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Josh Steinberg

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My mother is an operating room nurse; my stepfather is both a nurse and someone who had hip surgeries multiple times in the past year. They go to work every day and have not contracted the virus.

I have had to undergo several emergency oral surgeries and dental visits during the pandemic. My dentist is a close family friend. We have not contracted the virus. Honestly, if I had not put off my regular dental care before pandemic concerns, I probably wouldn’t have needed the emergency treatment. Things became a worse emergency because they weren’t taken care of in a timely manner in the first place.

Delta is different than the original strain. It comes on harder and much faster. It is far more likely that your friend was infected at the wedding or at some other opportunity where his guard was lowered or was in a higher risk environment like a poorly ventilated airport or indoor restatrant than in a medical office having a procedure done.

Every medical professional I know and every medical office I’ve been in has been more careful and more concerned about safety than normal times, where things weren’t lax to begin with. These professionals have more to be concerned about than their patients do with regards to getting ill and are doing everything in their control not to get ill.

I don’t mean to sound agitated but I have a lot of people near and dear to me in that medical/dental sphere and outside of my own home, there’s nowhere I’d feel more confident in my safety than in their hands.
 

DaveF

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Shaming people for taking care of themselves and getting basic health care in Summer 2021 is a bad look. Shaming friends for seeing a dentist? Why?

For the past 6+ months:
  • Dentists and their staff are vaccinated.
  • Dentists and their staff are masked
  • Dentist offices have additional air purifiers or filtration systems
 
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Carlo Medina

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I realize each of our experiences is just that, ours. But we need to make sure we don't equate correlation with causation. It seems that in the example given, the person went to two things that could have caused exposure, the wedding and the dentist.

As others have said, many dentists offices are fully vaccinated and have additional safeguards in place. Are they all? I'd hope so, but I'd also have to be naive to say they all adhere to the protocols. My own dentist's office has what is essentially a fume hood type thing by each station literally sucking the air out of that patient's area. It's loud, obnoxious, and I greatly appreciate it. But again, other offices might not.

But we also know the new Delta variant spreads much more easily and replicates in the body much more quickly, so you need a much lower viral load to become infected. Even Oregon (IIRC) has reinstated outdoor mask mandates where physical distancing is not possible. Because emerging data seem to indicate you can become infected in an outdoor maskless setting much easier than with the original variant.

So all things being equal, if I had to decide between going to an outdoor maskless wedding or going to the dentist's office, I can't believe I'm about to write this...I'd go to the dentist's office. :rolling-smiley:
 

Mark Booth

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Excuse me, Dave, but where did I "shame" my friend because he went to the dentist? If he wants to go the dentist for a routine cleaning, that's his business and I agree the risk at the dentist is relatively low.

The airplane ride to and from Chicago for a packed INDOOR wedding with a bunch of people without masks.... Now THAT isn't such a good idea, in my humble opinion. Throw in eating in crowded touristy restaurants and I'm left wondering, WTH?

When I made my first post on this subject, I was basing my assumptions on his Facebook posts. The time between the wedding and his initial symptoms was 7 days. A little outside the normal infection kick-in time for Delta (which is an average of 3 days) but still feasible. Then after talking to him on the phone I learned he went to the dentist exactly 3 days before his symptoms started. That seems the more likely source of infection.

My wife is higher than average risk for serious illness if she were to get COVID (our doctor said so). So, you can be darn sure my preference is that she avoids ANY potential exposure sources. A visit to the dentist can wait. Her hip, on the other hand, is causing her a great deal of discomfort. The upside benefits outweigh the risk. But hospital operating rooms don't have a perfect record at controlling infection either. So, the whole situation makes me nervous.

Mark
 

Mark Booth

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BTW, one of other friends decided to have surgery in early December. He had a ventricular shunt implanted due to enlargement of his cranial ventricles, which was causing him to be dizzy. He'd been dealing with the situation for about 2 years. I was stunned when he said he was going to go ahead and have the surgery in the middle of COVID, before there were vaccines. The surgery went well and was unlikely to be the source of COVID but *somebody* brought COVID into their home. Possibly one of the home health caregivers. He died from COVID at the end of December.

I feel it was a mistake for him to have the surgery when he did. He'd been putting up with the dizziness for 2 years and a vaccine was around the corner. I wish he'd decided to wait a few more months, he might still be here.

THAT situation doesn't help me feel more comfortable about my wife's pending surgery either.

Mark
 

Mysto

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BTW, one of other friends decided to have surgery in early December. He had a ventricular shunt implanted due to enlargement of his cranial ventricles, which was causing him to be dizzy. He'd been dealing with the situation for about 2 years. I was stunned when he said he was going to go ahead and have the surgery in the middle of COVID, before there were vaccines. The surgery went well and was unlikely to be the source of COVID but *somebody* brought COVID into their home. Possibly one of the home health caregivers. He died from COVID at the end of December.

I feel it was a mistake for him to have the surgery when he did. He'd been putting up with the dizziness for 2 years and a vaccine was around the corner. I wish he'd decided to wait a few more months, he might still be here.

THAT situation doesn't help me feel more comfortable about my wife's pending surgery either.

Mark
If your wife needs surgery go forward with confidence. You are both vaccinated - make sure your surgeon is as well. The odds are very much in your favor. And with the vaccine covid isn't what it was plus now they have many treatments.

Stay well my friend.
 

Johnny Angell

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make sure your surgeon is as well.
You’d think this would be a slam dunk. I recently watched a video by The NY Times covering covid in a small town in Arkansas. It was either Mountain View or Mountain Home. All the covid patients were unvaccinated. The most shocking thing was that 50% of hospital employees were unvaccinated. I don’t understand.
 

DaveF

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I’ve been amazed to learn how straightforward hip replacements are these days. A friend’s mom had it done last month. Overnight in the hospital, and back home and walking every day afterwards. It’s less traumatic than standard neck surgery.

Another friend had knee replacement surgery this year. Six weeks off work to recover - a longer recovery than hips I guess — but I think it was outpatient and walked himself out of the hospital afterwards

I didn’t know how routine major joint replacement had become.

But I don’t know if these are ever done in surgical centers. A good thing about neck surgery, for example, is you can go to a dedicated, outpatient surgical center and never have to step foot into a hospital.
Talking with my friend today: Hip replacement surgery is an out patient surgery done at surgical centers. No hospital required. No overnight stay. You’re walking out after the surgery. You’re walking daily for PT. You’re walking five miles a few weeks later. This for a 70 year old.

It’s incredible how easy this is for such a major thing!
 

Mysto

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You’d think this would be a slam dunk. I recently watched a video by The NY Times covering covid in a small town in Arkansas. It was either Mountain View or Mountain Home. All the covid patients were unvaccinated. The most shocking thing was that 50% of hospital employees were unvaccinated. I don’t understand.
Ya think? Here in Florida - in the area most likely to die from covid (nursing homes) only 2 out of 5 staff is vaccinated.

https://states.aarp.org/florida/nursing-home-staff-covid-vaccines
 

DaveF

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Back around May, I began to think I could have a birthday party. All my friends the prior 18 months had to skip / minimize milestone events. But the pandemic was on its way out. Everyone was getting vaccinated. And mid summer, it was looking great, local #s were really low. I scheduled a milestone birthday party.

I canceled it five minutes ago. :(
 

Mysto

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Back around May, I began to think I could have a birthday party. All my friends the prior 18 months had to skip / minimize milestone events. But the pandemic was on its way out. Everyone was getting vaccinated. And mid summer, it was looking great, local #s were really low. I scheduled a milestone birthday party.

I canceled it five minutes ago. :(
I was going to post a like Dave but that isn't what I want to convey. I, like most of us, was sure that this would all be over by now. It's not. Sometimes life sucks and this is one of those times but it will pass. My social life is, as so many others, a world of mostly social media and zoom. Hopefully 2022 will be the year. Make that your milestone.
All the best and when it's time Happy Birthday from all of your friends here.
 

Josh Steinberg

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Back around May, I began to think I could have a birthday party. All my friends the prior 18 months had to skip / minimize milestone events. But the pandemic was on its way out. Everyone was getting vaccinated. And mid summer, it was looking great, local #s were really low. I scheduled a milestone birthday party.

I canceled it five minutes ago. :(

I’m sorry, Dave.

We thought we’d be able to have a big birthday party for our twins and invite people we haven’t seen either since the pandemic began or who haven’t had a chance to meet the kids yet but we’ve also decided to pull back and only host people (family) already in our little group.
 

Clinton McClure

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You’d think this would be a slam dunk. I recently watched a video by The NY Times covering covid in a small town in Arkansas. It was either Mountain View or Mountain Home. All the covid patients were unvaccinated. The most shocking thing was that 50% of hospital employees were unvaccinated. I don’t understand.
That was Mountain Home.
 
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Robert Crawford

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You’d think this would be a slam dunk. I recently watched a video by The NY Times covering covid in a small town in Arkansas. It was either Mountain View or Mountain Home. All the covid patients were unvaccinated. The most shocking thing was that 50% of hospital employees were unvaccinated. I don’t understand.
Ya think? Here in Florida - in the area most likely to die from covid (nursing homes) only 2 out of 5 staff is vaccinated.

https://states.aarp.org/florida/nursing-home-staff-covid-vaccines
That was Mountain Home and is not surprising at all.
If it's not about how you're dealing with life during this Covid-19 crisis than it doesn't belong here:

I think some of you need to read this post again as it seems you have forgotten the purpose of this thread which is not to complain about what other people are doing during this pandemic. You want to vent your frustrations about others then use social media outlets like FB and Twitter for that purpose.

As my colleague DaveF has stated beforehand, if it's not about "How are you dealing with life now with the Covid-19 virus situation", it doesn't belong here.

This isn't the all purpose pandemic news and complaints thread.
 

TJPC

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I'm not being a smart ass really, and sorry to be obtuse, but I guess I really don't understand what is considered acceptable on this thread. Can you give a couple of examples?
 

Robert Crawford

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I'm not being a smart ass really, and sorry to be obtuse, but I guess I really don't understand what is considered acceptable on this thread. Can you give a couple of examples?
It's quite simple, if what you're posting isn't about how you're personally dealing with the Covid-19 virus situation then it probably doesn't belong here. This thread shouldn't be used for all purpose pandemic news and/or complaints about other people or institutions.
 

DaveF

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I'm not being a smart ass really, and sorry to be obtuse, but I guess I really don't understand what is considered acceptable on this thread. Can you give a couple of examples?

I said it all previously:

The goal for this thread is a little oasis about how you're coping with the pandemic. What's working for you. What bit of a silver lining are you grasping amidst the black thunderclouds? What concrete actions are you taking to deal with your challenges? It's a place to be real, but not dismally so. A place to discuss you, but not the nation or world. A place to support, but not tear down others if they are more worried or concerned than you might be.

I think I may have failed in explaining the goals and guidelines for this thread by not giving enough context. I'm pretty immersed in these threads and in moderating them. But not everyone is, and might not have the same big picture view I've got on keeping this thread vibrant.

I always go back to Nelson's opening paragraph where he asks how we're doing, as distinct from discussing the pandemic itself (all related statistics, news, predictions).


The original COVID-19 thread was closed because it was repeatedly getting embroiled in politics. Despite multiple requests and moderator actions, topics kept returning to politics. It would start with innocuous stats, and or some general news piece, but would often spiral to politics.

That's why we are are aggressively moderating this thread. This is a great thread, a wonderful place to talk about dealing with the pandemic, in a way that we maybe don't have elsewhere. But the learned experience from the COVID-19 thread is comments touching the "nuts and bolts" of the pandemic like statistics or general news and especially politics are simply not allowed here, because they will lead us to where that other thread already went, which is getting locked. An otherwise personal comment that brings in national stats and news and stuff that would have otherwise been in the original news-and-stats thread is likely to be deleted here without notice. I've seen it several times lately, that those posts bring out the political conversation rather than the personal. So we're trying to cut it off early.

We're also very sensitive to rants, diatribes, obvious misinformation, and overtly wrong claims. These might be written in a coy or veiled effort to talk politics while remaining in the letter of the "law". But here, we're focusing on the thread's goal, and it's obvious when someone is violating that spirit.

Another challenge is that, I think, sometimes someone comes here in a hot moment. They're acutely worried from the news and the politics and the statistics and whatever garbage they saw on TweetBook. And they let it out here. We get it. They're scared of this pandemic and for good reason. What they fail to realize is that most of us are scared too. We are sharing what we're afriad of and how we're dealing with it. But there's a difference from that and just posting panic and inflaming the worries of everyone's who's already worried.


All of which is to say again: the desire for this thread -- a thread I personally enjoy and and strive to keep positive and open -- is to be a little oasis. Moderation will be continue to be aggressive and happen without warning or discussion. If you have a post deleted and you think it's unfair, please keep in mind that we're doing our best. It's not personal, it's just about trying to navigate a tough course on a tough topic in a tough time.

I think there's opportunities for more in this thread. I don't want to be overly proscriptive. And hopefully we're all on board in this one thread to have a little place to share about getting along through these challenging times.
 

Johnny Angell

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Summers are brutal in Arkansas. In years past, I could go to the gym and get in a comfortable workout. Now, gyms are probably one of the worst places to go. So the only exercise I’m getting is a mile walk first thing in the morning. I look forward to a cooling off period beginning sometime in September.

I think working out in a gym would help me with my chronic fatigue syndrome.

It was November of 2019 that I came out of a case of the flu with my chronic fatigue syndrome. The earliest reported case of covid in AR was in May, 2020. I was tested sometime after May. For discussions sake, if a got covid in November would the tests show that? I ask because I find myself wondering if I’m a long-hauler. The argument against my getting covid back then is that my wife didn’t get it and I head have to be a very early case. I haven’t been outside of AR since waaay before COVID began.

About a week ago Stacy and I got our booster shots.
 

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