How dark do you really need for a projector

Jeff Leeds

Stunt Coordinator
Joined
Aug 10, 1999
Messages
131
I finally got my wife to concede our biggest main room for a home theater. While I cannot fit enough chairs I will be putting in a huge sofa and maybe 2 HT chairs. I have now looked at all the bigger LCD screens and frankly I was highly disappointed. The Sharp 70 and 80 just look like crap to me. I saw the new Samsung 75" LCD, big mistake as it makes the Sharp look like crap but cost 9 grand.
So my thinking now is projector. The room has only 4 windows which I plan to install blackout curtains over the current blinds that let alot of light in, so that light source will be cut to zero. However, the room opens up to the main area of the house that is certainly brings in light. I modeled the light with tin foil (old school blackout) and it is much darker in bright daylight, but not a movie theater.
I am budgeting about 3-4 grand for the projector and will buy a good 120" screen (the wall to wall measurement is about 16'. I also plan to put in an electric lowering screen as it will come down over my fireplace.
So my key question is, with some ambient light but most of the direct light cut out, how will a 3-4k projector look? I can only seat 4-5 people in my current TV room (I have a 73" Mits DLP that is pretty cool) so I want BIGGER for Super Bowl etc, so there will be days when I need to watch in daylight.
Does this make sense, will it look good, or shoudl I just pony up 9 grand for that Samsung 75"??
 

Jim Mcc

Senior HTF Member
Joined
Feb 11, 2004
Messages
3,757
Location
Oconomowoc, WI.
Real Name
Jim
$9,000 for a TV? That's insane. A projector will look good as long as the room is reasonably dark. When you see the difference in image quality with lights off vs. dimmed, you will see what I mean. Your budget will get you a great looking setup.
1) Will you ceiling mount the projector or use a shelf?
2) Do you want DLP, LCD, or LCos? This should be your first decision. Go see some in person.
 

Jeff Leeds

Stunt Coordinator
Joined
Aug 10, 1999
Messages
131
Thanks for the reply, I totally agree on the 9 grand price point, but MAN it is a nice TV.
So answers to those questions, it will be mounted on a shelf as the celing is very high and I have done reading on the forum about LcOs, DLP or LCD. From my reading I think LCOS but I need to go and see them in person. Which ones perform better wtih some light?
 

Type A

HW Reviewer
Joined
Apr 7, 2007
Messages
884
Location
Aurora Oregon
Real Name
Ty
Sadly it doesnt sound like LCOS will be a good choice in your situation. You need a bright projector and LCOS, while certainly a favorite for extreme native contrast (no gimmicky dynamic iris like everyone else), they wont be a good choice when in a ambient light situation. Have you researched LCD at all? I would look at the epson 5010.
 

Jeff Leeds

Stunt Coordinator
Joined
Aug 10, 1999
Messages
131
I have not looked at too many, but the Lcos one looked nice. I wil for sure look at the LCD ones, thanks for the information!!
 

Jim Mcc

Senior HTF Member
Joined
Feb 11, 2004
Messages
3,757
Location
Oconomowoc, WI.
Real Name
Jim
Type A is correct. The LCos projectors are not bright enough for your situation. I recommend the following 2 projectors.
LCD - The new Epson 5020
DLP - Benq W7000
 

Jeff Leeds

Stunt Coordinator
Joined
Aug 10, 1999
Messages
131
I took at look at the Epson and it looks great, but I really want to add 3D and according to what I have read the Epson will not support that feature. What about the Panasonic PT-AE8000 Projector? Opinions on that one?
 

Jim Mcc

Senior HTF Member
Joined
Feb 11, 2004
Messages
3,757
Location
Oconomowoc, WI.
Real Name
Jim
The Epson 5020UB is definitely a 3D projector. You can read the reviews at Projectorcentral.com and Projectorreviews.com.
The Pan. 8000 is not bright enough for you.
 

RolandL

Senior HTF Member
Joined
Dec 11, 2001
Messages
5,255
Location
Palmetto, FL
Real Name
Roland Lataille
Jim Mcc said:
The Epson 5020UB is definitely a 3D projector. You can read the reviews at Projectorcentral.com and Projectorreviews.com.
The Pan. 8000 is not bright enough for you.
The Pany 8000 and Epson 5020 have about the same brightness, over 2400 lumens, measured by Projector Central.
 

Jim Mcc

Senior HTF Member
Joined
Feb 11, 2004
Messages
3,757
Location
Oconomowoc, WI.
Real Name
Jim
RolandL said:
The Pany 8000 and Epson 5020 have about the same brightness, over 2400 lumens, measured by Projector Central.
The 2400 lumens of both is just the total lumens(Uncalibrated). That means nothing when comparing the 2 projectors in real life use. After entering Jeff's throw distance of 14.5' and a 120" diagonal screen, the Epson 5020 will put out 38 foot lamberts, and the Pan. 8000 will only put out 18, less than half the brightness. That's why the 8000 is not bright enough for Jeff's room.
 

RolandL

Senior HTF Member
Joined
Dec 11, 2001
Messages
5,255
Location
Palmetto, FL
Real Name
Roland Lataille
Jim Mcc said:
The 2400 lumens of both is just the total lumens(Uncalibrated). That means nothing when comparing the 2 projectors in real life use. After entering Jeff's throw distance of 14.5' and a 120" diagonal screen, the Epson 5020 will put out 38 foot lamberts, and the Pan. 8000 will only put out 18, less than half the brightness. That's why the 8000 is not bright enough for Jeff's room.
I'm interested in a 3D projector so, where do you get this information so I can put in my throw distance and screen size?
 

Jim Mcc

Senior HTF Member
Joined
Feb 11, 2004
Messages
3,757
Location
Oconomowoc, WI.
Real Name
Jim
RolandL said:
I'm interested in a 3D projector so, where do you get this information so I can put in my throw distance and screen size?
At Projectorcentral.com, click on "Calculator Pro". There are 2 ways to get your brightness numbers(foot lamberts). 1) If you know your throw distance for sure, type that in. Then go to the left side and click on "Screen size"'. It will show you the image size range possible from that throw distance. 2) Or you can type in your screen size, and then click on "throw range" on the left side. This shows you the closest and farthest throw distance you can use for your screen size.
 

RolandL

Senior HTF Member
Joined
Dec 11, 2001
Messages
5,255
Location
Palmetto, FL
Real Name
Roland Lataille
Jim Mcc said:
At Projectorcentral.com, click on "Calculator Pro". There are 2 ways to get your brightness numbers(foot lamberts). 1) If you know your throw distance for sure, type that in. Then go to the left side and click on "Screen size"'. It will show you the image size range possible from that throw distance. 2) Or you can type in your screen size, and then click on "throw range" on the left side. This shows you the closest and farthest throw distance you can use for your screen size.
The info that Epson supplied to Projector Central must be wrong. You can have a screen 200 inches and it says the brightness will be fine. It also says the Epson 3020 can light up a 219 inch screen and look fine also.
 

Jeff Leeds

Stunt Coordinator
Joined
Aug 10, 1999
Messages
131
Thanks for all the graet information. Projectorcentral didn't show the Epson as a 3D which is where I got that information about it. But then I found another review on projectoreviews.com that does show 2d and 3D.
Here is that review for some others that jumped on this thread
http://www.projectorreviews.com/epson/home-cinema-5020/first-look.php
I am usually pretty smart about home theater technology but for projectors I know less than zero :) so all the help is most appreciated!!! Thanks for the great information, from the review this seems like a good one for me.
Couple of more questions while this thread is hot, I just ordered the 100% black-out curtains today and now planning to order the new carpeting. Does it make sense to get a dark color, would that really matter. The wife wants a close to white color like we have in the room now (after 13 years the carpet is ready to get pulled and tossed) or should I get a nice darn color or even black. Will that really matter??
Also, noticed the review on the 6020, although the Epson website still shows it as 6010, which I cannot see much of a tech difference other than the black color versus the white color. Is this worth the price difference??
Thanks guys for the great information, Epson is for sure the choice, but which model. I am not worried about budget for this purchase....I want to go big!
 

Jim Mcc

Senior HTF Member
Joined
Feb 11, 2004
Messages
3,757
Location
Oconomowoc, WI.
Real Name
Jim
RolandL said:
The info that Epson supplied to Projector Central must be wrong. You can have a screen 200 inches and it says the brightness will be fine. It also says the Epson 3020 can light up a 219 inch screen and look fine also.
That's called marketing.
Jeff, the color of carpet is not nearly as important as having dark walls and ceiling, BUT I would try to talk her into something darker than off white. Maybe a medium gray or brown or something. She needs to have input with something, right? :) I would go for the newer model, the 5020. The 6020 is virtually the same projector as the 5020, but the 6020 is only sold by local dealers. If you're doing the install yourself, the 5020 is the one you want. Art at Projectorreviews.com stated the 5020 is a "huge improvement" over last year's 5010.
 

RolandL

Senior HTF Member
Joined
Dec 11, 2001
Messages
5,255
Location
Palmetto, FL
Real Name
Roland Lataille
Jim Mcc said:
The 2400 lumens of both is just the total lumens(Uncalibrated). That means nothing when comparing the 2 projectors in real life use. After entering Jeff's throw distance of 14.5' and a 120" diagonal screen, the Epson 5020 will put out 38 foot lamberts, and the Pan. 8000 will only put out 18, less than half the brightness. That's why the 8000 is not bright enough for Jeff's room.
The brightnees is about the same for both projectors.
Comparison of Epson to Panasonic on Projector Central http://www.projectorcentral.com/epson_5020_vs_panasonic_ae8000.htm
"Light output. While there was a light output difference between the AE7000 and 5010, that difference has been eliminated in these new models. In Dynamic mode, the AE8000 measures 2471 lumens; the 5020UBe measures 2432 lumens. Living Room mode on the 5020UBe measures 1725 lumens after calibration while Cinema 2 mode on the AE8000 measures 1612 lumens. Cinema 1 mode on the AE8000 measures 822 lumens to the 5020UBe's 914 lumens in Cinema mode. These differences -- all under 150 lumens -- are near invisible to the human eye. They are functionally irrelevant. "
 

Jeff Leeds

Stunt Coordinator
Joined
Aug 10, 1999
Messages
131
Thanks for the info, I have not decided yet whether or not I will do the install myself or try to use a local installer. I know how t do all the hook-ups and I have a good handyman that can put stuff into the walls, but I am not very sure about placement of projector and screens.
Anybody in the Bay Area out there have a suggestion for an installer???
Picking carpet tomorrorw, will go a shade lower than white, but not sure I can talk the wife into painting the walls black :)
 

Forum Sponsors

Forum statistics

Threads
345,193
Messages
4,733,517
Members
141,402
Latest member
lendrena