How do you describe "Black Crush?"

Discussion in 'Playback Devices' started by ChuckSolo, Oct 23, 2004.

  1. ChuckSolo

    ChuckSolo Screenwriter

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    What exactly is "black crush?" I recently bought, about 2 months ago, a Samsung HD841 upscaling DVD player and have heard the talk and about "black crush" on DVD players of this type. I have mine hooked via the DVI connection on my RCA 40" HDRPTV and, to my eyes at least, the picture in 1080i appears to be excellent. I also have a Gateway DVD recorder and have compared the picture on each and the Samsung in 1080i mode is definately superior to the 480p on the Gateway. SACD playback on the Samsung is great too. So far, the Samsung has played everything I have put in it and never skipped a beat. The picture looks great to me, this alleged "black crush" not withstanding.
     
  2. ChristopherDAC

    ChristopherDAC Producer

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    Well, I wouldn't expect to get Black Crush through a DVI connection anyway, since it's really a decoding issue and DVI passes a bitstream wihtout decoding. Of course, if the processing in the player were severely mishandled it could be a problem; what you would experience would be akin to turning the "brightness" control up too high, that is, a reduction of contrast levels in dark scenes.
     
  3. EricRWem

    EricRWem Screenwriter

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    It's practically a Samsung hallmark in all of their DVD players, this black crush. I honestly don't think Samsung knows how to make a quality, stable DVD Player. They're much better in other areas of the market. DVD players are their weak spot by far, imho.

    This should interest you.http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/cgi-b...deInt=0&mpeg=0
     
  4. Allan Jayne

    Allan Jayne Cinematographer

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    Black crush means that the darkest grays are not distinguishable from black.

    Does the player have its own brightness and contrast controls? The brightness control may be in the form of a two way selection "normal black" and "enhanced black".

    You will need a test disk such as AVIA with a gray scale block or step test pattern. You will need to use trial and error to adjust both the DVD player brightness control and the TV brightness control to try to get all the darker steps in the gray scale pattern distinguishable.

    The best calibration will differ if the room light level changes such as daytime versus nighttime viewing with the windows not fully blacked out.

    (Use the contrast control to get all of the lighter steps to be distinguishable, and go back and forth with brightness and contrast until you get it as best as you can.)

    Video hints:
    http://members.aol.com/ajaynejr/blacker.htm
     
  5. EricRWem

    EricRWem Screenwriter

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    If he doesn't see flaws, don't go looking for flaws. [​IMG]
     
  6. Steven_Lazarus

    Steven_Lazarus Stunt Coordinator

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    The only "Crush" I'm familiar with is the "Orange Crush" Denver Broncos defense from the eighties [​IMG] [​IMG]
    Maybe it's a new Pittsburgh or Ravens defensive nickname??? [​IMG]

    Seriously, like Eric said, if you don't see a problem don't go looking for one !!!! Just sit back and enjoy the beautiful picture. Although I do recommend a calibration session using Avia or DVE, might make your great picture even greater !!! [​IMG]
     
  7. EricRWem

    EricRWem Screenwriter

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    [​IMG] [​IMG]
     
  8. ChuckSolo

    ChuckSolo Screenwriter

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    Thanks for the replies guys. I have had my TV calibrated and everything looks fine. It's just that I had heard it talked about and wanted a definition of the phenomenon. Thanks again.
     
  9. RichP

    RichP Second Unit

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    Just want to clear up a misstatement here.

    A DVD player still has to decode the MPEG-2 stream regardless of what output connection you are using. DVI simply means that the resulting NTSC video is not converted to analog, but is sent out as a digital signal.

    This does not however, make DVI immune to MPEG-2 decoder flaws such as black or white crush.
     

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