD". In Blu-ray's case, it was "Beyond High Definition", and HD-DVD was sold as "the Look and Sound of Perfect". There's no reason either of those descriptive terms couldn't have been truly applicable to SPARTACUS on HD optical media.


Vincent

No argument there. But this is really no different then when DVD was touted over VHS. For the most part all DVDs could have been as good as the best that have ever been produced. In the end, it just didn't happen. So at times it does come down to what is good enough when it comes to a BD purchase.

 

[LarryH]

Originally Posted by Steve Christou


I took a couple of shots from the film ...

Even though these shots could not possibly convey an accurate representation of a good HD image, even they appear to me to present a disappointing picture quality and confirm the correctness of my decision not to purchase this release.

 

[RobertR]

Originally Posted by LarryH




Even though these shots could not possibly convey an accurate representation of a good HD image, even they appear to me to present a disappointing picture quality and confirm the correctness of my decision not to purchase this release.

Olivier looks more like his representation at Madame Tussauds than a real person in that shot.

 

[Vincent_P]

Originally Posted by smithb ... this is really no different then when DVD was touted over VHS. For the most part all DVDs could have been as good as the best that have ever been produced. In the end, it just didn't happen. So at times it does come down to what is good enough when it comes to a BD purchase.

In the very beginning of DVD, perhaps- but we are now into Blu-ray's FOURTH YEAR. There is NO EXCUSE for this. If you want to keep playing the Kevin Bacon character in ANIMAL HOUSE ("Thank you, sir, may I have another!?") then fine, but those of us who actually give a damn about Blu-ray and the level of quality the format is actually able to achieve will continue to refuse to do accept 10-year-plus old masters that have been put through the DNR ringer as being 'acceptable' just because they are a wee bit better than their DVD counterparts.

Vincent

 

[Robert Harris]

Quote:

Originally Posted by smithb

No argument there. But this is really no different then when DVD was touted over VHS. For the most part all DVDs could have been as good as the best that have ever been produced. In the end, it just didn't happen. So at times it does come down to what is good enough when it comes to a BD purchase.

It only comes down to "what is good enough" is one permits it.


RAH

 

[smithb]

Originally Posted by Vincent_P
In the very beginning of DVD, perhaps- but we are now into Blu-ray's FOURTH YEAR. There is NO EXCUSE for this. If you want to keep playing the Kevin Bacon character in ANIMAL HOUSE ("Thank you, sir, may I have another!?") then fine, but those of us who actually give a damn about Blu-ray and the level of quality the format is actually able to achieve will continue to refuse to do accept 10-year-plus old masters that have been put through the DNR ringer as being 'acceptable' just because they are a wee bit better than their DVD counterparts.

Vincent

Sorry, but there are still plenty of DVD's produced each year that don't live up to the potential that DVD has to offer. Even 12+ years later, so 4 years for BD's is nothing. And it will continue.


Hey we all have are areas of principle where it is our way or no way. And if there were any real convincing evidence that by not purchasing we would get better transfers in the future then fine I would be with you. But personally I don't see it and I'd rather have the enjoyment of watching a film is less then perfect condition (or even better then previous condition) over not having it at all.

 

[smithb]

Originally Posted by Robert Harris

Quote:


It only comes down to "what is good enough" is one permits it.


RAH

And you have to be willing to live with the consequences. And the conseqiences in this case could be some films not coming out at all on BD at all.


This is really not all that different then the movie on demand "MOD" concept in that many have argued that if you accept this approach then we may me telling the studios we are willing to settle for DVD-R type releases with little to no cleanup at all. Yet without it the probablility is that many of these would never see the light of day, leaving just old VHS releases or nothing at all.


So in my case, I'm willing to permit "good enough" for a movie I really want because the vast majority of buyers aren't going to care and I don't believe being overly principled in this case will solve much.

 

[smithb]

I also don't believe in the concept of not buying to send the studios a message works in this case. At least not in regards to the message you are trying to send.


To me it looks like studios continue to go with the typical corporate "low risk" and "high profitability" route. Look at what keeps coming out in the theaters. Remake after remake and what's hot at the moment (super hero, CGI- based) becuase they want to stick with proven commodities.


Same with how they approach DVD and BD releases. If they have what they believe is a "good enough" master they will go with it to keep costs down. If sales are good and profits high then they have a proven commodity. That's when the double and triple dips come out with continually better video/audio (new masters) and extras. So if a new Spartacus does actually get re-released to BD with a new transfer some day, you may actually need to thank those that did purchase the earlier release, because it may have been those purchases that actually funded that new transfer.


A highly principled approach (while commendable) does not always get you what you want.

 

[Steve Christou]

What Brad said, not buying classic movies on blu-ray because they don't look all that much better than DVD will send the wrong signal to the studios - old movies don't sell. And they will, quite rightly, concentrate on new stuff. Why should they release The Ten Commandments on blu-ray when only a handful of us are likely to buy it, the rest will no doubt find some excuse to cancel their orders. "too soft", "looks like vhs", "perfectly horrid", "too gorgeous, that can't be right, I'm returning it", "not enough grain".

 

[TravisR]

Originally Posted by Steve Christou
What Brad said, not buying classic movies on blu-ray because they don't look all that much better than DVD will send the wrong signal to the studios - old movies don't sell.

I think that could be the case if the disc isn't embroiled in 'controversy'. If Spartacus isn't selling as well as Universal had hoped, they know the reason why.

 

[Edwin-S]

So people should buy and be satisfied with poor quality merchandise; otherwise, the studios will stop releasing "classic" films on Blu-ray? The flip side of that coin is that studios will look at sales of poor quality garbage and say, "look, they'll accept anything we spew out, so why waste money repairing, restoring or cleaning these films? They are so desperate for classics that they'll swallow anything we barf out".

 

[Steve Christou]

Has Universal publically admitted that something went wrong with the Spartacus blu-ray? If not than they are happy with the release and there is no controversy, except what you see here.

 

[TravisR]

Originally Posted by Steve Christou

Has Universal publically admitted that something went wrong with the Spartacus blu-ray? If not than they are happy with the release and there is no controversy, except what you see here.

How often do you see a studio admit that they were wrong?


And the controversy that you see here and other message boards is a rare case where those people may actually represent a good chunk of prospective buyers for this title.

 

[smithb]

Originally Posted by Edwin-S

So people should buy and be satisfied with poor quality merchandise; otherwise, the studios will stop releasing "classic" films on Blu-ray? The flip side of that coin is that studios will look at sales of poor quality garbage and say, "look, they'll accept anything we spew out, so why waste money repairing, restoring or cleaning these films? They are so desperate for classics that they'll swallow anything we barf out".

Nobody should buy what they consider poor quality merchandise. What denotes poor quality can many times be subjective or in degrees. So if you think it is poor quality then don't buy it. Obviously, those buying it disagree.


I believe studios make basic cost vs return decisions. They don't purposely put out bad merchandise. So your argument makes no sense to me. Some times they will make ill advised choices but I don't believe it is in any way to put one over on the consumer.


But what I have seen pretty consistently is that when they have a hot commodity they tend to put out new editions (extended, ultimate, unrated) with more features and higher quality. Something has to justify the additional expense and it is usually previous sales. I've also seen where some titles that have been poor sellers are consistently on the shelf with the same old tired release for 10 years.


Take a look at the initial DVD offerrings of the James Bond movies. They were pretty bad but eventually they were able to justify creating brand new HD transfers and the latest DVD and BD releases are excellent. Big business doesn't necessary like to take risks.


Unfortunately, it is too often the consumer that bears the burden. So in my opinion bad sales to make a point when it is really something you want, is a message that may not bring about the desired results.

 

[warnerbro]

Enough of the other blu-ray makers do it correctly for us to worry about offending Universal to the point they won't release any more classics. A STAR IS BORN is sharp and has healthy grain as well as many Criterion releases.

 

[Steve Christou]

Wasn't Gladiator re-released or is being re-released, was that Universal?

Originally Posted by Edwin-S /forum/thread/301104/htf-blu-ray-review-spartacus-50th-anniversary-edition/30#post_3703659