Howard Stern signed to Sirius (1 Viewer)

[Ronald Epstein]

You know, everybody is excited about Sirius and
Stern. My thoughts are this....

Stern is not as good as Opie and Anthony. I wish
more people would give O&A a try.

Have you guys listened to the music on Sirius?
It's horrible compared to what XM plays. I have
never overexaggerated when I said that the Sirius
playlists are kept tight and the same songs and
artists are played over and over again.

In addition to my listening experiences, I can
point to new threads over at SBS which confirm
this is still happening.

I'm just warning those contemplating Sirius that
the music is not a priority with that network.

 

[Chris]

Why Ron, if I didn't know better, I'd say your absolutely sour grapes

I am well aware of your musical opinion, and I know what you think of that. That having been said, SIRIUS has had a series of very good "gets"..

While SIRIUS doesn't fulfill your idea of what makes for a good music mix, for me, it's about right, when I do want to flick over to a music station, I can pretty much guarantee I'll hear something I know unedited.

SIRIUS has had a good year for music "gets" as well, signing Eminem to exclusive agreement for music releases and to produce his own channel, starting in December. So far, SIRIUS has been able to use this agreement with his label to offer out complete plays of albums, unreleased material, etc. for that audience. SIRIUS's live concert broadcasts for their Bluegrass stream weekly and broadcasts of the Newport Jazz Festival in it's entirety, as well as gets like Bruce Springsteen live in Concert don't hurt.

XM does, by all accounts, have deeper playlists, especially within it's genre fields. This I think is something that should be acknowledged. XM plays a deeper depth of songs, including songs with not as high a chart position as SIRIUS. SIRIUS seems enamored with playing songs everyone knows within standard channels.. which I have no problem with that either, but may not offer the esoteric level that XM wants.

For hip-hop lovers, the up coming opportunity (and continued access) to exclusive material as provided by SIRIUS's agreement with Eminem via Stream 45, Shade 45 as it will be called is a good start. The Hip-Hop mix is, at times, very top-25 oriented, then again, IMHO, to quote Chuck-D, Hip-Hop is like CNN, old news doesn't need to be repeated...

On the other side, having a wife from Jamaica, we get to listen to their Reggae channel is, IMHO, very good, managing to mix in tracks from artists that I haven't heard in a while that more accurately reflect where the music came from and is.

Is SIRIUS everything music fans want in comparison to XM? No, but it has made some progress there as well. If Stern takes over programming music for two other channels, that means 5 streams which will be controlled by outsiders to programming (2 for Howard, 1 for Eminem, 1 for Van Zandt, 1 for Geronimo).

In regards to other access, SIRIUS has managed to try for a stranglehold on other segments of the market.

By providing exclusive access to:

The NFL
The NHL
College Football & Basketball for numerous schools (including USC, Oklahoma, Nebraska, Florida, Ohio State, Louisiana State, Michigan, Colorado, Texas, and so on)

They've pretty much blanketted the sports fans.

SIRIUS did a good job grabbing the exclusives when they needed to offer something different then XM. I feel like there are many who listen to lots of music who will chose XM (which isn't me) and there are many who will find within SIRIUS what they want that isn't on XM.

That's the art of a good business plan, be different then the other guy As SIRIUS grows, and at least according to Merryl Lynch their sales are already up 34% since the start of the NFL season, it helps all channels round themselves out with the additional income which provides for unique placements.

Now, I wouldn't listen to Howard because it's just not my bag. As I said in another thread, if someone told me Dr. Laura signed an exclusive with XM, I might think about it. But sports would probably keep me where I'm at. Still, acknowledging that, I can view from a business sense the reality of SIRIUS putting together a series of good "GETS" for their network.

 

[Michael St. Clair]

I've listened to O&A. Still do occasionally. Most of the time, I'd rather have Stern.

If XM had gotten NFL and Stern, I'd go XM. At this point, XM is dead to me.

I'm a huge music lover but I keep an amazing rotation going through in my Karma (which I can play in my car) including band-authorized live recordings (from etree, easytree, bittorrent) that don't get play on terrestrial or satellite.

Music is not the killer app for satellite, anyway. Exclusive talk and sports programs are. They will sell subs in a way that music cannot.

 

[BrianAe]

Your experience with Sirius and XM are really based upon what types of music you listen to, how many different channels you listen to and how really adverse you are to replys.

I tend to listen to the more diverse Sirius channels and there are lots of channels I listen to. I especially like the jam bands channel. Sirius is nothing like FM on any of the channels I listen to. I've had it for probably 4 months now. Yes, there are songs I have heard to much, maybe 2-3 times a week. Still, there are new bands that I have really grown to like by hearing the same song enough times to really learn to appreciate it. When I was trying out XM, it was like, "that was cool, too bad I'll never hear it again".

At least for the rock channels, Ron is partially right, but greatly exaggerates.

 

[TheLongshot]

I think both are. There are some of us who don't give a crap about talk radio (like myself), and those of us who don't give a crap about music.

I do think music is a killer app for satelite, because there is so much of it out there, and terrestial radio can not even remotly cover it.

Problem is, Sirius doesn't even go into that potential. Just repeat the same hits people have been hearing for years, just with greater bandwidth. True, that's fine for a lot of people, but for those of us who are tired of what FM has been feeding us for years, and have large CD collections that often go outside the mainstream, it just isn't good enough.

While I admit that XM isn't perfect, I think they are going down the right path, moreso than Sirius, which seems to get lamer as time goes on.

Jason

 

[Ronald Epstein]

Jason knows the deal.

Go to the SIRIUS message forum. Look how
many complaints still get posted about repeats.

I was at Sirius headquarters. The programmers
told me that they want tight playlists. They
are all FM-orientated people and they believe
satellite radio should play like FM radio.

...but the disc jockeys over there were/are
fuming over the fact that there was/is no creative
control other than playing the same songs over
and over again.

No, I am not exaggerating. The music on Sirius
has been a problem since the very beginning. There
has always been a strict policy against broadening
the playlists. Since Sirius is more corporate
controlled than XM, rumor has it that some of
the channels was/are programmed by the Corporates
themselves who have no experience in programming.

I use past and present tense in the paragraphs
above because I don't know if the situation has
changed there or not. What I can tell you is
that Sirius continues to be totally unlistenable
for me on many streams because they keep playing
the same familiar hits and artists over and over
and over again.

Last week I was in the car with my Mother taking
her out to lunch. We were listening to Sirius'
Best of Broadway as we always do when I
have her in the car. We only hear it for 30
minutes every week. I was surprised to hear her
comment that the channel was playing the same two
songs she heard the week before. She was right.

I am happy that fans are going to be able to
listen to Stern on Sirius radio. Just be aware
that there is a major downgrade in music
programming over XM radio and that is bound
to frustrate new listeners who expected more.

 

[BrianAe]

Actually Ron, your right about Best of Broadway. On the other hand, I listen to Standard Time a lot and almost never hear any repeats. Which is impressive given that it's, well, standards. Check that out next time your driving with your mom...

 

[Michael St. Clair]

Music is not the killer app because there are other ways people can listen to the music that they love (CDs, iPod, Shoutcast, etc). Talk and sports are all about exclusive, live content that is not available elsewhere.

I understand that for some music is the reason to pay for satellite radio but I guarantee you that talk and sports are the killer apps and are what will drive satellite radio to critical mass. Over the next few years you are going to see subscriber numbers grow in ways that music cannot spur, and the reason is going to be the exclusive deals like we are seeing now with NFL and Stern. And if XM doesn't get competitive in this area, they will be in second place. Not that there is anything terrible about being in second place...DISH Network is doing just fine, for example.

 

[TheLongshot]

You are correct that I don't listen to radio to just listen to the music that I love. I listen to radio to discover new bands, to broaden my horizons. On this respect, Sirius has totally lost the point. I don't need endless repetition of the same songs that got radio airplay. I can get that for free. What I want is stuff that perhap I haven't heard before, mixed in with stuff that I do know. That's where XM comes in in spades.

As I said, talk radio does nothing for me, and I can't ever see myself paying for just that. It certainly isn't a killer app in my eyes. Not to mention that the guys that I do enjoy, far more than Stern or O&A (Don & Mike and Kirk, Mark, & Lopez.), I don't need to pay for. There is also the fact that there will be young up-and-comers who will fill in the gaps on FM, so I don't think that aspect of radio will die off because of Stern and O&A.

Jason

PS - And even if those two groups of jocks actually went to satelite, that still wouldn't sell me on satelite radio. For me, it is all about the music.

 

[Joe McCabe]

I've been a Stern fan since 86. But, simply put, the guy just doesn't have it anymore. His entire gimmick centered around being held back by the establishment.
Well, now, he's actually gonna have to do something. He's gonna have to work. Which he's pretty much a stranger to at this point.

The simplest breakdown here is Stern doesn't have (I can't believe I'm about to use this terminology) The Eye Of The Tiger, anymore. He's reached the pinnacle of his business.
He's complacent and lazy. Living off of a reputation he earned LONG ago.

Stern's best days are behind him, and Opie and Anthony's best days are ahead of them. They're consistantly funny than him, on any given day of the week. They're hungry for the success that Stern has had, for longer than they've been a team.

The other key factor here is shock value. The concept of Stern being able to be as shocking as he wants, will be the motivation for most, to pony up the cash for Sirius.

But, how shocking will he seem, after O&A have already covered all of those bases 15 months from now?

No sale.

 

[William Laughner]

I listened to Opie & Anthony this week while Stern was doing commercial breaks and I just don't get the appeal. The show sounded very unprofessional and just wasnt funny. These guys must really hate that Stern doesn't acknowledge them at all, every time I turned on the show they were making fun of Howard. It was actually sad to listen to these two guys try and be funny making fun of Stern. There are some major sour grapes going on with Opie & Anthony.

Yes, the Stern Show is not nearly as funny or entertaining as it was 10 years ago...but that was before the pressure and FCC fines. When I listened to Stern this week I could hear the excitment and vigor in his voice, he is truly excited about moving it Sirius. The idea of Stern being able to do the show he loves without having to worry about censorship is AWESOME and I can't wait for it.

 

[Brian L]

And the other night when I surfed to Howards show on E, they were having a contest to see who had the worst hemroids (sorry I can't spell it and spell checker is not offering up a correction), and having contestants drop their pants so they could all have a look.

Normally when I surf over to Howard its interviews with porn stars, lesbians, or trying to guess which women have fake boobs.

I am sure that there is entertainment value there somewhere, for someone. But not for me, thats for sure. Both of these shows appeal to an audience the likes of which I am clearly not a member. I'll take Imus any day of the week.

But I guess we have 15 months to debate the merits of his signing, and whether or not it pans out. I personally will be shocked if the majority of his listeners take the bait, although I do understand that only a small fraction need to do so for this to work out for Sirius.

And I still wonder what message this sends to his loyal fans.

BGL

 

[Chris]

I think that depends on your flavor of Music.

Each week newer and unreleased, unsigned hip-hop acts get a showcase on many of the urban channels, providing access to artists you may not have heard before. Since their arrangement with Eminem, new releases by D-12, Eminem, and his label acts debut on SIRIUS weeks before anywhere else. This includes new acts.

BlueGrass also provides a live showcase for new music, and devotees to live music via festivals, etc.

SIRIUS also was the only one offering live presentation of Newport Jazz Festival, etc.

Now, admittedly, as I said, I don't listen to music hardly at all via SIRIUS.. outside of Radio Disney, which I could catch on either satellite for my kids. But, I think it's a little dismissive to say "all music sucks".. After all, I was pleasently suprised and happy when SIRIUS Broadway mixed in "Avenue Q" songs, etc. which are not your typical broadway

Could SIRIUS improve their music? Yeah, I guess so. Pretty much, if I wnat to listen to music, that's why I have an IPOD, etc. There are tracks that will never play on either SIRIUS or XM because they are "mashups" or unsigned, unreleased (like MCChris, http://www.mcchris.com/) etc.

I think each network offers something truly unique that the other doesn't have.

And it's fair for Ron to say he dislikes the music on SIRIUS. He's entitled to that opinion. I think, however, it's somewhat of a misnomer to state an opinion as fact. There are lots of people (like myself) who don't mind SIRIUS's music mix when I tune into the channels on occassion when I do want to listen. And some SIRIUS original programming has grown on me (like the Wiseguy's Show) .. but to be honest, the biggest "hurray!" for me from SIRIUS recently were the NFL and the move to put the entire hour of Cartalk into repeats more often so I have a better chance to catch it

 

[Jeff Adkins]

Sirius Music Channels are essentially FM radio without the commercials. The interesting thing about XM is that much of what they play were hits in their time, but haven't survived to make it onto the current FM playlists. I do most of the songs I hear on the XM channels I listen to, but many of the songs are ones I haven't heard on FM radio in many years. I don't think XM is nearly as esoteric as some people make it sound.

The whole "NFL" thing makes a nice soundbite to throw out there but it's way overrated even to a die-hard NFL fan like myself. First of all, we're basically talking about 17 days a year since all playoffs and the Sunday and Monday night games are readily available on AM radio. Whatever your local team is, is also carried over terrestrial radio. So what are you really getting? Not much of anything for 349 days a year. I get the Colts and the Sunday and Monday night games on terrestrial radio and I spend Sunday afternoons in front of my big screen, not listening to the radio. So while it sounds cool to say "Yeah, but Sirius has the NFL", it really isn't all that useful.


Every time I turn on Howard he's talking to one of his interns.

 

[Chris]

Uh, well, this is way wrong (IMHO). While I am a Chiefs fan, my wife, a Florida native, is a Tampa Bay fan. Being able to listen to the Bay games, by their home announcers, is a big benefit. NFL radio is 24/7, 365 with everything from draft to preseason to training camps, talent evaluation, fantasy football, etc.

I listen to NFL radio more during the week then weekends, but due to my job, I drive every Sunday, 7 hours in one day (3.5 hours there, 3.5 hours back).. so having the home call as I want to hear it? Or, being able to turn on the home call and watch the game in HD with the announcers I want to hear calling the game?

Priceless, IMHO.. worth the subscriptiona lone.

 

[William Laughner]

I don't know the back story on the conflict between Opie & Anthony vs. Stern...but it doesn't change the fact their show sounds like it is broadcast out of a bathroom with their best friends in the background providing the laughtrack. It sounds like every other "Wacky Morning Duo" I've heard across the country...with lower production values. Opie & Anthony might as well be "Boomer and The Nudge". Yes, I was a fan of the show in the 80's & 90's and I remember the multiple "Funerals" that Stern had for his competitors...but Opie & Anthony weren't his competitors, I think they were on a sister station in the afternoons. I am going to give the benefit of the doubt to Stern on this one, Opie & Anthony must have done something to piss Howard off enough for Howard to want a gag order placed on them.

 

[Ronald Epstein]

William,

As a long-time O&A listener I can assure
you the show is not nearly up-to-speed yet.

The production value does sound like college
radio because a studio is being built around
these guys and nothing is in place yet. Heck,
they don't even have their soundbytes fully
prepared yet.

Back on WNEW they were a well-oiled machine.
They now have to start totally from scratch.

What you are hearing now is not representative
of what they should sound like.

 

[Reni D]

Well Im just Happy The Howard is going to Satellite radio and I'll be buying Sirius soon

 

[Jose Q]

All kidding aside with Ron, let me add my 2 cents...

Should SIRIUS playlist be deeper? sure. Is it as untolerable as some say? That's a matter of opinion.

I do agree that the exclusives is what's going to make the masses flock to either service and not the music. People still don't see a point on paying for radio. Is the mentality of old way back when with tv and cable. Why pay for television? Then you got HBO. Then you got stations that your local stations won't show. Then you got more sports. It expanded in that direction. May be my cable tv analogy doesn't fit 100% but you get my point. Is about the exclusive stuff. That's why some are locked on DirecTV and the NFL.

That's the wild card: the content that people talk about, what they hear their friends talk about, what they see advertised (Tom Brady and John Madden, pretty soon Stern and Eminem) and the names they recognize. This is the mentality that most people have and what will make them pick. Not the dept of the playlist that some of us focus on. Average guy thinks: "I'm cool...I got the one with Eminem and Stern".

So far advertising "commercial free radio" has worked but many still need more than that. Offering music is sadly just not enough. Which is (to me) the equivalent of offering a Superbit edition DVD. Us here in the HTF love it for the presentation quality but the rest of the average public wants more.

The concept of what satellite radio is/should be varies depending on who you talk to. Some say it should be more music oriented and everything else be secondary so they choose XM. Others say it should be an alternative to FM with more varied uncensored programing including sports and talk entertainment with recognizable hits commercial free music and those pick SIRIUS. Some of us do hope for an increase on the dept of playlist but we enjoy SIRIUS very much as it is right now.

As a SIRIUS subscriber I am happy with my service (built-in dash unit on my new 2005 Ford Escape) and I am glad that there is competition out there. I tell you this: SIRIUS has a plan and that's more than I can say about XM lately. They seem to be very comfortable in their lead and need MLB or something else BIG before SIRIUS takes more share.

 

[Ronald Epstein]

Jose,

I agree with you regarding the fact that
people will seek different programming needs
with the satellite radio they choose.

For me, it's all about the music and Sirius
has never put any thought or creativity into
their music programming. They basically take
the same few hundred songs and throw it into
heavy rotation. Casual listeners will never
notice it -- others will find Sirius unlistenable.

As much as you may think Sirius is being
innovative with all the big-named talent
they are bringing aboard -- they are also
putting themselves out there to possibly go
financially belly-up.

Most financial anylists look at the $500Mill
Howard Stern deal as totally absurd. They
feel that deal will put Sirius in a highly
volatile financial situation. Some say it
could be the end of Sirius if it all goes wrong.

I have nothing against anyone that opts to go
to Sirius but after the problems I had over there,
I am going to make certain that potential subscribers
are aware that it isn't a service for musicphiles.