How do I ON/OFF trigger a BIG Power Amp ???

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by Shawn Sefranek, Jan 25, 2002.

  1. Shawn Sefranek

    Shawn Sefranek Second Unit

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    Here is a partial Equipment list:

    Lexicon DC-1

    Parasound HCA-2003A (220 Watts x 3)

    B&K Video-5 Sonata (105 Watts x 5)

    Samson S1000 (500 Watts x 2)

    (2) Panamax Max 1000+ Surge Protector / Line Conditioner

    I’m looking to remotely turn ON/OFF the Samson S1000 that will be running my SVS plus Subs.

    Right now I have an X-10 console that triggers one of my Panamax Max 1000+ units.

    The Parasound & B&K Amps are plugged into the Panamax so they go ON/OFF with that.

    The Samson is going to be plugged in the other Panamax, which is always powered up.

    I got one of the X-10 3-Prong “Appliance Modules” to use, but I’m not sure if it’s going to work.

    According to the back panel, the Samson can draw up to 725 Watts but the X-10 module is only good for 500 Max.

    I don’t know if it is a good idea to use it in this application.

    Is there another kind of relay that can handle THAT much power?

    Any ideas?

    What are others doing in this type of application?

    Thanks,

    Shawn S
     
  2. Kevin C Brown

    Kevin C Brown Producer

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    Shawn- I have used both a more cheaper Adcom ACE 615 and a lot more expensive Equi=Tech 2Q, to switch on my *two* Acurus A200x3 power amps, plus a Vandersteen V2W sub, plus a whole bunch of other stuff with no problems.
    (Plus, at one time, had a Velodyne HGS-12. Class D switching power supply rated at over 1000W.)
    BTW, that Parasound is a great 3 channel amp. Have looked at that while deciding for the Acurus' I eventually got. [​IMG]
     
  3. Ron Boster

    Ron Boster Screenwriter

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    Shawn:

    I used an X10 appliance module to tigger the amp that Buttkicker sells with their unit. It is 1,000 watts. I called and spoke with a service tech from Smarthomes prior to using the X10 and they said not to worry. I have had this set up for over a year with no problems.'

    Ron
     
  4. GordonL

    GordonL Supporting Actor

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    The X-10 module should work because it's unlikely that the Samson will ever draw the full 725 watts. Your house will probably come down if you were to drive your subs using that much power. [​IMG] But, if you want an alternative, www.nilesaudio.com makes a 12v triggered outlet strip that will handle 1500 watts. The model # is AC-3.
     
  5. Legairre

    Legairre Supporting Actor

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    I use this. It's 12v AC that converts to DC. It also comes with adaptaplugs(even one for a miniplug) so you can use the same end the amps trigger is looking for. Check it out. It works great.
    Oh yeah, if you use the adaptaplugs and the amp doesn't turn off and on you have the pos and neg reversed. The the adaptaplugs aren't maked for pos and neg.
    http://www.radioshack.com/product.as...Fid=273%2D1662
     
  6. Shawn Sefranek

    Shawn Sefranek Second Unit

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    Legairre,

    I see what you’re suggesting, but the problem is the S1000 doesn’t have a trigger input to turn it ON/OFF.

    I have the X-10 appliance module hooked up and it turns the Samson ON/OFF just fine without a load.

    My SVS PLUS subs aren’t expected until later this week so hopefully I’ll be trying it out this weekend.

    Shawn S
     
  7. James Mudler

    James Mudler Stunt Coordinator

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    Shawn,
    Are you using the 12v triggers on the DC-1 to turn on both panamax 1000+? I am using (2) max 1000+ and (2) 130x6 amps with a Dc-1 with no problems. I am thinking you could plug the S1000 into the X-10 mod, if for subs. I personally do not like X-10 on amps for mains or sounds.
    Here is what I did. The header says MC-1 but he text says DC-1. I referenced the DC-1 manual for pin diagram.
    http://www.smr-home-theatre.org/Lexi...1/panamax.html
     
  8. Shawn Sefranek

    Shawn Sefranek Second Unit

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    James,
    I was using the DC-1 output trigger to turn the one Max 1000+ unit on/off with that very same cable but last year for some reason my DC-1 stopped outputting the 12-volt trigger signal.
    I rewired the system with an X-10 “Powerhouse IR control unit" so I can control the Amps with a macro programmed into my RC-2000 MkII when I start up the system.
    Now I'm adding the Samson and the Max 1000+ that I have the other two Amps plugged into is already at its 1800-Watt capacity.
    The other Max 1000+ is running with ALL the outlets "HOT" so that is why I'm using the Appliance Module to control the ON/OFF of the S1000.
    Shawn S
    Here is a picture of the X-10 IR controller.
    [​IMG]
     
  9. James Mudler

    James Mudler Stunt Coordinator

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    Shawn,

    That stinks your tigger is not working. What pins are/were you using? Maybe you can use differ pins and everything would work. For example Pin 1 and 3 will work and pin 2 or pin 1 and 5 will work if the triggers are enabled in the menu setup.

    Another option, do you have any other conponets that have a 110v switched output? Most cable boxes do. You could use that as the master. Just brainstorming, I use X-10 for lighting but personally, would stay away from putting them on my amps. Sub amp would not bother me as much.

    Last resort, have you contacted Lexicon? Maybe a fuse or something simple.

    From lexi's site

    Pin layout

    1) ground

    2) ground

    3) Power on

    4) Unused

    5) Trigger (programable)
     
  10. James Mudler

    James Mudler Stunt Coordinator

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    After reading Panamax's warranty

    You made be voiding the warranty if your panamax is pluged in a x10 module. If that is a big deal to you.
     
  11. Shawn Sefranek

    Shawn Sefranek Second Unit

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    I checked with a meter and all the trigger pins are dead.

    It worked for two years and suddenly stopped working.

    I contacted Lexicon and all they could offer was to have me send it in and pay like 150 bucks to repair.

    They said there are NO user replaceable fuses inside.

    They even gave me the panel codes to “flash” the memory in the main board and reset everything.

    Didn’t work.

    I figured if there was ONE thing that could go wrong with the unit, I guess that is one of the “better” ones.

    Anyway back to the problem at hand.

    I have no other equipment that has a switched outlet which is why I got the X-10 unit.

    As for the Panamax warrantee issue, I don’t think it’s really an issue.

    The Max 1000+ isn’t actually “plugged into” the X-10, only the current sensing wire is.

    The main power supply is plugged directly into a grounded wall outlet.

    Shawn S
     
  12. DannyL

    DannyL Stunt Coordinator

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    James, have you actually tried running an amplifier through the x-10 module and did you notice sonic degradation? i am also curious about using the x-10 modules because my aragon amplifier does not have a 12volt trigger.
     
  13. Shawn Sefranek

    Shawn Sefranek Second Unit

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    I really don’t see how the module could degrade the sound of the Amp.

    All it is doing is acting as a relay for A/C voltage and turning it ON/OFF.

    The original post was just to express my worry that I might be overloading the module with the power draw from the Samson.

    Shawn S
     
  14. James Mudler

    James Mudler Stunt Coordinator

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    Shawn,
    I can't see paying $150 either. Shipping cost too.... probably closer to $200. I did not realise only your current sensing lead is the only thing plugged into the X-10 mod. Great solution. What gauge wire is your HT wired? Outlet rating...breakers? I would think you would trip one of those first if all you gear is on one or two outlets. You should be safe with a 20 amp module for the samson. Here is a 30amp x-10 module. I doubt you would ever have a problems with it.
    http://www.smarthome.com/2242.html
    Danny L,
    I did hear a difference with a X-10 module. My wife noticed it big time. By no means do I have golden ears. This was before I added the Panamax 1000+. Now it turns everything on and off. You can find a 1000+ for $150, it got mine at Consumer Direct.
    If you take apart a 20amp X-10 module you will see the quality of contruction and moving parts. Your power is going thru all of this. If it can be avoided, I would. I have melted a X-10 appliance module in my woodshop on my dust collector. A co-worker did the same with Christmas lights (may have overloadeded it [​IMG] ).
     
  15. Shawn Sefranek

    Shawn Sefranek Second Unit

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    James,

    All my gear is wired into TWO side-by-side outlets (4) plugs total.

    They feed directly from a dedicated 20-AMP circuit breaker.

    This line is just for the Theater Equipment and nothing else in the room shares this line.

    My father is an Electrician and he kind of laughed at me when I specified this during the install.

    But I think after seeing the ever growing rack of black boxes he now understands why I wanted it this way.

    No problem yet, but my SVS’s don’t show up until tomorrow so I haven’t yet put a load on the Amp.

    Shawn S
     
  16. James Mudler

    James Mudler Stunt Coordinator

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    Shawn it is funny. We have nearly identical setups. Same electrical setup too. Each outlet on it's own 20 amp breaker here too. My wife thought I was nuts, but understands now that is nearing completion. A few cosmetics left. Have your dad measure the current draw on the Samson and then you would know for sure. I guessing under 10 amps
     
  17. Larry Chanin

    Larry Chanin Stunt Coordinator

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    Shawn:

    I hoped I haven't missed some subtle point, but your Panamax 1000+s have a control wire with a standard two prong plug. If you plug one of them into a power outlet on the Lexicon it will power up your Panamax when it powers up. I assume your Lex has an outlet.

    If so, wouldn't this be the most straight forward means of powering on your sub amplifier? You shouldn't even need an X-10 device to trigger your Panamax.

    Larry

    EDIT: My apologies, I see that the Lex doesn't have a power outlet.:b
     

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