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Discussion in 'Speakers & Subwoofers' started by Sonnie Parker, Feb 7, 2006.
Really good list.
Final proposal sent to Behringer today: http://bfdguide.ws/bse2496
Anyone ever tried the Behringer DSP8024?
I don't think it would be much good for sub equalization. It has 31 preset bands of equalization per channel and only a couple of those will help in the sub range. I believe it only has 3 parametric bands per channel.
I would suppose that would depend on how many you needed though wouldn't it? Do very many people need to use more than 3 bands between 20-80hz?
I've seen quite a few raw graphs... as you might could imagine... several hundred at least. Of all the ones I've encountered, I have never seen one that could be corrected with 3 filters. You might get it somewhat acceptable, but not what I would consider good. Most I've seen took 10-12 filters. I did just setup some filters the other day for another forum member and it only took 8 filters for a really good lookin' corrected response. That is about as low as I've seen in maybe forever. I just can't remember the last time I was able to get it done with only 8 filters, but I suppose there are few all along that would only take that many. I'd much rather save about 75 bucks and get the 1124P, which will give you 12 filters per channel.
I've only ever used 5 filters max, and in the end, I only used 3 for my room and setup. It really depends on how much time and effort you want to spend to get a flat response. Plus, how you are measuring that response is obviously important, and if you're really measuring to the resolution you'd need to really get effective use out of a large number of filters. Plus, I get paranoid about using too many filters in terms of all the phase shifting of the signal that results. Every filter phase shifts the signal to some degree.
True Kevin... most folks that only measure say 1/3 or 1/6 octave frequencies can typically correct their response with less filters, but they are simply correcting what they see... more than likely missing a lot of frequencies that need correcting. That's why I recommend using RoomEQ Wizard with a measurement sweep which consist of a linear sweep from DC to 10hz, followed by a logarithmic sweep up to 400hz, ensuring an accurate measurement from 20hz to 200hz. As far as phase shifts, although it is a genuine possible problem, I'm not hearing any complaints.
Cool... here's a response from Behringer that a forum member got: It appears they appreciate the feedback.
I guess we'll see if they act on it. There's definitely a market there. Although you might have to educate some people why they'd need/want a box like this.
You know... if Behringer would simply broaden their market to include more consumer oriented products and get it out there to the consumer dealers more so like they do the pro audio dealers, the dealers themselves would no doubt help them sell the products. Everytime a dealer sells a sub, he'd probably sell the sub eq. This would help educate the public as well. Think about all the mini PEQ's we are seeing on top quality subs these days. Although they usually won't completely get the job done, they are being offered for a reason.
Bingo: Marketing. And if they could get someone like Secret's (Ed J M) to review it...
If we get it developed... I'll buy an extra unit and send it to Ed and a few others for review. Great idea Kevin! I think it will help to let Behringer know that we users will help them market this unit. As much talk and discussion as there will be about it, it will be a hot product. Plus reviewers will get the word out too.
Kal Rubinson at Stereophile has commented on the BFD, and mentioned that he may review it. I e-mailed and suggested that it would be really cool if JA could do some measurements as well, but Kal said that if it does make it to print, it will be part of his "Music in the Round" column, and will not have any measurements. But I still applaud the fact that the BFD has been mentioned in a Hi-End audio rag like Stereophile. Imagine the thoughts going through the mind of the dude that just blew $5K or more on a non-EQ sub when he finds that someone that spent $750 on a sub + $100 on a BFD is easily outperforming his mega-dollar but poorly set-up show piece! Brian
Hey Sonnie, any developments on this? I wonder if they would also consider doing a multi-channel version to dial in the rest of the HT. My other speakers are getting jealous!
Sonnie, If this product comes to fruition, I will prepurchase one from Behringer, beta-test it against it's main competitor, and sign up as a dealer. At that pricing and functionality, this product will move w/ most every sub and by itself. We all know our local guitar center's are not going ot move these things . Best of luck, Adil
I hope to speak with them next week and find out if they have made in head way on the committing to a design. I think one challenge is going to be finding dealers willing to buy $10,000 in an opening order. Audio/Video dealers are probably only going to be interested in this product and maybe a few mics and mic amps to package with the unit. They are not going to want to stock all the other pro-audio gear that Behringer sells. Behringer would have to make some exceptions. Of coures there are probably dealers out there that would be extremely happy to get $10K worth of these units to sell.
On re-reading my post it sounded like a rant so I have deleted it. Just give me rubber feet and lose my sticky-out ears and I'll be quite happy.
Sonny... it's next week... any news?
Still no news much to speak of Warren. I have spoken with them and they state it is still in the decision making stage. I did ask them to please advise me if they were gonna can the idea and they stated it is by no means canned as of yet. From all I can gather, Behringer takes their time with things like this... so we could be lookin' on down the road, unfortunately.