Sach
Stunt Coordinator
- Joined
- Aug 25, 2002
- Messages
- 70
A post on audioasylum.com has the following information about HiFi world's shootout between Marantz 8300, Denon 3800, Pioneer 757Ai (47Ai) and Onkyo SP800:
In this month's UK 'Hi-Fi World' there are extensive tests of the Marantz DV8300, the Onkyo DV-SP800 and Pioneer DV-757Ai, with detailed lab measurements by Paul Miller (THE top tech-head).
The Pioneer is apparently considerably better than it's 747 predecessor both sonically and measurement wise, and this is prefered over the Onkyo. The reviewer is particularly enthusiastic about the Pioneer's i-Link which can send DVD-A and SACD digital signals to a multi-channel processor without undermining the watermarking or copy-protection systems.
DVD-A performance is slightly better than SACD but SACD is still very good.
In the UK the Pioneer is priced at £800 so you can usually convert that directly to $800 for the US.
The Marantz (£1,400 UK) is judged to be "comfortably above Denon's DVD3800 in term of sound and video quality - making it well worth it's price - it still faces tough competition from the likes of Pioneer's £500 cheaper DV-757Ai".
From the review;
"....the Denon was poor with CD (Denon DVD3800), so poor that I chose not to use it as a CD player. Measurment shows the Marantz is far more linear in it's replay section, born out by it's decent CD sound which is clean but a little bright, well detailed and with nicely portrayed depth perspective. Bass was a little mellifluous perhaps, but entirely satisfactory all the same. Violins in both digital and analogue recordings of Wagner highlights came over as vibrant and well separated, but also smooth too. Drums and bass in Angelique Kidjo's 'Agolo' had all the power you normally get from a decent player.
........SACDs were generally easiers on the ear and more fluid than DVD-A discs which is how the two formats generally pan out sonically. The Marantz changed nothing here, getting equally good results from both."
What I think you should consider here is that this is not a Ken Ishiwata modified player and relies heavily upon Piuoneer's first generation DV-747 player as it's foundation, and "..it also shares the same pattern of ultrasonic noise which, typically, is worse on SACD than DVD-A. Of course, SACD's increased noise does serve to camouflage any distortion harmonics of signals above 15kHz or so, although this amounts to just 0.0125% at 40kHz with DVD-A."
Reading between the lines of all three separate reviews in the current issue (and references to the earlier Denon review), it's the Pioneer DV-757Ai that is the most highly rated, basically because it is considerably better than the earlier 747A which the Onkyo and Marantz are based upon.
From Paul Miller's lab report;
"This player (the 757Ai) represents a significant advance on the DVD-747A, not least with the change from Crystal to the combination of Burr-Brown's PCM1738 (front) and PCM1702 (centre, Sub and rear) DACs. The A-wtd S/N ratio is now some 108dB and while midrange distortion is broadly unchanged at ~0.0009% there's a worthwhile decrease in high frequency distortion to 0.002% (CD, 20kHz/0dBFs) and 0.009% at 40kHz with DVD-A.
The 40kHz plot not only demonstrates a marked improvement in dynamic range across the 20Hz-20kHz audioband but also reveals a substancial reduction (~40dB) in ultrasonic noise with DVD-A software.
.....it's the reduction in ultrasonic rubbish that will ensure the DVD-757Ai is the more consistent performer with different amplifiers."
In this month's UK 'Hi-Fi World' there are extensive tests of the Marantz DV8300, the Onkyo DV-SP800 and Pioneer DV-757Ai, with detailed lab measurements by Paul Miller (THE top tech-head).
The Pioneer is apparently considerably better than it's 747 predecessor both sonically and measurement wise, and this is prefered over the Onkyo. The reviewer is particularly enthusiastic about the Pioneer's i-Link which can send DVD-A and SACD digital signals to a multi-channel processor without undermining the watermarking or copy-protection systems.
DVD-A performance is slightly better than SACD but SACD is still very good.
In the UK the Pioneer is priced at £800 so you can usually convert that directly to $800 for the US.
The Marantz (£1,400 UK) is judged to be "comfortably above Denon's DVD3800 in term of sound and video quality - making it well worth it's price - it still faces tough competition from the likes of Pioneer's £500 cheaper DV-757Ai".
From the review;
"....the Denon was poor with CD (Denon DVD3800), so poor that I chose not to use it as a CD player. Measurment shows the Marantz is far more linear in it's replay section, born out by it's decent CD sound which is clean but a little bright, well detailed and with nicely portrayed depth perspective. Bass was a little mellifluous perhaps, but entirely satisfactory all the same. Violins in both digital and analogue recordings of Wagner highlights came over as vibrant and well separated, but also smooth too. Drums and bass in Angelique Kidjo's 'Agolo' had all the power you normally get from a decent player.
........SACDs were generally easiers on the ear and more fluid than DVD-A discs which is how the two formats generally pan out sonically. The Marantz changed nothing here, getting equally good results from both."
What I think you should consider here is that this is not a Ken Ishiwata modified player and relies heavily upon Piuoneer's first generation DV-747 player as it's foundation, and "..it also shares the same pattern of ultrasonic noise which, typically, is worse on SACD than DVD-A. Of course, SACD's increased noise does serve to camouflage any distortion harmonics of signals above 15kHz or so, although this amounts to just 0.0125% at 40kHz with DVD-A."
Reading between the lines of all three separate reviews in the current issue (and references to the earlier Denon review), it's the Pioneer DV-757Ai that is the most highly rated, basically because it is considerably better than the earlier 747A which the Onkyo and Marantz are based upon.
From Paul Miller's lab report;
"This player (the 757Ai) represents a significant advance on the DVD-747A, not least with the change from Crystal to the combination of Burr-Brown's PCM1738 (front) and PCM1702 (centre, Sub and rear) DACs. The A-wtd S/N ratio is now some 108dB and while midrange distortion is broadly unchanged at ~0.0009% there's a worthwhile decrease in high frequency distortion to 0.002% (CD, 20kHz/0dBFs) and 0.009% at 40kHz with DVD-A.
The 40kHz plot not only demonstrates a marked improvement in dynamic range across the 20Hz-20kHz audioband but also reveals a substancial reduction (~40dB) in ultrasonic noise with DVD-A software.
.....it's the reduction in ultrasonic rubbish that will ensure the DVD-757Ai is the more consistent performer with different amplifiers."
From everything I have read and heard, the Elite '47Ai sold here in the US is much better than the old '47A. A salesman at my local high-end dealer told me there is no comparison.
