Carlo Medina

Executive Producer
Joined
Oct 31, 1997
Messages
11,906
Reaction score
1,873
Points
9,110
Cycling gloves. Which I then disinfect when I get home. If the place I go to has nitrile gloves I’ll wear those. I have some nitrile gloves at home (which I use when working on my bikes) but only one box so I’m kind of hanging on to those because it’s impossible to find more on shelves. Just like I’m reusing my face masks even though the box still has more than 20 in it (bought them for dusting months ago).
 

JohnRice

Executive Producer
Joined
Jun 20, 2000
Messages
12,883
Reaction score
2,299
Points
9,110
Location
A Mile High
Website
www.theteatable.com
Real Name
John
Is everyone wearing gloves when they go shopping? If so, what kind of gloves? I'm wear disposable nitrile gloves.
I'm not convinced on gloves. I keep my finger nails short, disinfect the cart handle with isopropyl alcohol, disinfect my hands when I'm done, then thoroughly wash them once I get home, before and after I put the groceries away. I guess one thing gloves would do is allow me to more easily disinfect my hands once I was done, and it wouldn't burn. I know I have nitrile gloves somewhere, but I haven't been able to find them.
 

DaveF

Moderator
Moderator
Joined
Mar 4, 2001
Messages
23,134
Reaction score
4,357
Points
9,110
Location
Catfisch Cinema
Real Name
Dave
Is everyone wearing gloves when they go shopping? If so, what kind of gloves? I'm wear disposable nitrile gloves.
Don't have any. My mask hasn't arrived either (was expected yesterday). So had to go grocery shopping this morning without. It felt like I was in the minority, without mask. (I've been home for 10 days and have no symptoms so it's very unlikely I pose a risk to anyone, FWIW).
 

DaveF

Moderator
Moderator
Joined
Mar 4, 2001
Messages
23,134
Reaction score
4,357
Points
9,110
Location
Catfisch Cinema
Real Name
Dave
Target still feels like they're not doing anything or paying attention to safety considerations that the other retailers are.

No one outside wiping down carts. No one cleaning checkout stations after each customer. But, theres' so few people in the store, that still feels like it balances out against the more vigorous but comparatively more crowded Wegman's.
 

TravisR

Studio Mogul
Joined
Nov 15, 2004
Messages
34,810
Reaction score
12,216
Points
9,110
Location
The basement of the FBI building
Target still feels like they're not doing anything or paying attention to safety considerations that the other retailers are.

No one outside wiping down carts. No one cleaning checkout stations after each customer. But, theres' so few people in the store, that still feels like it balances out against the more vigorous but comparatively more crowded Wegman's.
When I was in Target this week, none of the employees had masks on but they were all wiping down carts and doors and disinfecting the registers between every customer. It looked more like a cleaning crew was there than retail workers.
 

Robert Crawford

Moderator
Moderator
Joined
Dec 9, 1998
Messages
47,657
Reaction score
23,789
Points
9,110
Location
Michigan
Real Name
Robert
I'm not convinced on gloves. I keep my finger nails short, disinfect the cart handle with isopropyl alcohol, disinfect my hands when I'm done, then thoroughly wash them once I get home, before and after I put the groceries away. I guess one thing gloves would do is allow me to more easily disinfect my hands once I was done, and it wouldn't burn. I know I have nitrile gloves somewhere, but I haven't been able to find them.
You think this virus is going to penetrate disposable nitrile gloves?
 
  • Like
Reactions: Tino

JohnRice

Executive Producer
Joined
Jun 20, 2000
Messages
12,883
Reaction score
2,299
Points
9,110
Location
A Mile High
Website
www.theteatable.com
Real Name
John
You think this virus is going to penetrate disposable nitrile gloves?
I'm not certain there's a definitive answer to that. It seems almost certain that viruses can penetrate latex, and nitrile is used more for chemical resistance (which is better than latex) than viral protection. Viruses are remarkably small. Significantly smaller than bacteria. So, I have multiple concerns. That gloves are worn which don't actually protect from exposure, that viruses are dispersed when the gloves are removed and most of all, that wearing them gives a false sense of safety resulting in lessening other precautions. One thing seems certain to me, if you wear gloves, they need to be thoroughly disinfected before they are removed, or you just send any viruses on them floating in front of your face when you remove them. Also, I've studied what it takes to destroy viruses due to my desire to keep my work space and products safe, and what most people are doing as protective measures are NOT sufficient. viruses are very difficult to destroy. Notice I never say "Kill", because viruses aren't technically alive. On a basic level, they are chemical compounds, but they contain genetic code,which is where the confusion comes from.

At first I thought that the FDA and Health Department requirements we deal with at work for food-safe treatment was sufficient, but learned it's not. What is needed to destroy viruses is substantially stronger than what's needed to kill bacteria and food-borne contaminants. For example, for bacteria and food-born contaminants, it's sufficient to spray a surface with 50PPM (parts per million) bleach, which can be left without rinsing. Viruses require at least 1,000PPM, 20x as strong, and that leaves a toxic residue. It will also cause severe skin reactions and will damage a lot of things it touches.

Viruses are a real bugger. They are infinitesimally small and can pass through a lot of materials. I simply don't know that standard nitrile gloves stop them.
 

Robert Crawford

Moderator
Moderator
Joined
Dec 9, 1998
Messages
47,657
Reaction score
23,789
Points
9,110
Location
Michigan
Real Name
Robert
I'm not certain there's a definitive answer to that. It seems almost certain that viruses can penetrate latex, and nitrile is used more for chemical resistance (which is better than latex) than viral protection. Viruses are remarkably small. Significantly smaller than bacteria. So, I have multiple concerns. That gloves are worn which don't actually protect from exposure, that viruses are dispersed when the gloves are removed and most of all, that wearing them gives a false sense of safety resulting in lessening other precautions. One thing seems certain to me, if you wear gloves, they need to be thoroughly disinfected before they are removed, or you just send any viruses on them floating in front of your face when you remove them. Also, I've studied what it takes to destroy viruses due to my desire to keep my work space and products safe, and what most people are doing as protective measures are NOT sufficient. viruses are very difficult to destroy. Notice I never say "Kill", because viruses aren't technically alive. On a basic level, they are chemical compounds, but they contain genetic code,which is where the confusion comes from.

At first I thought that the FDA and Health Department requirements we deal with at work for food-safe treatment was sufficient, but learned it's not. What is needed to destroy viruses is substantially stronger than what's needed to kill bacteria and food-borne contaminants. For example, for bacteria and food-born contaminants, it's sufficient to spray a surface with 50PPM (parts per million) bleach, which can be left without rinsing. Viruses require at least 1,000PPM, 20x as strong, and that leaves a toxic residue. It will also cause severe skin reactions and will damage a lot of things it touches.

Viruses are a real bugger. They are infinitesimally small and can pass through a lot of materials. I simply don't know that standard nitrile gloves stop them.
Reading your post suggests you want 100% protection against this virus. I don't think that's possible for most of us. IMO, using social distancing, wearing nitrile gloves and masks reduces your exposure to this virus which in reality is probably the best thing we can hope for right now.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Tino

JohnRice

Executive Producer
Joined
Jun 20, 2000
Messages
12,883
Reaction score
2,299
Points
9,110
Location
A Mile High
Website
www.theteatable.com
Real Name
John
That's not what I'm saying at all. Not even close. I just get concerned about people doing things that actually make them more vulnerable to exposure because they don't offer the protection they believe them to. Plus, I like to realistically understand what I'm dealing with, rather than deal in belief.
 

TonyD

Who do we think I am?
Premium
Joined
Dec 1, 1999
Messages
20,334
Reaction score
2,061
Points
9,110
Age
55
Location
Gulf Coast
Website
www.facebook.com
Real Name
Tony D.
I’m wondering what gloves are doing if they do anything.
This virus sits on just about everything.
Isn’t it sitting on these gloves too?

The moment you touch a virus infected item with gloves on the gloves now have it on them.

So you’re still walking around with gloves on that have virus on it too.

If you’re just touching things with bare hands at least you can spritz with some purel or equivalent and wash your hands anytime you want.

Withgloves on you have to touch the glove to get them off and then dispose the glove.

I just feel like the gloves is not better then bare hands.

Actually I’ve always wondered about the use of gloves when people handle your food such as lunch meat.

What is being protected by the gloves?
If someone handles food that I’m getting from someone with gloved hands, the gloves are still going to have on them whatever the person touches.
 

DaveF

Moderator
Moderator
Joined
Mar 4, 2001
Messages
23,134
Reaction score
4,357
Points
9,110
Location
Catfisch Cinema
Real Name
Dave
@JohnRice have you looked into the face mask data? Ars Technica had what seemed like a really solid summary of the studies, and my takeaway was that it's not well studied and the studies out show a real equivocation on whether they're really helpful for people (especially the DIY cotton masks).

But then I'm seeing recently people posting summaries stating that "The medical evidence for the practice is overwhelming" in support of them. (though their data at a glance is also equivocal).

I'm not against masks -- anxiously waiting for my Etsy cotton masks to arrive.

But still confused on the proven efficacy of them.
 

Robert Crawford

Moderator
Moderator
Joined
Dec 9, 1998
Messages
47,657
Reaction score
23,789
Points
9,110
Location
Michigan
Real Name
Robert
I’m wondering what gloves are doing if they do anything.
This virus sits on just about everything.
Isn’t it sitting on these gloves too?

The moment you touch a virus infected item with gloves on the gloves now have it on them.

So you’re still walking around with gloves on that have virus on it too.

If you’re just touching things with bare hands at least you can spritz with some purel or equivalent and wash your hands anytime you want.

Withgloves on you have to touch the glove to get them off and then dispose the glove.

I just feel like the gloves is not better then bare hands.

Actually I’ve always wondered about the use of gloves when people handle your food such as lunch meat.

What is being protected by the gloves?
If someone handles food that I’m getting from someone with gloved hands, the gloves are still going to have on them whatever the person touches.
I wash my hands anyway after wearing gloves. IMO, the longer the virus is on your skin, the greater the exposure level it is.
 
  • Like
Reactions: TonyD and TravisR

TonyD

Who do we think I am?
Premium
Joined
Dec 1, 1999
Messages
20,334
Reaction score
2,061
Points
9,110
Age
55
Location
Gulf Coast
Website
www.facebook.com
Real Name
Tony D.
In other news.
My dad figured out how to get his pool pump back together so I didnt have to go over there.
I still can’t get him to understand that this pump is old and the motor is probably on its last legs.

Also the parent news just keeps getting worse.
Dad was diagnosed with bladder cancer late last year.
Tumors in and on the bladder.
Dr tried to scrape them but that was useless.
So next week he has to go in and have bladder removed.

Making it worse is he will be kept there for minimum ten days with no visitors allowed.
It’s going to be a long ten days for him.
He cannot sit still so ten days in there is going to be a challenge for him and anyone else he’s in there with.

Mom, who is 77 lives in Delaware with her husband who is dying of a serious lung disorder was walking her little dog a couple days ago when she fell and hit her head and was knocked out.

They live in a complex that is apartments but is a full health care facility from the time they moved in until they die they are completely taken care of.
So luckily someone saw her fall and she was taken to the hospital by ambulance.

A huge gash on her face and a broken bone in her neck.

Heavily medicated and out of it so can’t really speak with anyone for a few days.

Welp.
 

Carlo Medina

Executive Producer
Joined
Oct 31, 1997
Messages
11,906
Reaction score
1,873
Points
9,110
As others have said, it's hard to achieve 100% protection, even doctors with the right gear have been getting infected (though admittedly at much lower rates, and it's usually due to human error in not removing the gear correctly).

I only have standard masks I bought for dusting a year or so ago. I don't have any illusions it will filter out the virus, it won't. However, when I do have to venture outside to get groceries, supplies, etc., just in case I'm an asymptomatic carrier it will keep my droplets in my mouth area. So my mask isn't for me, it's for everyone else.

My gloves: yes the virus can live on surfaces. But what wearing my cycling gloves does is keep me from touching my face inadvertently. If I didn't wear those I would constantly be touching my face without knowing it. Plus, I only use certain parts of the glove (tips of my right hand's thumb and forefinger, to open door knobs, then I wipe them down with sanitizing wipes that my markets tend to have, or spray them with isopropyl alcohol I have at home (again, just historically have had it, they're impossible to find now) and let them soak and air dry to inactivate the virus.

And yes, I thoroughly wash my hands before and after removing my gloves.

Between this routine, and minimizing outside trips to only essential needs, I've been lucky thus far. And credit to Los Angeles, yes we have our fair share of idiots, but so many of my neighbors are following the safer at home order. Keeping my fingers crossed.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Robert Crawford

Malcolm R

Executive Producer
Joined
Feb 8, 2002
Messages
18,346
Reaction score
5,065
Points
9,110
Real Name
Malcolm
The only way gloves are effective is if you touch nothing with the gloved hands that you're going to touch later with ungloved hands. If gloves keep you from touching your face, fine, but you also cannot touch anything else that you might touch later.

On my flight home from vacation, the flight attendants were wearing gloves but they were also touching everything in sight with their gloved hands: beverages, meals, cups, snacks, walls, door handles, drawers, cabinets, their phones and purses, etc. So they may not be getting things on their skin but they're still spreading around all the same germs with their gloved fingers on everything they're handing to passengers and all of their own personal belongings.

I think gloves provide a false sense of security. It's like some people don't believe that germs will adhere to gloves the same as they do to skin.
 

JohnRice

Executive Producer
Joined
Jun 20, 2000
Messages
12,883
Reaction score
2,299
Points
9,110
Location
A Mile High
Website
www.theteatable.com
Real Name
John
@JohnRice have you looked into the face mask data? Ars Technica had what seemed like a really solid summary of the studies, and my takeaway was that it's not well studied and the studies out show a real equivocation on whether they're really helpful for people (especially the DIY cotton masks).

But then I'm seeing recently people posting summaries stating that "The medical evidence for the practice is overwhelming" in support of them. (though their data at a glance is also equivocal).

I'm not against masks -- anxiously waiting for my Etsy cotton masks to arrive.

But still confused on the proven efficacy of them.
The true answer to so many things is "We simply don't know." Do NSAIDs make a person more susceptible? We really don't know, but we do know that acetaminophen is probably safest, so best to be safe. There are reasons that gloves can be safer, but if I can find the box that should be somewhere, before I take them off, I'll saturate them with the 70% isopropyl alcohol I keep with me to assure any possible viruses on them are destroyed before I take them off. Then I'll still thoroughly wash my hands. At least gloves should prevent viruses from getting stuck under the fingernails or in crevices in the skin. I'm fairly certain that almost none of the preventive measures being taken for shopping carts is truly effective. What I understand to actually be effective is to saturate it with 70% isopropyl alcohol and let it dry for at least 30 seconds. It stinks, but it leaves no residue and is the most effective thing I've learned of, and it's a very simple, safe solution.

I'm going to wear a mask on the occasion I go to the store, not so much for my own protection, but on the off chance I'm infected.

I just like to learn and understand as thoroughly as possible, then I can make an informed decision, understand the positives and negatives, and put my mind at rest.
 
  • Like
Reactions: DaveF

JohnRice

Executive Producer
Joined
Jun 20, 2000
Messages
12,883
Reaction score
2,299
Points
9,110
Location
A Mile High
Website
www.theteatable.com
Real Name
John
I think gloves provide a false sense of security. It's like some people don't believe that germs will adhere to gloves the same as they do to skin.
That's my concern with a lot of the solutions. If you don't understand "why", "what" can actually make it worse.
 
  • Like
Reactions: ManW_TheUncool

Forum Sponsors

Staff online

Forum statistics

Threads
343,748
Messages
4,688,868
Members
141,024
Latest member
snookerworldtx